wow .. so this is "Liberation" ... the american terrorism

[Billo_Really]

Originally posted by GySgt:
The Internet is your mission of humanity? I was thinking along the lines of Operation: Restore Hope (Somalia)...or Operation: Continue Hope (Somalia)....or Operation Fundemental Response (Caribbean Harricane Relief),...or JTF-160 (Cuban/Haitian crisis), or re-building schools in Iraq, or providing security for free military hospitals for civilians in Iraq, or providing security for villages in the HOA against Islamic Arab fanatics, but you wouldn't know anything about that. Selling stories of tragedy by the media to the liberal masses offers you the one sided and isolated incidents of war. Nothing tragic in the HOA. Just a bunch of slaughtered blacks by more Arabs and Marines trying to protect them with only a few companies of German soldiers to help. The first time a Marine (President Bush or a soldier) does something that the liberal masses deem "less than honorable" then I'm sure our media will be all over it for you to condemn.

Thanks for drawing that distinction between Bush and a soldier.

As for being one sided, I'm the only one in this forum that has posted pictures of the good things marines are doing over there. Check out Post #29on the "Liberals Hate America" thread or Post #80 on the "Its Now time For America to Bomb England in the Name of Freedom, Justice, Peace" thread. Show me anyone (from either side of the aisle) who has posted anything like these. Yet I'm one-sided. C'mon.

You really want me to be something I'm not. It ain't gonna happen, wood!

 

[MSgt]

I'm not trying to make you be anything. You've made your own critical comments.

 

[Billo_Really]

Originally posted by GySgt:
I'm not trying to make you be anything. You've made your own critical comments.

And I stand by them and welcome everyone of yours.

 

[jallman]

"The one I'm on right now."

The Internet is your mission of humanity? I was thinking along the lines of Operation: Restore Hope (Somalia)...or Operation: Continue Hope (Somalia)....or Operation Fundemental Response (Caribbean Harricane Relief),...or JTF-160 (Cuban/Haitian crisis), or re-building schools in Iraq, or providing security for free military hospitals for civilians in Iraq, or providing security for villages in the HOA against Islamic Arab fanatics, but you wouldn't know anything about that. Selling stories of tragedy by the media to the liberal masses offers you the one sided and isolated incidents of war.

Well sarge, your keyboard aint exactly an M-16 and your comfortable desk chair aint exactly sitting in a tent in some muslim controlled desert.

 

[MSgt]

Well sarge, your keyboard aint exactly an M-16 and your comfortable desk chair aint exactly sitting in a tent in some muslim controlled desert.


My credentials...

1993 (4 months) Somalia (Humanitarian and Combat Missions)
1993 (2 months) Saudi/Kuwait (Training and Security Missions)
1994 (Two weeks) Haiti (Combat/Protection Mission)
1994 (3 months) Cuba (Humanitarian Missions)
1998 (1 month) Puerto Rico/Cuba/Dominican Republic/Haiti
(Humanitarian Missions)
2002 (1 month) Egypt (Traniing)
2003 (5 months) Iraq (War)
2004 (8 months) Iraq (Combat/Humanitarion/Security Missions)
2005 (2 months) HOA (Communications consultant for security/combat and
humanitarian missions)

 

[jallman]

Well sarge, your keyboard aint exactly an M-16 and your comfortable desk chair aint exactly sitting in a tent in some muslim controlled desert.


My credentials...

1993 (4 months) Somalia (Humanitarian and Combat Missions)
1993 (2 months) Saudi/Kuwait (Training and Security Missions)
1994 (Two weeks) Haiti (Combat/Protection Mission)
1994 (3 months) Cuba (Humanitarian Missions)
1998 (1 month) Puerto Rico/Cuba/Dominican Republic/Haiti
(Humanitarian Missions)
2002 (1 month) Egypt (Traniing)
2003 (5 months) Iraq (War)
2004 (8 months) Iraq (Combat/Humanitarion/Security Missions)
2005 (2 months) HOA (Communications consultant for security/combat and
humanitarian missions)

well with those credentials, I find it amazing you find sparring with bill a worthy pursuit. If you are so proud of those credentials, why arent you out right now pursuing some similar activity?

And I believe the only credentials required for bill to have a dissenting opinion are that he be an American.

