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Why the unemployment? A poll

Unemployment....why???


  • Total voters
    59
  • Poll closed .

earthworm

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The cause of unemployment:

1 Liberal policies

2 Conservative policies

3 both

4 our greed

5 other

Please choose and explain.
 

lizzie

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Multiple factors: we have become a very unproductive country as far as actual products go (we've stop producing goods, and started turning to service industries), we seem to keep growing the government employee sector, while the private sector is standing still, and we have a disproportionately large portion of citizens on government payrolls in one form or another. Government doesn't produce- it's a net cost, and the private sector is growing at a much slower pace than the sector who needs support from the public sector.
 

mike2810

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- Too many people and not enough jobs for the skill they have
- Economy slow down
- Policies that may hender market growth.

IMO, the whole world economy would be better off with a lot less people. Less demand for limited natural resources and less demand on infrastructer or need to expand.
 

Harry Guerrilla

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The moronic behavior of our Congress and President have made doing business here, less stable.
Banks/businesses have a cash surplus right now and won't hire anyone because of uncertainty.
 

tacomancer

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I think our biggest problem is overseas competition and the fact that companies are not penalized for shipping jobs overseas. We are divulging between two economic classes, the very rich and everyone else, and our current recession is caused by the fact that the diverging economy cannot keep demand up. We have been trying to use credit since the 80s to make up for the lack of growth in our wages and we simply are to the point that we cannot borrow any more, which caused the economy to be unhealthy enough that this recession was worse than it could be.
 
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lizzie

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The moronic behavior of our Congress and President have made doing business here, less stable.
Banks/businesses have a cash surplus right now and won't hire anyone because of uncertainty.

Absolutely true.
 

lizzie

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I think our biggest problem is overseas competition and the fact that companies are not penalized for shipping jobs overseas. We are divulging between two economic classes, the very rich and everyone else, and our current recession is caused by the fact that the diverging economy cannot keep demand up. We have been trying to use credit since the 80s to make up for the lack of growth in our wages and we simply are to the point that we cannot borrow any more, which caused the economy to falter.

It seems to me that the very reason our growth in wages has been poor is because of overseas competition. We have now become a part of the global economy, and our economic system in general can't compete. We import cheap Chinese (and other) good because the general population wants cheap stuff. American corporations and manufacturers can't compete with cheap wages overseas, so their only viable option is to ship the manufacturing overseas so that Americans will buy their goods. In going global, we have really screwed ourselves in a way. People can't find good jobs here, because they want cheap crap, but they don't want to pay fellow Americans to produce it.
 

tacomancer

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It seems to me that the very reason our growth in wages has been poor is because of overseas competition. We have now become a part of the global economy, and our economic system in general can't compete. We import cheap Chinese (and other) good because the general population wants cheap stuff. American corporations and manufacturers can't compete with cheap wages overseas, so their only viable option is to ship the manufacturing overseas so that Americans will buy their goods. In going global, we have really screwed ourselves in a way. People can't find good jobs here, because they want cheap crap, but they don't want to pay fellow Americans to produce it.

Yep. We are our own worst enemy in this regard. Unfortunately, I know of no way to fix the trend that wouldn't make things much worse.
 

Harry Guerrilla

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It seems to me that the very reason our growth in wages has been poor is because of overseas competition. We have now become a part of the global economy, and our economic system in general can't compete. We import cheap Chinese (and other) good because the general population wants cheap stuff. American corporations and manufacturers can't compete with cheap wages overseas, so their only viable option is to ship the manufacturing overseas so that Americans will buy their goods. In going global, we have really screwed ourselves in a way. People can't find good jobs here, because they want cheap crap, but they don't want to pay fellow Americans to produce it.

That's not entirely true.
Some things can be made overseas with better cost efficiency (think small junky things at Walmart and dollar stores) but others like cars,bulky items can't.

Wage labor jobs are decreasing because of automation and greater per worker efficiency.
Costs of doing business are on the increase as well from over regulation.

For some people the job market doesn't look good, get some kind of education and you stand a far better chance than high school graduates and GED holders.
 

Goobieman

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Unemployment is caused by a lack of demand in the labor market.
Lots of reasons for that.
 

Goobieman

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In going global, we have really screwed ourselves in a way.
Going global is the inevitable result of a free market. Ultimately, this is good for the consumer.
 

lizzie

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That's not entirely true.
Some things can be made overseas with better cost efficiency (think small junky things at Walmart and dollar stores) but others like cars,bulky items can't.

.

Yes, but it's the small junky things at Walmart that are the huge bulk of our buying habits. I buy small junky things at least a couple of days per week, and a car once every 5-8 years. Labor unions here have sort of priced themselves out of the market, and now even they are being supported by government (ie us).

Wage labor jobs are decreasing because of automation and greater per worker efficiency.
Costs of doing business are on the increase as well from over regulation.

Plus they are decreasing because lots of people just can't afford their products. Agreed on the regulation business (plus coming tax increases on small business). A close friend of mine has owned a local vacuum sales and repair store for about 25 years here. He's closing the doors after next year, specifically because of tax changes and increasing bureaucracy/paperwork.

For some people the job market doesn't look good, get some kind of education and you stand a far better chance than high school graduates and GED holders.

Unfortunately that's true. Thirty years ago, you could go to a trade school (carpentry, plumbing, etc) and learn a skill that was decent paying enough to live on. Now, with illegal immigration, those jobs have disappeared.
 

lizzie

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Going global is the inevitable result of a free market. Ultimately, this is good for the consumer.

