Will Obamacare destroy jobs?

[lolabird]

Really? You think its 'fair' that insurance companies raise their rates because they have to provide for irresponsible people that didnt bother to get themselves covered until AFTER they had a problem?

Wow. Im SO not shocked.

It's called sarcasm.

 

[lolabird]

You are the one telling the 'sob story'. But you forgot to mention the dog got run over by a train. :wink:

Picking one example of many different circumstances does not create a true picture of the situation.

A good portion of the 'uninsured' are young adults who ARE earning above the poverty line, who have chosen to not spend any part of their income on insurance individually or through and employer's program.

The dog's life was saved by the local animal shelter, whose biggest donor is Oprah.

 

[lolabird]

Perhaps she should have kept her legs closed and not had kids? Or if she couldn't help herself, give those kids up for adoption or abort them?

Incest does not allow the victim to keep their legs closed.

 

[GottaGo]

But you do believe that people are forced into bankruptcy because of medical bills?

They CHOOSE bankruptcy to not have to pay bills they incurred.

 

[CRUE CAB]

Didnt we go through this fearmonger a couple of years back? Oh yeah well I guess we are doing it again!! Let the boogeymen come out of the wood work! Well if companies want to play that game it is gonna be a loser. Check me if I am wrong here but if a company doesnt want a healthy workforce then one they should'nt be in business,and two why would anyone want to work for them.

Why? How about we need jobs to survive. And no companies dont and shouldnt care about your health. Its your responsibility.

 

[CRUE CAB]

They CHOOSE bankruptcy to not have to pay bills they incurred.

Really? So if you make a combined 100K and your child is injured, or falls ill.
Bills are huge and even if you have insurance it only covers so much.
What do you do? Not buy food? Not buy gas? Not buy clothes? Basically end your life if you end up with a few hundred thousand dollars in med bills?

 

[CRUE CAB]

But you do believe that people are forced into bankruptcy because of medical bills?

I have seen it.

 

[ttwtt78640]

John Schnatter has said he will cut employee's hours in order to avoid having to pay their insurance coverage. Now that's the definition of altruism.

No, that is a sound business decision that caused his company to prosper. Since when did the federal gov't acquire the right to dictate (mandate) that employers must provide a "free" benefit to employees?

When you are taxed based upon how (or upon who) you did not later spend that income that is not related to the 16th amendment power to "tax income from all sources", no matter what that loony judge John Roberts (alone) asserted.

What is next - requiring the employer to provide transportation to and from the workplace? How about a adding a COLA to the federal minimum wage based on local housing prices? There is now effectively no constitutional limit as to what the federal gov't can "mandate" by simply by saying spend your money on XYZ or give it to the federal gov't instead. That is simply taking without the due process of law, not taxation of income from all sources. Not spending money, as directed by the gov't, is not an income source, it is unconstitutional controlling of an income destination.

 

[GottaGo]

Really? So if you make a combined 100K and your child is injured, or falls ill.
Bills are huge and even if you have insurance it only covers so much.
What do you do? Not buy food? Not buy gas? Not buy clothes? Basically end your life if you end up with a few hundred thousand dollars in med bills?

Most medical bills can be negotiated, and payment plans can be made.

I've been caught with some serious medical bills, and each has been paid in full. Took me about a year of living frugally (more than normally) and most of my savings, but they were paid.

My responsibility, no one else's.

 

[lolabird]

They CHOOSE bankruptcy to not have to pay bills they incurred.

This is a suggestion: if I were you I would take an economics course.
Insurance plans have a lifetime limit for an injury claim, and when the costs exceed the liability amount, most insured cannot come up with the out-of-pocket amount for the amount not covered.
That should help to explain why 60% of Americans claim bankruptcy because of medical claims.
Who knew their child would be hit by a stray bullet?

 

[CRUE CAB]

Most medical bills can be negotiated, and payment plans can be made.

I've been caught with some serious medical bills, and each has been paid in full. Took me about a year of living frugally (more than normally) and most of my savings, but they were paid.

My responsibility, no one else's.

Thats YOU, not everyone. How many kids do you have? Was your illness on going? Everyones situation is different.
People will just quit paying for the insurance, then what? Jail them? Open up debtors prisons over Obamacare?

 

[lolabird]

No, that is a sound business decision that caused his company to prosper. Since when did the federal gov't acquire the right to dictate (mandate) that employers must provide a "free" benefit to employees? When you are taxed based upon how (or upon who) you did not later spend that income that is not related to the 16th amendment power to "tax income from all sources", no matter what that loony judge John Roberts (alone) asserted.

What is next - requiring the employer to provide transportation to and from the workplace? How about a adding a COLA to the federal minimum wage based on local housing prices? There is now effectively no constitutional limit as to what the federal gov't can "mandate" by simply by saying spend your money on XYZ or give it to the federal gov't instead. That is simply taking without the due process of law, not taxation of income from all sources. Not spending money, as directed by the gov't, is not an income source, it is unconstitutional controlling of an income destination.

Here's a standing O for you and John Schnatter.
Greed will clothe you in prosperity.

 

[mak2]

My wife and I have very good jobs and we have great insurance. About 5 years ago my wife had a medical event that cost a little in excess of a million dollars. We will have it paid off this november. Even looking at it from this end it would have been far smarter for me to file bankruptcy. I know there are caps etc, but one would have to spend thousands in attorneys fees to seperate those that really should get paid from those that should not have. Pretty much whenever the insuracne company turned down a bill, they billed me, then if I did not pay them quick enough they just sent it to a collection agency. I probably ended up paying close to 20%If we had been average income levels we would have had no choice we would have had to file bankruptcy.

