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Woman Fired For AAR Bumper Sticker

H

hipsterdufus

I heard this story on AAR the other day. Fired for a bumper sticker.

A San Diego County woman is suing her former employer, accusing her manager of firing her on the spot when she saw the woman's car had a bumper sticker advertising a progressive talk radio station. […]

In a civil suit filed at the county courthouse in Vista, Linda Laroca is targeting both her former manager, Beverly Fath, and the company she briefly worked for last year, Advantage Sales and Marketing, Inc. […]

The California labor code prohibits employers from controlling or directing the political activities of employees.

According to Laroca's suit, the bumper sticker in question read only: "1360 Air America Progressive Talk Radio." […]

In her Feb. 21 claim, Laroca asserts that on Oct. 8, three weeks after she started working for the marketing company, Fath called her on a Saturday and requested they meet at a nearby grocery store parking lot so Laroca could pass on some documents Fath needed.

During the brief encounter, Laroca charges, the manager pointed to the bumper sticker ---- the only one on Laroca's car ---- and remarked that it was a new sticker and called it "that Al Franken left-wing radical radio station."

Laroca alleges in her suit that Fath then told her, "The country is on a high state of alert. For all I know, you could be al-Qaida."

A stunned Laroca laughed nervously at the statement, the suit alleges, and then was dealt "the final blow" when Fath fired her on the spot.
http://www.alternet.org/blogs/themix/33344/
 

Carl

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hipsterdufus said:
I heard this story on AAR the other day. Fired for a bumper sticker.
The California labor code prohibits employers from controlling or directing the political activities of employees.
He apparently did not attempt to control or direct her activities. She is free to act as she chooses, just not be employed at that company.

Most states are "at will" with regard to employment, you can be fired for no reason at all. Not sure if that's the case in California, but have no reason to think otherwise. I would have done the exact same thing, without an ounce of shame.

As a private employer, I see no reason to employ those who are sympathetic to anti-capitalist, anti-corporate philosophies.
 
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Willoughby

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He apparently did not attempt to control or direct her activities. She is free to act as she chooses, just not be employed at that company.

Most states are "at will" with regard to employment, you can be fired for no reason at all. Not sure if that's the case in California, but have no reason to think otherwise.
you shouldn't be able to fire someone just because you don't like their politics!
 

Carl

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Willoughby said:
you shouldn't be able to fire someone just because you don't like their politics!
You can fire someone because you don't like their hairdo in most states. You don't need a reason to fire someone.

There's no law in most states that compels you to pay wages to people who oppose your values. You're an "at will" employer. It's your company. You can fire people because they smoke cigarettes, if you want.
 

Willoughby

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You can fire someone because you don't like their hairdo in most states. You don't need a reason to fire someone.

There's no law in most states that compels you to pay wages to people who oppose your values. You're an "at will" employer. It's your company.
i find that very strange. do you not have anything like employment tribunals?
 

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Willoughby said:
i find that very strange. do you not have anything like employment tribunals?
I don't know about New York, I'm just passing through on my way back to Florida. But you certainy don't need anything of the sort there. I was fired for being a smoker.

The company I was at was run by radical left wingers, and they were on a big health kick. Got caught smoking, got fired the same day.
 

Willoughby

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I
don't know about New York, I'm just passing through on my way back to Florida. But you certainy don't need anything of the sort there. I was fired for being a smoker.
thats crazy..so basically there is no job security
 

Carl

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Willoughby said:
I
thats crazy..so basically there is no job security
My friend, the entire concept of "security" is an illusion. If you're valuable enough to your employer, they won't fire you if you steal a computer. And that's what it all truly boils down to.
 

Willoughby

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so you can get fired for being gay?
 

Carl

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Willoughby said:
so you can get fired for being gay?
Well, no. Gays, minorities, and to some extent women have additional protections that the majority lack. As a hetero, white male I don't qualify for special protections.

Any security I have must come exclusively from my superior abilities as an employee. Needless to say, I don't put any "Rush Limbaugh" stickers on my car, just out of minimal prudence.
 