 

[MSgt]

I'm tired.


I've just recently executed orders form my Regiment and have been stationed at a higher HQ in Virginia for a break. Depending on events in Iraq, I might be back or in Afghanistan for another go around next year. This unit doesn't deploy though, so I will be a combat replacement.

In the mean time, this break allows me to recover, see my daughters, and finish college.

 

[jallman]

I'm tired.


I've just recently executed orders form my Regiment and have been stationed at a higher HQ in Virginia for a break. Depending on events in Iraq, I might be back or in Afghanistan for another go around next year. This unit doesn't deploy though, so I will be a combat replacement.

In the mean time, this break allows me to recover, see my daughters, and finish college.

Thats awesome...and your compassion for your family and admission that this is a tiring endeavor is a side of you that goes much farther to enhance your case than the needless attacking of those who dissent. Thank you, by the way for the service you are doing.

I hope that you dont take insult from me making my point the way I did.

 

[MSgt]

Thats awesome...and your compassion for your family and admission that this is a tiring endeavor is a side of you that goes much farther to enhance your case than the needless attacking of those who dissent. Thank you, by the way for the service you are doing.

I hope that you dont take insult from me making my point the way I did.


This is a tiring endeavor and I have lost a lot in this one, but finishing Iraq is a must. A freer Middle East, out from under their Islamic oppressions, is in America's interests and in the interests of our civilian's security. Terrorists are bred throughout and they have been doing so for decades.

Only certain comments insult me. Yours just made me have to put out some of my track record. It's something I shy away from in these debates, because people get the wrong impression.

 

[jallman]

Thats awesome...and your compassion for your family and admission that this is a tiring endeavor is a side of you that goes much farther to enhance your case than the needless attacking of those who dissent. Thank you, by the way for the service you are doing.

I hope that you dont take insult from me making my point the way I did.


This is a tiring endeavor and I have lost a lot in this one, but finishing Iraq is a must. A freer Middle East, out from under their Islamic oppressions, is in America's interests and in the interests of our civilian's security. Terrorists are bred throughout and they have been doing so for decades.

Only certain comments insult me. Yours just made me have to put out some of my track record. It's something I shy away from in these debates, because people get the wrong impression.

Thats good that you didnt get insulted because that was not my intention. I dont see anything wrong with putting your record out there, because when you speak FROM that experience, rather than lash out AT your opponent...well I dont know about anyone else, but I am compelled to listen out of respect for what you know first hand. I think it lends an authority to what you say that cant be shut down easily. And more so, because you dont have to rely on it as the basis for your passion.

 

[Billo_Really]

Originally posted by jallman:
Thats good that you didnt get insulted because that was not my intention. I dont see anything wrong with putting your record out there, because when you speak FROM that experience, rather than lash out AT your opponent...well I dont know about anyone else, but I am compelled to listen out of respect for what you know first hand. I think it lends an authority to what you say that cant be shut down easily. And more so, because you dont have to rely on it as the basis for your passion.

Believe it or not, I respect him too. His credentials ARE impressive and nothing to be ashamed of. He's got a lot more out on the table to lose than I do. Which is shows his character is pretty high as well. Despite what I say to him in anger, I have to thank him as well.

Tonight wasn't one of my better nights.

 

[tr1414]

Sarge.... take it easy... I know how you feel but these guys are not worth it. There's just no talking to them, no matter what ..... America is wrong & they are right.

 

[tiktok]

You good ol' boys will have to excuse tik for not being around for a while... Hope you missed me

Now then, had a gander at the last few pages and I saw something about pre-emptive strikes against most mighty of America's foes (sic) Iraq.

It has been asked before and I'm sure it will be asked again but um, when are ya gonna hit Tehran? Oh and Pyongyang would be another one. Them pesky barbarians either have nukes or are pertty darn close to building them.

I for one am feeling awfully safe knowing your Bad Boyz are patrolling the world ready to strike at anyone who might be a threat. Coz ya knows us Europeans all depend on y'all for our safety/civil liberties.

So come on fellahs, do tell... I just been offerred a post for a year in Palestine and it would help me make a decision if I could get some time-frame. I mean who better to ask about threats than you darling boys...

tata

 

[MSgt]

It has been asked before and I'm sure it will be asked again but um, when are ya gonna hit Tehran? Oh and Pyongyang would be another one.

