Why recreational marijuana is dangerous

[Bucky]

Four years ago in my town, a young woman was returning from a BBQ with friends. Her two kids were in the back seat of her car when she swerved over the middle lane and crashed head on into a truck killing her two children. She survived and her blood alcohol taken at the scene measured 2.00. She claims she wasn't drunk, "only had a couple of beers" she said. Drinking and driving is much more common and many times more dangerous.

If more physicians wrote more scripts for medical marijuana than they do opioids for pain management, we wouldn't be experiencing an opioid crisis in this country.

Notice, I am not advocating making recreational marijuana use illegal. However, it is becoming easier and easier to consume marijuana in the form of edibles - cookies, lollipops coffee, etc. Not everyone likes smoking marijuana however if you make it more easily able to consume, you will see a lot more violence and dangerous activity involved with weed.

If kids are coming in class high without having to smoke it, it will have a very negative effect.

 

[GDViking]

I think there needs to be a clear establishment that supporting medical marijuana is different than supporting recreational marijuana. Marijuana is a drug, it isn't candy. As more and more research is being done, higher-potency marijuana is potentially harmful to our mental health leading to paranoia, psychosis, and schizophrenia:



https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/317170.php

There is also possible evidence that marijuana can increase violence:





https://www.motherjones.com/politic...ur-children-marijuana-crime-mental-illness-1/

Overall I think more research needs to be done. There is also not enough evidence that marijuana is more effective or less addictive as a pain killer than opiates.

Okay if more research needs to be done I'm on it. I just recently started smoking again and my depression and anxiety are much better...

 

[MovingPictures]

I have smoked pot ...

So you broke the law you want everyone else to be arrested for.

 

[MovingPictures]

Give me a break my friend. Unless it is for medical purposes, smoking marijuana has nothing to do with personal freedom.

If I want it and I don't cause problems for anybody when I use it, it's none of your ****ing business.

Conservatives are all "small government" until there's something in society they oppose, that they want the government to sanction. Then conservatives are all for expanding the government, even to extreme sizes.

NOTE: I've never smoked pot. I don't need to have something effect me personally to do the right thing.

 

[RabidAlpaca]

I think there needs to be a clear establishment that supporting medical marijuana is different than supporting recreational marijuana. Marijuana is a drug, it isn't candy. As more and more research is being done, higher-potency marijuana is potentially harmful to our mental health leading to paranoia, psychosis, and schizophrenia:



https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/317170.php

There is also possible evidence that marijuana can increase violence:





https://www.motherjones.com/politic...ur-children-marijuana-crime-mental-illness-1/

Overall I think more research needs to be done. There is also not enough evidence that marijuana is more effective or less addictive as a pain killer than opiates.

You big government statists are just the worst. You hate liberty so much you have to use the government to attack innocent Americans.

Give me a break my friend. Unless it is for medical purposes, smoking marijuana has nothing to do with personal freedom.

Unless you need them for some government approved purpose, guns, alcohol and fast food have nothing to do with personal freedom. In Bucky's world the government gets to decide personal freedom for you.

 

[MovingPictures]

You appear to be confusing my position, which is social conservatism, with libertarianism, Grand Mal. And I am not a libertarian. As I see it, personal freedom is simply an open road by which people can travel to lead their best lives and achieve their greatest happiness. But freedom can only be enjoyed by men and women possessed of virtuous hearts and a capacity for self-restraint. I believe Benjamin Franklin said it best:

“Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters.”

I do not want to be anyone's master, Grand Mal. I want people to master themselves and free themselves of their most base desires, lest we fall into a collective dissolution and dissipation so terrible that people will beg for a tyranny to restore social order.

This pretty talk is all nice and everything, but your actions speak louder than your words.

One can equate their philosophy to freedom and small government until they're blue in the face, it doesn't change whatever the reality of their philosophy actually is. In your case you clearly do wish to be peoples master and have the government force choices they disagree with on them, that they clearly should be able to make for themselves.

 

[Bucky]

So you broke the law you want everyone else to be arrested for.

Quote me where I said marijuana should be illegal. I said it is dangerous and potentially harmful. Never did I saw we should make it illegal.

