• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Will silence one day be considered a "micro-aggression"?

SDET

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
May 1, 2015
Messages
7,802
Reaction score
1,609
Location
Texas
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Society has gone so nuts with "political correctness" that in the office, I just learn to distrust people. I program my desk phone to transfer to my cell, then take all calls to the conference room. Nearly all face-to-face conversations happen behind a closed GLASS door; a solid door invites harassment accusations. What does that mean for others? It means you're NOT going to get mentored if I smell the slightest whiff that you have any interest in political correctness. If I'm asked to mentor what I consider a "high risk" person, they get code snippets and terse email instructions. I prefer to mentor others as if they were my son, but "political correctness" means that I can't do that with just anyone. The way I figure it is that you get all of me, prejudices and all or you get none of me. If you want to learn to be a Software Architect, you'll tolerate all of me. You see, my mom was a what today would be thought of as a full-fledged racist. She would tell you she wasn't a racist because she wasn't a card-carrying member of the Ku Klux Klan the way HER father was. You see, if you're TRULY tolerant, you would be tolerant of my mother and grandfather. Being tolerant doesn't mean you have to agree with them.

There so much "political correctness" going around these days, that no one could keep track of it all even if they wanted to. It's just more trouble than it's worth.
 

Vox

Voice and Wisdom of God
DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 13, 2016
Messages
6,765
Reaction score
954
Location
Land of Logic
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Centrist
Yes, it probably already IS considered a micro aggression.

Because, you know.......they can read your mind and thus they know you are hiding your profound inner evil from them.

Of course, they can't abide that and they'll do a giant and overt aggression toward you.

:mrgreen:
 

Patrickt

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 28, 2006
Messages
3,590
Reaction score
1,091
Location
Oaxaca, Mexico
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
Society has gone so nuts with "political correctness" that in the office, I just learn to distrust people. I program my desk phone to transfer to my cell, then take all calls to the conference room. Nearly all face-to-face conversations happen behind a closed GLASS door; a solid door invites harassment accusations. What does that mean for others? It means you're NOT going to get mentored if I smell the slightest whiff that you have any interest in political correctness. If I'm asked to mentor what I consider a "high risk" person, they get code snippets and terse email instructions. I prefer to mentor others as if they were my son, but "political correctness" means that I can't do that with just anyone. The way I figure it is that you get all of me, prejudices and all or you get none of me. If you want to learn to be a Software Architect, you'll tolerate all of me. You see, my mom was a what today would be thought of as a full-fledged racist. She would tell you she wasn't a racist because she wasn't a card-carrying member of the Ku Klux Klan the way HER father was. You see, if you're TRULY tolerant, you would be tolerant of my mother and grandfather. Being tolerant doesn't mean you have to agree with them.

There so much "political correctness" going around these days, that no one could keep track of it all even if they wanted to. It's just more trouble than it's worth.

Maybe it already is. When I was working I was called to the boss' office and he said, "Joe Blow filed a complaint that you passed him in the hall and didn't say hello."
"When?"
"This morning."
"I don't remembe seeing him."
"He says he walked past you and you didn't say hello because he's a minority."
"Bull****. Did he speak to me?"
"No."

I didn't see him and I didn't snub him but for the next month, every time I saw him, even if he was a block away or on his way to a meeting I would jump up and down, wave both arms and shout, "Hello."
 

SDET

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
May 1, 2015
Messages
7,802
Reaction score
1,609
Location
Texas
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Maybe it already is. When I was working I was called to the boss' office and he said, "Joe Blow filed a complaint that you passed him in the hall and didn't say hello."
"When?"
"This morning."
"I don't remembe seeing him."
"He says he walked past you and you didn't say hello because he's a minority."
"Bull****. Did he speak to me?"
"No."

I didn't see him and I didn't snub him but for the next month, every time I saw him, even if he was a block away or on his way to a meeting I would jump up and down, wave both arms and shout, "Hello."

I find the closer one gets to retirement, the larger the temptation to do things like that.
 

