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Why Isn't Congress Moving Legislation During the Lame Duck Session to Fix the Debt Limit Issue

They are waiting till right before the end to drop a huge bill on the 22nd that is 2,000 pages. Too much to read before the vote. Still they will vote for it. Everyone on the left and plenty of ignorant Republicans will pass it without a clue what they are voting for. Included will be raising the debt ceiling and trillions in spending.
NOTE: Printing money you don't have causes soaring inflation. Even when Biden is President massive deficit spending causes soaring inflation whether you blame him or not.
 
jaeger19 said:
Of course there is.
ITs called supply and demand.
By removing medicare in particularly you will reduce the ability of people who need healthcare to pay for services. Thus decreasing economic growth and in fact decreasing the economy.
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Except you wouldnt reduce it. You would simply move it to a more effective system.
 
jaeger19 said:
Great. Explain how the private sector will rush in to fill a demand that the patient cannot pay for. Please explain.

Interesting. but you will be that 75 year old.. and then you would find that no one doctor is going to give you a total knee unless you can afford to split with 30-50 thousand dollars... or do a valve repair or replacement, or do a carotid endarectomy. In fact.. if government got out of medicare and medicaid.. you would probably find that there would be very few providers that provided any of the more expensive servies that you would need. Because the number of people able to pay for them would be so small, it would not be economically feasible for providers to provide those services
I suggest you think about that..

Actually good luck to you in such a system.... The irony is that you live under the blanket of protection that government provides.. and all you do is complain about it. BUT WHEN YOU NEED IT... you sure as heck will want it.
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Except I wont need it.
 
jonny5 said:
Except you wouldnt reduce it. You would simply move it to a more effective system.
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And exactly how.
What " system".
The same system that left poor and elderly without muchbin the c way of healthcare because they couldn't pay for it?
If the private sector had filled the need for healthcare for the poor and elderly..their would have been no demand for Medicare and Medicaid.
 
jaeger19 said:
And exactly how.
What " system".
The same system that left poor and elderly without muchbin the c way of healthcare because they couldn't pay for it?
If the private sector had filled the need for healthcare for the poor and elderly..their would have been no demand for Medicare and Medicaid.
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No, whatever system people or local govts come up with that they feel works best for them. How is not my job other than for myself. Your healthcare is your responsibility.
 
jonny5 said:
Except you wouldnt reduce it. You would simply move it to a more effective system.
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what more effective system? We know empirically that single payer systems, like medicare, are superior to private sector for profit plans.
 
jonny5 said:
I dont plan to rely on govt for my healthcare.
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You will have to.
You simply will be too great a risk if you live long enough.
 
jonny5 said:
No, whatever system people or local govts come up with that they feel works best for them. How is not my job other than for myself. Your healthcare is your responsibility.
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Well what if your local government decides that you need to pay into the state for a single payer state program?
Is that fine with you?
 
jaeger19 said:
Well what if your local government decides that you need to pay into the state for a single payer state program?
Is that fine with you?
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Depends on how its setup and if we all consented to it. But generally no. Back to the point though, THE DEBT, healthcare is whats causing it all. Its long past time to deal with it, and this lame duck session is trying to make it worse, trying to ram through another massive omnibus bill.
 
jonny5 said:
Depends on how its setup and if we all consented to it. But generally no. Back to the point though, THE DEBT, healthcare is whats causing it all. Its long past time to deal with it, and this lame duck session is trying to make it worse, trying to ram through another massive omnibus bill.
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Ahhh..so now it's no..you would not agree if your state came up with a healyhcare system.
Here is the problem. You look at the expenses and say.." healthcare is causing the debt".
But you aren't thinking about what happens to the governments debt when you cut paying for healthcare.

It's like a company that produces pharmaceuticals saying.." gosh we are running in the red ( debt) and our largest expense is our all our employees that develop pharmaceuticals so lets get rid of them".

With zero plan on how to deal with the ramifications of getting rid of all their research and design employees.

Do you understand?

Medicare and Medicaid play a significant role in the US economy. First there is the healthcare industry, which makes up about 24-26% of our GDP. Taking them away without a replacement? Would be a huge disruption in the economy. Likely half the medical facilities or perhaps more would have to close. They simply cannot continuing to see patients that now suddenly cannot afford their services. That means a ton of jobs lost, not to mention all the companies that provide equipment to hospitals, drugs, that build and maintain facilities, etc.

Thats just the obvious ramification. Then there is the effect to the economy from having poor and seniors without healthcare. Now you have workers out sick or unable to work because they have no healthcare. You have workers having to leave work because they have to care for a parent or grandparent who now is sick and disabled because they have little to no access to healthcare. (that total hip, total knee, operation is what helped keep grandma and grandpa in their own home and able to care for themselves).

Now you flippantly saying "well providers will rush to provide care". Well why? Medicare and medicaid filled a need that the private industry simply wouldn't and couldn't fill. There is no indication that providers will rush to loose money.
 
jaeger19 said:
Ahhh..so now it's no..you would not agree if your state came up with a healyhcare system.
Here is the problem. You look at the expenses and say.." healthcare is causing the debt".
But you aren't thinking about what happens to the governments debt when you cut paying for healthcare.