 

[iguanaman]

I think there needs to be a clear establishment that supporting medical marijuana is different than supporting recreational marijuana. Marijuana is a drug, it isn't candy. As more and more research is being done, higher-potency marijuana is potentially harmful to our mental health leading to paranoia, psychosis, and schizophrenia:



https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/317170.php

There is also possible evidence that marijuana can increase violence:





https://www.motherjones.com/politic...ur-children-marijuana-crime-mental-illness-1/

Overall I think more research needs to be done. There is also not enough evidence that marijuana is more effective or less addictive as a pain killer than opiates.

LOL You mean "Reefer Madness" is real? I want some of what you are smoking...
You are right marijuana is not "candy" but neither is Beer. Wine and Whisky... drugs that do far more damage to peoples health and are legal. I think we need to regulate them more before we even bother with pot. We can ban bars that sell alcohol and replace them with weed clinics and we would see a drop in alcoholism in no time.

The cost of excessive alcohol use in the U.S. rose to almost a quarter trillion dollars in 2010. Implementing effective community-based interventions can reduce excessive drinking and its costs.

Excessive alcohol use is known to kill about 88,000 people in the United States each year, but a CDC study suggests it is also a drain on the American economy, mostly due to losses in workplace productivity.

https://www.cdc.gov/features/costsofdrinking/index.html

 

[Thoreau72]

Ya know, that's so far off what you intended you probably wont believe it. A couple years ago my son and a half-dozen of his friends came up here to camp for a long weekend and they were stoned on acid for much of the time. I send him a supply of pot I've grown every year, and lately a batch of cookies made with pot butter.
You guys know so little about this subject I wonder how you feel like you can speak about it.

Maybe he gained his vast knowledge by attending DARE classes?

 

[Airyaman]

Good news OP: no one will make you smoke MJ!

Phew, that was a close one...

 

[Felis Leo]

This pretty talk is all nice and everything, but your actions speak louder than your words.

One can equate their philosophy to freedom and small government until they're blue in the face, it doesn't change whatever the reality of their philosophy actually is. In your case you clearly do wish to be peoples master and have the government force choices they disagree with on them, that they clearly should be able to make for themselves.

And what are my actions, MovingPictures? I have not come to slap the joint from anyone's hands, or pass draconian Japanese/Korean-style legislation to criminalize the use and purchase of unprescribed narcotics and psychotropics (even if it would work in lowering the incidence of drug use). I am simply sitting and observing and giving my commentary, and I know I cannot save people from themselves. If people wish to lose themselves to drunkenness, gluttony, hedonism and other acts of personal dissolution (including taking psychotropic drugs that can increase the likelihood of onset of severe mental illness) there is little I can do to stop them other than to make sure that if they create externalities that harm others, that they are restrained and punished for them. If my judgment that people are engaging in what I can only describe as dissipative acts troubles you, let us have a discussion on that basis. If you are going to attack my position, attack me for what I have said, not what you imagine my ultimate goals to be.

 

[Bucky]

LOL You mean "Reefer Madness" is real? I want some of what you are smoking...
You are right marijuana is not "candy" but neither is Beer. Wine and Whisky... drugs that do far more damage to peoples health and are legal. I think we need to regulate them more before we even bother with pot. We can ban bars that sell alcohol and replace them with weed clinics and we would see a drop in alcoholism in no time.



https://www.cdc.gov/features/costsofdrinking/index.html

I am trying to put the facts back in focus. For decades the tobacco industry was lying to the public saying their products were safe. Are you denying that smoking cigarettes is dangerous?

The marijuana industry is just a deceitful.

 

[<alt>doxygen]

I think there needs to be a clear establishment that supporting medical marijuana is different than supporting recreational marijuana. Marijuana is a drug, it isn't candy. As more and more research is being done, higher-potency marijuana is potentially harmful to our mental health leading to paranoia, psychosis, and schizophrenia:



https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/317170.php

There is also possible evidence that marijuana can increase violence:





https://www.motherjones.com/politic...ur-children-marijuana-crime-mental-illness-1/

Overall I think more research needs to be done. There is also not enough evidence that marijuana is more effective or less addictive as a pain killer than opiates.

I would advise people who have a tendency to be paranoid to avoid cannabis, especially sativa dominant strains. Paranoia is a known undesirable side effect for some people. I've never heard of a violence connection, however, and the idea that someone who has a bad reaction to it would keep using it to the point of becoming schizo seems like alarmism.