Vox

Voice and Wisdom of God
DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 13, 2016
Messages
6,765
Reaction score
954
Location
Land of Logic
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Centrist
Maybe it already is. When I was working I was called to the boss' office and he said, "Joe Blow filed a complaint that you passed him in the hall and didn't say hello."
"When?"
"This morning."
"I don't remembe seeing him."
"He says he walked past you and you didn't say hello because he's a minority."
"Bull****. Did he speak to me?"
"No."

I didn't see him and I didn't snub him but for the next month, every time I saw him, even if he was a block away or on his way to a meeting I would jump up and down, wave both arms and shout, "Hello."

Have you read Ellison's "Invisible Man?"

Just an ironic connection here.
 

MickeyW

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 10, 2015
Messages
14,012
Reaction score
3,439
Location
Southern Oregon
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
Society has gone so nuts with "political correctness" that in the office, I just learn to distrust people. I program my desk phone to transfer to my cell, then take all calls to the conference room. Nearly all face-to-face conversations happen behind a closed GLASS door; a solid door invites harassment accusations. What does that mean for others? It means you're NOT going to get mentored if I smell the slightest whiff that you have any interest in political correctness. If I'm asked to mentor what I consider a "high risk" person, they get code snippets and terse email instructions. I prefer to mentor others as if they were my son, but "political correctness" means that I can't do that with just anyone. The way I figure it is that you get all of me, prejudices and all or you get none of me. If you want to learn to be a Software Architect, you'll tolerate all of me. You see, my mom was a what today would be thought of as a full-fledged racist. She would tell you she wasn't a racist because she wasn't a card-carrying member of the Ku Klux Klan the way HER father was. You see, if you're TRULY tolerant, you would be tolerant of my mother and grandfather. Being tolerant doesn't mean you have to agree with them.

There so much "political correctness" going around these days, that no one could keep track of it all even if they wanted to. It's just more trouble than it's worth.

Fully agree.

Maybe it already is. When I was working I was called to the boss' office and he said, "Joe Blow filed a complaint that you passed him in the hall and didn't say hello."
"When?"
"This morning."
"I don't remember seeing him."
"He says he walked past you and you didn't say hello because he's a minority."
"Bull****. Did he speak to me?"
"No."

I didn't see him and I didn't snub him but for the next month, every time I saw him, even if he was a block away or on his way to a meeting I would jump up and down, wave both arms and shout, "Hello."

I'd probably flip him the bird. Thin skinned racist, are not a good thing. It goes both ways too.

I find the closer one gets to retirement, the larger the temptation to do things like that.

Yes indeed. Sure happy to be semi retired and my own boss. I just have to watch what I say sometimes when I'm teaching.
 

GhostlyJoe

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 20, 2009
Messages
4,733
Reaction score
2,439
Location
here
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Liberal
Society has gone so nuts with "political correctness" that in the office, I just learn to distrust people. I program my desk phone to transfer to my cell, then take all calls to the conference room. Nearly all face-to-face conversations happen behind a closed GLASS door; a solid door invites harassment accusations. What does that mean for others? It means you're NOT going to get mentored if I smell the slightest whiff that you have any interest in political correctness. If I'm asked to mentor what I consider a "high risk" person, they get code snippets and terse email instructions. I prefer to mentor others as if they were my son, but "political correctness" means that I can't do that with just anyone. The way I figure it is that you get all of me, prejudices and all or you get none of me. If you want to learn to be a Software Architect, you'll tolerate all of me. You see, my mom was a what today would be thought of as a full-fledged racist. She would tell you she wasn't a racist because she wasn't a card-carrying member of the Ku Klux Klan the way HER father was. You see, if you're TRULY tolerant, you would be tolerant of my mother and grandfather. Being tolerant doesn't mean you have to agree with them.

There so much "political correctness" going around these days, that no one could keep track of it all even if they wanted to. It's just more trouble than it's worth.