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Willoughby

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Any security I have must come exclusively from my superior abilities as an employee. Needless to say, I don't put any "Rush Limbaugh" stickers on my car, just out of minimal prudence
see in the UK i think from what you are saying that we have much better employment laws. It is very hard to sack someone for no real reason in this country
 

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Willoughby said:
It is very hard to sack someone for no real reason in this country
Well, that's not necessarily a good thing for your country as a whole. And it might explain part of why Americans have so much higher productivity than other nation's workers.

For instance here in America, it's not uncommon for an employer to fire the lowest producing 10% of his workforce every year, and replace them. That way you are always bringing in new blood, and ditching the deadwood.

The result of that practice is that you cull the slackers, your company makes better profits, you can pay the good people more, and the nation as a whole generates more wealth. Which is good for everyone, even the slackers that got fired.

Nobody has a right to a job.
 

Willoughby

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Well, that's not necessarily a good thing for your country as a whole. And it might explain part of why Americans have so much higher productivity than other nation's workers.

For instance here in America, it's not uncommon for an employer to fire the lowest producing 10% of his workforce every year, and replace them. That way you are always bringing in new blood, and ditching the deadwood.

The result of that practice is that you cull the slackers, your company makes better profits, you can pay the good people more, and the nation as a whole generates more wealth. Which is good for everyone, even the slackers that got fired.

Nobody has a right to a job.
I completly understand that. It is right for an employer to fight the bottom 10% producing of his/her workforce but that i feel is on resonable grounds..they are not pulling their weight. But i think it is harsh to fight someone for a bumpersticker and i don't think you would be allowed to get away with it in the UK
 

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Willoughby said:
But i think it is harsh to fight someone for a bumpersticker and i don't think you would be allowed to get away with it in the UK
It's most certainly harsh, no doubt. I thought it was harsh when they fired me for smoking, and I was in the top 5% of billing engineers. But I found new employment, and in the long run it was better not to be with those Birkenstock wearing tofu eaters anyway.
 

Blue Collar Joe

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Willoughby said:
you shouldn't be able to fire someone just because you don't like their politics!

Remember also that this was posted by a left leaning person, and we have one side only of the story. I would be fairly certain that there is a lot more to this story than what is being said.
Conservatives don't give a rat's arse what someonesn politics are if they are a good worker. If they aren't, a conservative would fire their mother.
 

Stinger

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Willoughby said:
you shouldn't be able to fire someone just because you don't like their politics!
What isn't doclosed is whether she is using her car in the course of business where customers might see the bumper sticker. I drive a company car and we are not allowed to put any polical stickers, or for that matter anything the could possibly be controversial (a "War Eagale" or "Roll Tide").

If part of her employment agreement was that she would supply a car for use during her business activities then the employer can certainly restrict what political messages might be displayed during those activities.

She should have been warned first, but for some reason I doubt the web-page is giving the total picture nor the woman fired telling it exactly as it happened. If so the employer is just a looney and they exist on both sides of the political spectrum.
 
H

hipsterdufus

Carl said:
He apparently did not attempt to control or direct her activities. She is free to act as she chooses, just not be employed at that company.

Most states are "at will" with regard to employment, you can be fired for no reason at all. Not sure if that's the case in California, but have no reason to think otherwise. I would have done the exact same thing, without an ounce of shame.

As a private employer, I see no reason to employ those who are sympathetic to anti-capitalist, anti-corporate philosophies.
Whether AAR is sympathetic to anti-capitalist, anti-corporate philosphies is a debate for another day. Of course AAR is a capitalist corporation themselves, so using your line of reasoning, they would be against their own success? :confused:

There are three major exceptions to "Employment at Will"

1. Public Policy Exception
2. Implied Contract Exception
3. Covenant of Good Faith Exception

California adheres to all three exceptions. The woman's case against her employer will probably focus on the Covenant of Good Faith Exception.This exception is more commonly know as "just cause", and clearly an AAR bumper sticker is not just cause for termination.
 
H

hipsterdufus

Blue Collar Joe said:
Conservatives don't give a rat's arse what someonesn politics are if they are a good worker. If they aren't, a conservative would fire their mother.
If only that were true with the current administration!
 

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Willoughby said:
you shouldn't be able to fire someone just because you don't like their politics!

Why not? Its his company, he should be able to fire or hire anyone he likes......
 

cnredd

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Does anyone remember Michelle Zipp?...The Playgirl editor fired for being a Republican?...
 