Do a little research:
https://www.leafly.com/

Pick stains wisely. Go slow at first - less is more. If you're doing edibles or tinctures, go VERY slow and easy.

 

[iguanaman]

I am trying to put the facts back in focus. For decades the tobacco industry was lying to the public saying their products were safe. Are you denying that smoking cigarettes is dangerous?

The marijuana industry is just a deceitful.

No they are not. Pot has been used for 1000's of years and it's health benefits are just becoming clear. It is excellent against pain and far safer than oxy's. No one has been more deceitful than our pharmaceutical corporations.

 

[Skeptic Bob]

Question, If you have kids, or pretend you do have kids.

Would you be okay if your kids smoked pot? Would you allow it in your household?

You didn’t ask me but I’ll answer since I was having this conversation with my mom and my wife a few days ago.

I have a 13 year old son. No, I don’t want him smoking weed anytime soon. However, if I found out he smoked weed on occasion once he is a grown man I couldn’t care less, though I couldn’t say the same if he were smoking tobacco as an adult.

 

[Coyuga]

You have the right to be stupid. Plenty of substances are dangerous when ingested by the wrong person. Alcohol for example causes liver and gut damage, brain damage, and slower reaction times, and sometimes makes you aggressive.

I may have to change my ideology on this site given the fact I don't support legalizing all drugs, but Marijuana definately should be legal. There's no reason it should be illicit, and plenty of reasons it shouldn't.

 

[Incredulous]

I don't need more research. Marijuana had been used as medicine for years before it was turned into a racist, political tool. I'm 100% on board with legalization for recreational use as well, and I'm convinced the ONLY reason it's not is big pharma. Can't patent a plant... Furthermore, I feel strongly that people should have a choice how they wish to medicate. Personally, I'd take a plant over a lab-created chemical cocktail any day. After two motorcycle accidents, my brother struggles with opioid addiction. I watched my mother go through opiod withdrawals in the 90's after her doc had her on them for 3 months after a serious car accident. She's afraid of them now, with good reason. Our opioid crisis is a DIRECT result of pharmaceutical companies preying on Americans with the blessing of the FDA.

Aside from my anecdotal evidence, check this out:

https://drugabuse.com/legalizing-marijuana-decreases-fatal-opiate-overdoses/

According to the American Academy of Pain Medicine, more than 100 million Americans suffer from chronic pain. In an effort to relieve that constant pain, the number of opiate prescriptions has nearly doubled over the last decade. Today, opiates like hydrocodone, oxycodone, and morphine flood the streets, driving up addiction rates and fatal opiate overdoses.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has officially labeled the problem an “opiate epidemic.” As experts scramble to come up with a plan that combats the nation’s dependence on opiates, a new study published last week in the journal JAMA Internal Medicine indicates medical marijuana might be the key.

Over the past two decades, deaths from drug overdoses have become the leading cause of injury death in the United States. In 2011, 55 percent of drug overdose deaths were related to prescription medications; 75 percent of those deaths involved opiate painkillers. However, researchers found that opiate-related deaths decreased by approximately 33 percent in 13 states in the following six years after medical marijuana was legalized.

“The striking implication is that medical marijuana laws, when implemented, may represent a promising approach for stemming runaway rates of nonintentional opioid-analgesic-related deaths,” wrote opiate abuse researchers Dr. Mark S. Brown and Marie J. Hayes in a commentary published alongside the study.

Getting Down to the Numbers

Researchers looked at medical marijuana laws and death certificate data in all 50 states between the years of 1999 and 2010. During that time, only 13 states had medical marijuana laws in place. Researchers quickly noticed that the rates of fatal opioid overdoses were significantly lower in states that had legalized medical marijuana. In 2010 alone, states with legalized medical marijuana saw approximately 1,700 fewer opiate-related overdose deaths.

“We found there was about a 25 percent lower rate of prescription painkiller overdose deaths on average after implementation of a medical marijuana law,” lead study author Dr. Marcus Bachhuber said.

Marijuana and Chronic Pain

About 60 percent of the nation’s fatal opioid overdoses occur among patients who have legitimate prescriptions for their medications. In states where medical marijuana is legal, however, a legitimate opiate user is able to significantly decrease his or her dosage, making overdose less likely.