They CHOOSE bankruptcy to not have to pay bills they incurred.

 

[lolabird]

Most medical bills can be negotiated, and payment plans can be made.

I've been caught with some serious medical bills, and each has been paid in full. Took me about a year of living frugally (more than normally) and most of my savings, but they were paid.

My responsibility, no one else's.

You are obviously the exception to every case.

 

[mak2]

Yea, right.

Most medical bills can be negotiated, and payment plans can be made.

I've been caught with some serious medical bills, and each has been paid in full. Took me about a year of living frugally (more than normally) and most of my savings, but they were paid.

My responsibility, no one else's.

 

[davidtaylorjr]

Didnt we go through this fearmonger a couple of years back? Oh yeah well I guess we are doing it again!! Let the boogeymen come out of the wood work! Well if companies want to play that game it is gonna be a loser. Check me if I am wrong here but if a company doesnt want a healthy workforce then one they should'nt be in business,and two why would anyone want to work for them.

Right, because it is that simple..... :roll:

 

[GottaGo]

This is a suggestion: if I were you I would take an economics course.
Insurance plans have a lifetime limit for an injury claim, and when the costs exceed the liability amount, most insured cannot come up with the out-of-pocket amount for the amount not covered.
That should help to explain why 60% of Americans claim bankruptcy because of medical claims.
Who knew their child would be hit by a stray bullet?

And I would suggest you take a course in personal responsibility. :wink:

Never said I agreed with the lifetime limits, but the ACA wasn't necessary to change that, along with several other positive points it does have. The problem is the majority of the ACA is negative.

Again, you use an extreme as an example. But playing along that line, depending on where that stray bullet came from, there is personal responsibility from the source of that bullet. You own that bullet even after it stops moving.

 

[GottaGo]

Thats YOU, not everyone. How many kids do you have? Was your illness on going? Everyones situation is different.
People will just quit paying for the insurance, then what? Jail them? Open up debtors prisons over Obamacare?

Yes, my illness is chronic, for the rest if my life.

The ACA shouldn't exist in the form it does. Mandating the purchase of a product just for being alive violates any number of personal freedom rights.

 

[lolabird]

And I would suggest you take a course in personal responsibility. :wink:

Never said I agreed with the lifetime limits, but the ACA wasn't necessary to change that, along with several other positive points it does have. The problem is the majority of the ACA is negative.

Again, you use an extreme as an example. But playing along that line, depending on where that stray bullet came from, there is personal responsibility from the source of that bullet. You own that bullet even after it stops moving.

Will James Francis Edwards be paying for the damages he inflicted upon Chris Lane and his family?

 

[ttwtt78640]

Here's a standing O for you and John Schnatter.
Greed will clothe you in prosperity.

When unable to refute the argument then simply accuse the poster of racism or greed, that makes you a winner every time.

The unfunded mandate is the most dangerous method of "taxation" or gov't control possible. Saying that one may deduct an expense from income is one thing, counting an expense as a tax credit another, yet saying money earned but not spent on ZYZ must instead be given to the gov't is pure extortion. There have to be limits placed upon what the federal gov't may do in the name of social engineering, income redistribution or social justice.

 

[GottaGo]

My wife and I have very good jobs and we have great insurance. About 5 years ago my wife had a medical event that cost a little in excess of a million dollars. We will have it paid off this november. Even looking at it from this end it would have been far smarter for me to file bankruptcy. I know there are caps etc, but one would have to spend thousands in attorneys fees to seperate those that really should get paid from those that should not have. Pretty much whenever the insuracne company turned down a bill, they billed me, then if I did not pay them quick enough they just sent it to a collection agency. I probably ended up paying close to 20%If we had been average income levels we would have had no choice we would have had to file bankruptcy.

And you chose not to file bankruptcy.

There are many who don't even bother with the legal action, they just walk.

 

[CRUE CAB]

Yes, my illness is chronic, for the rest if my life.

The ACA shouldn't exist in the form it does. Mandating the purchase of a product just for being alive violates any number of personal freedom rights.

Thats why I dont think Obama care is going to change anything in instances like yours. Or mine.
People will just not pay. Working under the table will skyrocket.
People cant tell me that others are going to be able to work 29 hours a week and make it AND pay for insurance.

 

[lolabird]

When unable to refute the argument then simply accuse the poster of racism or greed, that makes you a winner every time.

The unfunded mandate is the most dangerous method of "taxation" or gov't control possible. Saying that one may deduct an expense from income is one thing, counting an expense as a tax credit another, yet saying money earned but not spent on ZYZ must instead be given to the gov't is pure extortion. There have to be limits placed upon what the federal gov't may do in the name of social engineering, income redistribution or social justice.

How in the world would I know that you are a racist?
In you opinion, what is the government's limit regarding social justice?

 

[Fisher]

..... what is the government's limit regarding social justice?

Not making it about social vengeance would be a start.

 

[mak2]

If I made $50k a year I would/could not have paid. Then you know who does under our current system? Everyone else, which drives up costs for everyone and makes it more likley the next guy will have to file or just walk away, and then those costs will be passed on and on and on. Yet the healthcare industry and insurancce industry will get its profit. We will have a UHC system someday that everyone pays into, we have to and will.

Thats why I dont think Obama care is going to change anything in instances like yours. Or mine.
People will just not pay. Working under the table will skyrocket.
People cant tell me that others are going to be able to work 29 hours a week and make it AND pay for insurance.