Look past Iraq as being a sole threat. The threat is the entire Middle East and the fanaticism that it's oppression has bred for a long time. If anything, you should be angry at our President half assing this "War on Terror". The longer we wait the worse it will be for the President that does finish this and the generation that has to fight it. Pre-emptavely spreading any form of democracy there will allow them the chance to break from their oppressions and live peacably with everyone else. Some say this can't happen.....the successes of the Kurds in the North and the millions of Shi'ites trying to build a peaceful society would prove otherwise. The Sunni Arab is the problem. Even in Africa, their brand of life style causes the death of anyone that doesn't subscribe to their brand of Islam.

Iran..? Let's see what the high and mighty EU, UN and NATO do about that. If history has taught us anything...they will probably debate and appease about it until Iran develops their nukes and then we will enter the Cold War part II. Of course, if America just decides to pre-emptively strike their facilities, we'll just be "war mongers" out to destroy the world...right? Either way, much like Kosovo, America will be the one that deals with it in the end.

North Korea..? A bit late for that isn't it? China has embraced them and now they are having to deal with them. Much like the House of Saud - they encouraged and embraced their Islamic martyrs throughout the Middle East and now they are chasing them down in their own country. Poetic Justice.

We've been patrolling the world since after WWII. Isolationalism proved not to work for us since we continued to come half way around the world and send hundreds of thousands of Americans to their deaths to save the day. If it wasn't for our patrolling the world, we would have seen a WWIII. We fought and held back the flow of Communism on battle grounds such as Vietnam and Korea. Say what you want...but Communism was deafeated because it's need to spread was squashed. Who knows...maybe our presence in Europe is what kept it behind the Berlin Wall. China sits alone and will soon enough fall apart to. Except with them it will come because of their youth that want a western civilization.

 

[saveChief]

GySgt, I just want to say that you have a lot to be proud for and that you obviously have a much more personal connection with this conflict than any of the rest of us. But that doesn't really give you the right to talk down on people who differ in opinion. You get on your soapbox and proclaim billo as an "american hater" and a "Lib". My friend are you so simply saying that because, within his given rights under the first amendment, that he is stating his disagreement with the war on an internet forum, with no further implications than to incite you to anger, that he is a traitor? I think you are getting ahead of yourself. You write very well and are obviously a highly educated man. But you do yourself slander and appear more narrowminded when you completely dismiss his arguments because you disagree with their morality.

I happen to agree with you about the soldier issue. I posted earlier saying that I sympathize with the soldier's position; that we cannot put ourselves in his position and impose our untempered mindstate into his shoes. That his situation deserves a little consideration before we pass judgement on his actions. The LA Riots of 1992 began after only partial footage was shown of the arrest of Rodney King. In fact, it was he who initially attacked the officers. Now I am not necessarily condoning either action; I am merely pointing out that there are sometimes discrepancies between what is shown on videotape and what the entire story is.
However the case may be, finding personal bias against someone who is of different political inclination turns this debate into little more than a party "bash-fest". Just because I may lean slightly to the left doesn't mean that I can't sympathize with conservative views. I just want to clear that up.

 

[cnredd]

GySgt, I just want to say that you have a lot to be proud for and that you obviously have a much more personal connection with this conflict than any of the rest of us. But that doesn't really give you the right to talk down on people who differ in opinion. You get on your soapbox and proclaim billo as an "american hater" and a "Lib". My friend are you so simply saying that because, within his given rights under the first amendment, that he is stating his disagreement with the war on an internet forum, with no further implications than to incite you to anger, that he is a traitor? I think you are getting ahead of yourself. You write very well and are obviously a highly educated man. But you do yourself slander and appear more narrowminded when you completely dismiss his arguments because you disagree with their morality.

Anybody catch this trick?

One person is "within his rights"...but the other is not to react to them...

Liberal Rule #1)I have a right to speak my piece....so shut up!

 

[saveChief]

Way to completely miss the whole point of my post. That's so typical of people like you to disregard the message and just split hairs looking for minor *questionable* contradictions.

I could have easily paraphrased "But that doesn't really give you the right to talk down on people"
as "That doesn't make you better/more correct than other people"

but okay I guess you really didn't care what I had to say in the first place. Next.