Currently, 23 states and the District of Columbia have passed medical marijuana laws. Use of medicinal cannabis is approved for a number of conditions, including cancer, HIV, multiple sclerosis, and glaucoma. Despite the diagnosis, medical marijuana is primarily used to relieve chronic or severe pain. It’s that pain-relieving effect that decreases the number of fatal opioid overdoses.

Major Pain-Relieving Components of Cannabis

In a 2011 study published in the journal Clinical Pharmacology & Therapeutics, researchers suggest the following medical marijuana components offer pain-relieving properties:

Delta-9 Tetrahydrocannabinol (Delta-9 THC)
Cannabidiol (CBD)
Cannabinol (CBN)
Tetrahydrocannabivarin (THCV)




P.S. And never, have I ever heard of anyone becoming violent on marijuana. I'd like to see more research/facts on this.

 

[Mr Person]

That people are made to think that taking unprescribed mind-altering drugs that radically shift one's mental state without any lasting side effects whatsoever is the height of folly. I think twenty to thirty years hence, those of us still alive and our descednants will look back on these days of the freeing up of recreational marijuana use with the same horror that we look back at the years of the heavy prescribing of thalidomide, and the suffering and misery that it caused.

Ignorant fear-mongering, and no more.

 

[WillyPete]

There are studies going back to the 19th century on the topic. The whole ignorance as defense thing has to wear thin at some point, guys.

Here's a link to Schaffer Library of Drug Policy.

The site hasn't aged very well, but it has the text of all major government studies from 1894 to 2000. The more recent studies that focus on psychosis in young users are generally produced by groups with an agenda, but regardless no one is recommending children use marijuana.

Obviously we should all be responsible in our actions, but it should be very apparent to anyone interested in the topic that prohibition marijuana is bad policy, simply because it is ineffective and because we have much more pressing priorities to address with our limited resources.

 

[Felis Leo]

Ignorant fear-mongering, and no more.

No need for glib flippancy. We will certainly know more in the coming decades. As the OP suggests, it is clear that simply giving vulnerable young developing minds unprescribed psychotropic drugs is indeed causing some harm. One does not have to fully-subscribe to the hyperbolic exaggerations of Reefer Madness to understand that giving someone untested mind-altering chemicals can have serious and severe side effects, some of which may be permanent. You may think the danger is nonexistent or overstated. I think we have moved too fast on this issue of decriminalization and legalization.

 

[Idiometer]

I think there needs to be a clear establishment that supporting medical marijuana is different than supporting recreational marijuana. Marijuana is a drug, it isn't candy. As more and more research is being done, higher-potency marijuana is potentially harmful to our mental health leading to paranoia, psychosis, and schizophrenia:



https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/317170.php

There is also possible evidence that marijuana can increase violence:





https://www.motherjones.com/politic...ur-children-marijuana-crime-mental-illness-1/

Overall I think more research needs to be done. There is also not enough evidence that marijuana is more effective or less addictive as a pain killer than opiates.

First, you're right that more research is needed, not so much to establish the relative safety of the drug, but to learn more about how its many properties can be used to add to quality of life for many.

Second, alcohol is also a drug, and a far more dangerous one. No man ever smoked a joint, then went home and beat his wife and kids. That's something a mean drunk does. That's alcohol ... and why wasn't more research done on the effects during all the time it's been legal?

Third, the studies have found that brain development can be inhibited by use, but only during the teen years, and only if the teen is consuming A LOT of pot.

Fourth, in the states like Colorado where recreational use has been legalized, there are much fewer teens getting the stuff. Dispensaries require valid IDs before you're let through the door.

Think of it this way: there seems to be a natural human propensity to self-medicate. We've been making hooch of all kinds since forever, and many cultures use drugs derived from various flora or fauna in religious ceremonies. The trick seems to be in finding a medication that works for you. Some like wine, some like bourbon, some like a heavy indica. Find something that feels good, but that you're confident you can use in moderation.

And as for cannabis specifically, unlike Bill Clinton, millions of us have been inhaling the stuff for decades, and we're neither physically nor mentally ill. Perhaps that tells the bigger story.