It's like a company that produces pharmaceuticals saying.." gosh we are running in the red ( debt) and our largest expense is our all our employees that develop pharmaceuticals so lets get rid of them".

With zero plan on how to deal with the ramifications of getting rid of all their research and design employees.

Do you understand?

Medicare and Medicaid play a significant role in the US economy. First there is the healthcare industry, which makes up about 24-26% of our GDP. Taking them away without a replacement? Would be a huge disruption in the economy. Likely half the medical facilities or perhaps more would have to close. They simply cannot continuing to see patients that now suddenly cannot afford their services. That means a ton of jobs lost, not to mention all the companies that provide equipment to hospitals, drugs, that build and maintain facilities, etc.

Thats just the obvious ramification. Then there is the effect to the economy from having poor and seniors without healthcare. Now you have workers out sick or unable to work because they have no healthcare. You have workers having to leave work because they have to care for a parent or grandparent who now is sick and disabled because they have little to no access to healthcare. (that total hip, total knee, operation is what helped keep grandma and grandpa in their own home and able to care for themselves).

Now you flippantly saying "well providers will rush to provide care". Well why? Medicare and medicaid filled a need that the private industry simply wouldn't and couldn't fill. There is no indication that providers will rush to loose money.
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You know we're talking about federal spending, not the entire industry right? There is plenty of indication providers will rush into GAIN that trillions being saved. Its called supply and demand.
 
GOP Hippo said:
They are waiting till right before the end to drop a huge bill on the 22nd that is 2,000 pages. Too much to read before the vote. Still they will vote for it. Everyone on the left and plenty of ignorant Republicans will pass it without a clue what they are voting for. Included will be raising the debt ceiling and trillions in spending.
NOTE: Printing money you don't have causes soaring inflation. Even when Biden is President massive deficit spending causes soaring inflation whether you blame him or not.
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Please explain how the government can produce something that it "doesn't have." This kind of logic fascinates me.
 
jonny5 said:
You know we're talking about federal spending, not the entire industry right? There is plenty of indication providers will rush into GAIN that trillions being saved. Its called supply and demand.
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If the savings come from the government not spending money, what, exactly, would providers be rushing in to gain?
 
JohnfrmClevelan said:
Please explain how the government can produce something that it "doesn't have." This kind of logic fascinates me.
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Did I say the government was producing something?
 
jonny5 said:
No, whatever system people or local govts come up with that they feel works best for them. How is not my job other than for myself. Your healthcare is your responsibility.
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That’s a cop out. Seniors consume the most health care resources. That’s why insurance companies consider them unprofitable and didn’t want to write them policies. That’s why Medicare was created.
 
jonny5 said:
You know we're talking about federal spending, not the entire industry right? There is plenty of indication providers will rush into GAIN that trillions being saved. Its called supply and demand.
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Yes..we are talking about federal spending
Medicare and Medicaid.
Medicare alone accounts for 20% of all healthcare spending in the us.
Indications of what?
How are providers going to rush to " gain" the millions saved?.
Taking away Medicare reduces demand by 20%.
Medicaid probably another 15 percent..perhaps more.
 
jaeger19 said:
Yes..we are talking about federal spending
Medicare and Medicaid.
Medicare alone accounts for 20% of all healthcare spending in the us.
Indications of what?
How are providers going to rush to " gain" the millions saved?.
Taking away Medicare reduces demand by 20%.
Medicaid probably another 15 percent..perhaps more.
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NOt just medicare and medicaid, ALL federal healthcare. SCHIP, Obamacare, etc. But how federal got not funding it reduce demand? If the federal govt doesnt fund it, the demand is still there for healthcare. Ending medicare means no payroll tax, so thats extra money in peoples pockets, plus the savings from getting rid of all that bureaucracy . And theres still demand for elderly, poor, childrens, uninsured to get care. That demand will be supplied somewhere else.

But again, all of that is moot. The ramifications, like tax cuts, dont matter. This is about fixing the debt, and for me, increasing my liberty. If youre concerned about healthcare, thats YOUR concerned, not the US govt.
 
jonny5 said:
NOt just medicare and medicaid, ALL federal healthcare. SCHIP, Obamacare, etc. But how federal got not funding it reduce demand? If the federal govt doesnt fund it, the demand is still there for healthcare. Ending medicare means no payroll tax, so thats extra money in peoples pockets, plus the savings from getting rid of all that bureaucracy . And theres still demand for elderly, poor, childrens, uninsured to get care. That demand will be supplied somewhere else.

But again, all of that is moot. The ramifications, like tax cuts, dont matter. This is about fixing the debt, and for me, increasing my liberty. If youre concerned about healthcare, thats YOUR concerned, not the US govt.
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well, we will be taking your money to pay for those programs while you yell at the sky as loud as you can.
 
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