So you refuse to collaborate with peers or forward the interests of your company based on your political perceptions. So, not only are you a terrible at your job but you act like a jerk to boot. Congrats!
 

SDET

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
May 1, 2015
Messages
7,802
Reaction score
1,609
Location
Texas
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
So you refuse to collaborate with peers or forward the interests of your company based on your political perceptions. So, not only are you a terrible at your job but you act like a jerk to boot. Congrats!

That's a nice shot in the dark without seeing deliverables: Swing and a miss!
 

GhostlyJoe

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 20, 2009
Messages
4,733
Reaction score
2,439
Location
here
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Liberal
The irony is, in the OP, you're the one demanding "political correctness." Your essentially requiring that others adhere to your set of ideals or else you won't play nice. You're demanding tolerance, but displaying intolerance.
 

Kobie

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 17, 2013
Messages
48,281
Reaction score
25,273
Location
Western NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Maybe it already is. When I was working I was called to the boss' office and he said, "Joe Blow filed a complaint that you passed him in the hall and didn't say hello."
"When?"
"This morning."
"I don't remembe seeing him."
"He says he walked past you and you didn't say hello because he's a minority."
"Bull****. Did he speak to me?"
"No."

I didn't see him and I didn't snub him but for the next month, every time I saw him, even if he was a block away or on his way to a meeting I would jump up and down, wave both arms and shout, "Hello."

I buy precisely zero percent of that story.
 

Moot

DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 11, 2006
Messages
40,426
Reaction score
15,333
Location
Utah
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
That's a nice shot in the dark without seeing deliverables: Swing and a miss!

Do you always interject your own political correctness into your job?
 

Patrickt

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 28, 2006
Messages
3,590
Reaction score
1,091
Location
Oaxaca, Mexico
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
The irony is, in the OP, you're the one demanding "political correctness." Your essentially requiring that others adhere to your set of ideals or else you won't play nice. You're demanding tolerance, but displaying intolerance.

Sorry, Ghost, but political correctness has nothing to do with tolerance and is, in fact, the exact opposite. Are the politically correct being tolerant when they storm a stage at a university to prevent an invited speaker from speaking?

I was in a meeting and suddenly people were shouting angrily. I looked around to see what was happening and realized they were shouting at me. I'd used a racial slur. I'd said something about "Orientals". None of the people screaming were anything other than lily-white liberals. That is your politically correct tolerance.

I attended a mandatory three-day diversity training session. As it was ending we were asked to all say what we were taking away with us. When it was my turn I held up a piece of paper and said, "My list of who it's okay to hate." I started reading the list and while the other students were grinning the tolerant instructors were screaming.

Of course, Jews headed the list. It was not only okay to hate Jews it was practically mandatory. When I read fundamentalist Christians off my list one of the instructoers screamed, "They want to kill me so you're damned right I hate them."

I've watched you sitting during our breaks chatting with a fundamentalist Christian and he not only wasn't trying to kill you but you seemed to get along fine."
"Who? Who was it?"
"I'm not outing him." Everyone laughed.

No, political correctness is the antithesis of tolerance, courtesy, or polite behavior.
 

SDET

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
May 1, 2015
Messages
7,802
Reaction score
1,609
Location
Texas
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
The irony is, in the OP, you're the one demanding "political correctness." Your essentially requiring that others adhere to your set of ideals or else you won't play nice. You're demanding tolerance, but displaying intolerance.

But you see, I never claimed to be "tolerant". Whoever you are, don't urinate in my soup or lead me to believe there's a good chance you will urinate in my soup and we will get along just fine. I won't accept being put in a position where I must watch every word that comes out of my mouth, or else I will just stop talking to you. If that causes you to miss out on needed information, tough.
 

KevinKohler

DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 4, 2011
Messages
25,079
Reaction score
11,918
Location
CT
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I buy precisely zero percent of that story.

I buy it, because I've also seen it happen to people. Reprimanded for failure to say hello, or some such. It happens a lot, I'll wager.
 