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cnredd said:
Does anyone remember Michelle Zipp?...The Playgirl editor fired for being a Republican?...
No, but I'm not surprised you do!:2wave:
 

cnredd

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Deegan said:
No, but I'm not surprised you do!:2wave:
I used reason.com partly because they are pretty middle-of the road...but more because the original report from drudge doesn't work...

There was an article from Zipp...

PLAYGIRL EDITOR-IN-CHIEF OUTS HERSELF -- AS REPUBLICAN Mon Mar 07 2005 19:42:14 ET
When it comes to sex and politics, Democrats are the more liberal, right? Not so fast. Playgirl editor-in-chief Michele Zipp explores "down and dirty" politics and examines sexuality on both sides of the aisle. In the process she comes to a realization about herself and reveals for the first time she's now a Republican....

How could a member of the media who produces adult entertainment for women possibly side with conservatives from the red states? Zipp spells it out [in the April issue]. "Those on the right are presumed to be all about power and greed--two really sexy traits in the bedroom. They want it, they want it now, and they'll do anything to get it. And I'm not talking about some pansy-assed victory, I'm talking about full on jackpot, satisfaction for all."

"The Democrats of the Sixties were all about making love and not war while a war-loving Republican is a man who would fight, bleed, sacrifice, and die for his country. Could you imagine what that very same man would do for his wife in the bedroom?" asks Zipp....
Two weeks later, they gave her the heave-ho...

Zipp Stripped at Playgirl; Female Nudie Mag No Place for a Bush Lover

Drudge reports that Playgirl Editor Michele Zipp has gotten bounced for outing herself as a Bush voter. He repros her email:

"Hello Drudge,
"After your coverage of my article about coming out and voting Republican, I did receive many letters of support from fellow Republican voters, but it was not without repercussions. Criticism from the liberal left ensued. A few days after the onslaught of liberal backlash, I was released from my duties at Playgirl magazine.

"After underlings expressed their disinterest of working for an outed Republican editor, I have a strong suspicion that my position was no longer valued by Playgirl executives. I also received a phone call from a leading official from Playgirl magazine, in which he stated with a laugh, "I wouldn't have hired you if I knew you were a Republican.

"I just wanted to let you know of the fear the liberal left has about a woman with power possessing Republican views."
 

Deegan

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cnredd said:
I used reason.com partly because they are pretty middle-of the road...but more because the original report from drudge doesn't work...

There was an article from Zipp...



Two weeks later, they gave her the heave-ho...
Did that go over your head, or are you just dodging my zing?
 

cnredd

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Deegan said:
Did that go over your head, or are you just dodging my zing?
Absolutlely not!...It's a "zing" that has been documented before by others on this forum...

galenrox said:
Cnredd catches me on crap all of the time, I think he browses around for the sole purpose on finding people who say things that aren't true just to call them out, but yeah, he's one of the few who I've had to say "Damn, I was wrong" to, and I hate him for it.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/showpost.php?p=136827&postcount=32

mixedmedia said:
:rofl Do you have a photographic memory for everything posted here, cnredd?

Point taken.

but mine were really funny......
http://www.debatepolitics.com/showpost.php?p=123176&postcount=16


I have a knack for remembering things...What can I say?...:cool:

Forum members should consider it a compliment...This should prove that I pay attention to what's being written...


BTW - Notice the irony of how I agree with you about me remembering things by remembering other posts of people telling me how I remember things?...:2wave:
 
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Carl said:
You can fire someone because you don't like their hairdo in most states. You don't need a reason to fire someone.

There's no law in most states that compels you to pay wages to people who oppose your values. You're an "at will" employer. It's your company. You can fire people because they smoke cigarettes, if you want.
This is true. One could attempt to sue for wrongful termination, but such suits are difficult to prove in a US court of law. It is also true, that threatening an employee's job is an excellent way of directing or controlling their political activity. If a over-priced, greedy, expensive lawyer was involved (one in which the average employee cannot afford), perhaps he could prove that this was an attempt to violate this woman's First Amendment rights, but again, wrongful termination is difficult to PROVE in court but not so difficult to COMMIT in the work place. The only that matters is what you can prove in the courtroom. If you have enough money to feed the greed machine, you would be amazed at what a person can do in the courtroom or in society.
 
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