Of course it's good for the consumer, but in a world economy, with our wages being uncompetitive in that world economy, our business sector (which is a huge tax monies contributor into the feds) is forced to either ship manufacturing overseas, or sell their products for an uncompetitive price. Imo, it's caused more problems than it has helped. The transition is a part of what has killed our economy and our tax base.
 

ricksfolly

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People lose their jobs because the buying trend loses steam, and less buying cause layoffs. Fortunately we have Social Security and pensions to soften the blow this time. Back in the thirties, during the depression, we had neither.

ricksfolly
 

Harry Guerrilla

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Yes, but it's the small junky things at Walmart that are the huge bulk of our buying habits. I buy small junky things at least a couple of days per week, and a car once every 5-8 years. Labor unions here have sort of priced themselves out of the market, and now even they are being supported by government (ie us).

I do agree with unions out pricing labor but it's just more efficient to have people overseas make this stuff.
We can build more technically superior, valuable things.
That's why I mentioned having an education because we need more engineers and technicians in complicated tech fields.

Plus they are decreasing because lots of people just can't afford their products. Agreed on the regulation business (plus coming tax increases on small business). A close friend of mine has owned a local vacuum sales and repair store for about 25 years here. He's closing the doors after next year, specifically because of tax changes and increasing bureaucracy/paperwork.

My direct experience is that efficiency is what is killing jobs, not necessarily a bad thing but not a good thing for some people.
To illustrate what I mean, my company has consolidated production of 3-5 facilities (can't remember the exact number) down to the one I work in.

We have only hired about 20-30 additional temp workers since the recession.
Our plant has better technology and is over all more efficient than those plants that were closed down.
My specific line has gone from making 100 units in 10 hours to making 150 in 8 hours.
We're just getting more and more efficient.

Unfortunately that's true. Thirty years ago, you could go to a trade school (carpentry, plumbing, etc) and learn a skill that was decent paying enough to live on. Now, with illegal immigration, those jobs have disappeared.

Plumping, electrical, HVAC are still viable.
Carpentry can be so-so depending on the specific field but you are right in many instances.
You also have to remember that people now spend more money on luxuries.
Subscription television services, internet and other things people 20-50 years ago didn't enjoy, adds to the total cost of living.
Not to mention the loads of debt people are putting themselves into.
 

Crunch

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In a nut shell...

Currently, the average combined federal and state corporate tax rate in the U.S. is 39.3 percent, second among OECD countries to Japan's combined rate of 39.5 percent.1 Lowering the federal rate to 30.5 percent would only lower the U.S.'s ranking to fifth highest among industrialized countries.

The Tax Foundation - U.S. States Lead the World in High Corporate Taxes

Add State taxes on to the federal burden (which this publication does), then ask yourself why jobs go overseas.
 

lizzie

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We can build more technically superior, valuable things.
That's why I mentioned having an education because we need more engineers and technicians in complicated tech fields.
.

Yeah, but it takes one engineer to oversee the computers and automated machinery that replaced 100 workers.;)

Plumping, electrical, HVAC are still viable.
Carpentry can be so-so depending on the specific field but you are right in many instances.

My observation is that the building trades now have one or two American owners or foremen with a couple of crews of low-paid Mexican workers, at least in this part of the country. This has helped keep the cost of building lower than it is in reality. Again, good for the American consumer, bad for the American wage-earner.
 

Goobieman

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Of course it's good for the consumer, but in a world economy, with our wages being uncompetitive in that world economy, our business sector (which is a huge tax monies contributor into the feds) is forced to either ship manufacturing overseas, or sell their products for an uncompetitive price. Imo, it's caused more problems than it has helped. The transition is a part of what has killed our economy and our tax base.
The key idea here is "transition". Once things balance out thru global competition, things will get better. Remember that global competition works both way, and that as things shift, the excessively low wages overseas will rise.

Part of the issue here is the insistence of labor unions that they can dictate the cost of the labor that their members provide. That just ain't so any more.
 

Goobieman

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People lose their jobs because the buying trend loses steam, and less buying cause layoffs. Fortunately we have Social Security and pensions to soften the blow this time. Back in the thirties, during the depression, we had neither.
Thank GOD for the state, for without, we would all be lost.
:roll:
 

Goobieman

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Free market is a disaster the way it stands. What's needed is a controlled organization like OPEC.
This short-sighted outlook is based on nothing other than a desire for partisan political power.
 

lizzie

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The key idea here is "transition". Once things balance out thru global competition, things will get better. Remember that global competition works both way, and that as things shift, the excessively low wages overseas will rise.

Part of the issue here is the insistence of labor unions that they can dictate the cost of the labor that their members provide. That just ain't so any more.

True. I've been hearing lately that the Chinese workers are making demands for better wages. It will be nice when the rest of the world catches up with us, and we can get back to a more realistic economy. Imo, we've been suffering from irrational exuberance for far too long.
 

Goobieman

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True. I've been hearing lately that the Chinese workers are making demands for better wages. It will be nice when the rest of the world catches up with us, and we can get back to a more realistic economy. Imo, we've been suffering from irrational exuberance for far too long.
Well... it IS better to lead than to try to play catch-up.
 

Red_Dave

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Multiple factors: we have become a very unproductive country as far as actual products go (we've stop producing goods, and started turning to service industries), we seem to keep growing the government employee sector, while the private sector is standing still, and we have a disproportionately large portion of citizens on government payrolls in one form or another. Government doesn't produce- it's a net cost, and the private sector is growing at a much slower pace than the sector who needs support from the public sector.

Disproportionate compared to what?
 
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