GhostlyJoe

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 20, 2009
Messages
4,733
Reaction score
2,439
Location
here
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Liberal
But you see, I never claimed to be "tolerant". Whoever you are, don't urinate in my soup or lead me to believe there's a good chance you will urinate in my soup and we will get along just fine. I won't accept being put in a position where I must watch every word that comes out of my mouth, or else I will just stop talking to you. If that causes you to miss out on needed information, tough.

What you're missing is that you're putting other people in that position. The problem with "PC culture" is shutting down dialogue by being too-easily offended. That happens across the political spectrum.
 

GhostlyJoe

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 20, 2009
Messages
4,733
Reaction score
2,439
Location
here
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Liberal
Sorry, Ghost, but political correctness has nothing to do with tolerance and is, in fact, the exact opposite. Are the politically correct being tolerant when they storm a stage at a university to prevent an invited speaker from speaking?

I was in a meeting and suddenly people were shouting angrily. I looked around to see what was happening and realized they were shouting at me. I'd used a racial slur. I'd said something about "Orientals". None of the people screaming were anything other than lily-white liberals. That is your politically correct tolerance.

I attended a mandatory three-day diversity training session. As it was ending we were asked to all say what we were taking away with us. When it was my turn I held up a piece of paper and said, "My list of who it's okay to hate." I started reading the list and while the other students were grinning the tolerant instructors were screaming.

Of course, Jews headed the list. It was not only okay to hate Jews it was practically mandatory. When I read fundamentalist Christians off my list one of the instructoers screamed, "They want to kill me so you're damned right I hate them."

I've watched you sitting during our breaks chatting with a fundamentalist Christian and he not only wasn't trying to kill you but you seemed to get along fine."
"Who? Who was it?"
"I'm not outing him." Everyone laughed.

No, political correctness is the antithesis of tolerance, courtesy, or polite behavior.

I've witnessed similar behavior to what you're describing. I saw a guy kicked out of a college course for using the word "blacks." The professor got very offended and threw him out. He obviously had a different viewpoint from her, and that was apparent from previous exchanges, but he was actually intellectually curious and not just being difficult. I was a journalism student, and "black" was the preferred term in our writing (AP style). From my point of view, he was just trying to make his point. He wasn't intending a slur or to give offense, but he crossed some invisible and quite arbitrary language barrier, and I noted the irony then. She was offended by his perceived intolerance, but it was actually her who was being intolerant and shutting down open dialogue, and she used her position of authority to punish him for this imagined transgression.

I see that same irony in the OP's story. People of all types can behave like intolerant jerks, sometimes.

She was a smart woman, but I didn't care for her as a professor. I remember she identified herself to the class as a "third-generation Jewish immigrant." She was lily white, but she wanted to cast herself as a minority. I wasn't buying it, and neither was this other guy. The problem was, he wasn't really that smart, and he kept stumbling into her rhetorical traps. In that same course, a guest speaker suggested that white men are inherently intolerant by virtue of just being white men and, thus, not having shared in the minority experience. I wrote a paper pointing out the absurdity of that stance, noting that no one can live in another's skin, and so, by extension of her logic, no one is capable of tolerance or empathy. I expected to get lambasted, but, oddly enough, I got an A.

That was the most traditionally "PC" course I took, and I absolutely hated it. But what I learned from her was that it wasn't her beliefs that made her intolerant. In fact, she was open to having her point-of-view challenged. What triggered her was the challenge to her authority; it was because he wouldn't let her control the conversation.

The problem isn't "political correctness." That, at its core, is really just a plea for empathy. The real problem is when people employ "PC" speech codes as a means of control. It's essentially just shaming, and like all shaming, it's a power play.
 

d0gbreath

Yellow Dog Democrat
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Messages
16,270
Reaction score
5,318
Location
There's my hat.
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Communist
On the other hand I've seen people suddenly get PC when introduced to mixed company. It's called ' not getting your ass kicked' so you might as well learn it In case you find that you need it some day.

But no, it should never be forced on anyone.
 
Top Bottom