 

[VTA]

could have easily paraphrased "But that doesn't really give you the right to talk down on people"
as "That doesn't make you better/more correct than other people"

They're actually two very different statements with two different meanings.

One is stating an allowance or a lack of, the other is refuting an assumed ascertation.

If freedom of speech is to be expected/accepted wholly, then rebuttal to a suggestion can not be restricted by conditions.

 

[Billo_Really]

Originally posted by VTA:
If freedom of speech is to be expected/accepted wholly, then rebuttal to a suggestion can not be restricted by conditions.

Definately words to live by. I wish more people would understand this very basic point.

 

[teacher]

Come on Gunny. Do you see the Jews letting Iran complete that nuclear power plant?

 

[teacher]

Tonight wasn't one of my better nights.

Oh, like your other nights go so well.....

 

[teacher]

It has been asked before and I'm sure it will be asked again but um, when are ya gonna hit Tehran?

When their nuclear power plant is almost finished. And then just the plant. Might even loan the Jews a F-117 for that little mission. Get with the program here tiktok. Statements like that tell me you don't see the big picture here.

 

[teacher]

Don't compare this with WWII. It's not the same. That was a just war. That was a war that needed America to win. And that was a war that would not have been won without us. We had to fight that one. Hitler and Tojo and Mussollini were threats to the entire world. They were not a country that barely has running water and electricity.

Some questions for you Billo. You know that Islamic fanatics bombed the WTC BEFORE we invaded Iraq. So don't use the Gulf war as an excuse. As stated by Osama and many like him we will be targeted by terrorists no matter what we do. Oh, excuse me. If we withdraw support from Israel and ALL of us convert to Islam then things will be ok. The last go around was planes into buildings. Sooner or late these folks will get nukes.

1.Do you think they won't nuke Israel or NYC given the opportunity?

I understand your rants about the American public being misled about the stated reasons for invading Iraq. The reasons stated I feel are not the true reasons. Valid reasons but not the main reason. Like Gunny and I and others have stated often on this forum. This war is about spreading Democracy in a violent region. It's about changing the hearts and minds of these people. You do that by giving them freedom and access to ALL news and information. By freeing their women. I also understand your "I hate Bush the liar" mantra. Your a lib. It's your job. Loyal opposition and all that crap. But Billo, what would you propose we do about the INEVITABLE mushroom cloud that will one day grace our shores if nothing is done about this Islamic fanatic problem. You libs are losing elections because you naysay and put down what the other party is doing but you never offer a plan of your own. Don't go saying the "diplomatic" BS or "inspection" BS. Been there done that. The UN has been proven ineffective at the least and for sure corrupt. This is your big chance to be the guy on the left to give us something besides "Bush lied". Step up to the plate and take a swing at the big pitch Billo. Do what all your liberal brethren can't. Give us another plan.

 

[tiktok]

When their nuclear power plant is almost finished. And then just the plant. Might even loan the Jews a F-117 for that little mission. Get with the program here tiktok. Statements like that tell me you don't see the big picture here.

Ouch! Shucks Teach... not seein' the big pic... who me??? LOL matey boy. I just need to know cozza work (read b4 ya post teach). I'm expecting an F sommat to be launched any day now...

So ya reckon the Israeli pilots will be able to get passed the new Russian anti-aircraft missiles on the way?

Will make great TV if they get shot down trying to take out Iranian plants.

Scuze me from your sermon teach, just gettin' some popcorn mate.

 

[akyron]

If we withdraw support from Israel and ALL of us convert to Islam then things will be ok.

Giving up is the liberal plan for world peace teach.

Smoke the Jews, Unbelievers, and the Christians and now the world will be safe for Mohammed's underaged wife.

Grown women have a grand old time in the new Islamic world too.

Tabari IX:113 “Allah permits you to shut them in separate rooms and to beat them, but not severely. If they abstain, they have the right to food and clothing. Treat women well for they are like domestic animals and they possess nothing themselves. Allah has made the enjoyment of their bodies lawful in his Qur’an.”


Thank you for personally fighting for American Freedoms Gunny. It is not said often enough and your insightful words carry much weight due to your firsthand experiences.