 

[Idiometer]

That people are made to think that taking unprescribed mind-altering drugs that radically shift one's mental state without any lasting side effects whatsoever is the height of folly. I think twenty to thirty years hence, those of us still alive and our descednants will look back on these days of the freeing up of recreational marijuana use with the same horror that we look back at the years of the heavy prescribing of thalidomide, and the suffering and misery that it caused.

Um .... yeah, about that?

There are A LOT of us who have been using cannabis since the 60s, if not earlier. Side effects are non-existent, and if the stuff could "radically shift one's mental state ..." I'd have to say I've not seen that in any of the people I've known since back then.

There is no difference between me smoking a little dope and you drinking a cocktail, except that my substance of choice is much better for you overall.

 

[Felis Leo]

Um .... yeah, about that?

There are A LOT of us who have been using cannabis since the 60s, if not earlier. Side effects are non-existent, and if the stuff could "radically shift one's mental state ..." I'd have to say I've not seen that in any of the people I've known since back then.

There is no difference between me smoking a little dope and you drinking a cocktail, except that my substance of choice is much better for you overall.

I neither drink alcohol nor smoke marijuana (or tobacco for that matter). I lead a happily puritanical existence, I am afraid, Idiometer. But I am glad you and yours have not suffered any ill effects from smoking marijuana. Hopefully fewer than I worry might succumb to its side effects will. This is one area where I desire to be wrong and would take no pleasure in having my fears borne out.

 

[Keridan]

I quit pot years ago. Didn't much care for the paranoia. That was my preference, though.

Over and over again extended studies show no strong evidence of lasting harm. Even the biased articles you posted have to do some fun gymnastics to tie pot use to violence and they largely fail to pull it off. States that have legalized pot use, counties that always had it legal and any other example show no real link to societal problems. Nothing that even pretends to come close to alcohol, which is considered a normal thing to enjoy after dinner and after the age of 18 (21 legally)

We live in a free society. We don't need reasons to make it legal, we need real reasons to make it illegal. It has to be shown to cause harm to others, not the smoker. It being illegal does more damage than good, for certain. So many "crimes" would not be a problem if we just used common sense and made it legal. People wouldn't act like idiots trying to get their hands on it. Not to mention the fortune we waste hunting, prosecuting and imprisoning harmless members of society.

If we legalized, taxed, and regulated all drugs, the government could triple spending on programs to help addicts and sill end up with a surplus to help other programs. We would actually have some control over the age of users instead of dealers not caring that their best customer base shows up when high school gets out. Deaths from bad batches of drugs would plummet since we could easily enforce quality controls on manufacturers.

I have two young sons. Before they get into trouble, I will teach them how to drink and how to stop. I will teach them how to handle weed and how to see if it is hurting their lives. I won't condone use at all, but I will make it clear that I prefer such things happen at home and with my knowledge. It will help me keep them safe. I will do my best to raise them so they never actually use drugs, but statistics say it will take a lot of luck and love to keep them clean all their lives.

What our government is doing now is not working. There is an obvious and easy better way. It also has the side effect of making studies easier to conduct when the participants aren't hiding things and paying for it with tax revenues from those same drugs.

I know this is a long post and I appreciate those who took the time to read it. It's silly that these talking points aren't incredibly well known and get ignored by those in power.

Good night, all!

 

[Idiometer]

I have smoked pot, so I can speak of the subject matter based on personal experience. The THC can definitely cause psychotic episodes/breaks. Definitely even violent outbursts.

To say that marijuana does not alter one's behavior or actions is not a true statement. When I ate edible food laced with THC, I could not function. I can't imagine what would have happened if I got behind the wheel.

Two things:

1. If you experienced psychotic episodes using cannabis, you're unique in that. I suspect an existing psychological issue. What most people feel is a nice, temporary euphoria.

2. Edibles can be unreliable as to actual dosage. For example, I bought a common brand of chocolate bar, sold in most dispensaries, thinking the dosages in such a popular brand would be even. I ate two small squares, got a mild high that lasted about two hours. Next time, from the same chocolate bar, I ate two squares again, then went in to watch a movie. I felt nothing for more than an hour and a half, then by the time the movie ended, I was so high that I had to sit in my car, drinking water, for an hour before I could even think of driving the two miles home. I'm a control freak, and won't use edibles for that reason.

I recommend starting with a small vape, one puff at a time.