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Why is the Left so Pro-immigration ?

NoLeftNoRight

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Allowing immigration in some ways can be a good, humanitarian thing is many cases. Much more so 100 years ago or more when this nation needed people and needed human resources.
And...those coming here really wanted to integrate and become "American".....not come here and change America into the place they fled as is the case today.

However, in light of the modern world, the hatred, the vast differences in culture, the population, the masses competing for dwindling resources, why does the Left by and large feel open borders is a good policy? Charles Schumer for one has promised all out war against Trumps desire to limit immigration at least unit proper procedures for vetting cam be established.

We as a nation are already chest deep in debt, we have a greatly diminished manufacturing sector, our welfare system is in maximum overdrive.....WHY? Why does the Left continue to push for open borders and easy immigration? Do they not see the dangers? Do they not realize that resources are limited and that "someone" has to pay for every immigrant that is granted free services and government subsidies?

The easy answer of course is that they do it because immigrants will mostly vote Democrat and without immigrant votes, their power base will weaken...but is this truth or just a Right wing myth?

Personally, it seems like madness to me to want open borders. We have a recent example to base our opinions on, Germany, and it's ugly and supports the notion that unvetted mass acceptance of immigrants from certain parts of the world is a recipe for disaster. yet even this does not discourage the Left from fighting tooth and nail for open borders and allowing in anyone and everyone.

WHY?
 

SmokeAndMirrors

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Allowing immigration in some ways can be a good, humanitarian thing is many cases. Much more so 100 years ago or more when this nation needed people and needed human resources.
And...those coming here really wanted to integrate and become "American".....not come here and change America into the place they fled as is the case today.

However, in light of the modern world, the hatred, the vast differences in culture, the population, the masses competing for dwindling resources, why does the Left by and large feel open borders is a good policy? Charles Schumer for one has promised all out war against Trumps desire to limit immigration at least unit proper procedures for vetting cam be established.

We as a nation are already chest deep in debt, we have a greatly diminished manufacturing sector, our welfare system is in maximum overdrive.....WHY? Why does the Left continue to push for open borders and easy immigration? Do they not see the dangers? Do they not realize that resources are limited and that "someone" has to pay for every immigrant that is granted free services and government subsidies?

The easy answer of course is that they do it because immigrants will mostly vote Democrat and without immigrant votes, their power base will weaken...but is this truth or just a Right wing myth?

Personally, it seems like madness to me to want open borders. We have a recent example to base our opinions on, Germany, and it's ugly and supports the notion that unvetted mass acceptance of immigrants from certain parts of the world is a recipe for disaster. yet even this does not discourage the Left from fighting tooth and nail for open borders and allowing in anyone and everyone.

WHY?

First, they don't necessarily want "open borders." A few do, but it doesn't seem to be an especially popular opinion on the left. They're just generally opposed to things like immigration-policy-by-outright-bigotry, or banning legal immigrants while they're mid-flight to America after going through a 2-year-process to get their now-worthless green card.

America is actually not densely populated at all and has plenty of room to expand if it wants to, and furthermore, immigrants actually tend to commit fewer crimes than natives, and are very good about paying their taxes.

Also, America lets in very few immigrants, relative to its population and most other developed nations. It's certainly nothing like Germany who, let's keep in mind, have literal open borders with like 20 different countries.

In other words, none of the things you've heard on talk radio about America's immigration policy or what "the other guy" supports are actually true, here in reality.

So I can't answer your question, since it's based on stuff that doesn't actually exist.
 

AtlantaAdonis

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Because diversity is the greatest thing to ever happen to America, and because we are a country of immigrants.
 

Koke

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Because diversity is the greatest thing to ever happen to America, and because we are a country of immigrants.

How is diversity great? Immigrants mostly from Europe, there's a difference.
 

KevinKohler

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How is diversity great? Immigrants mostly from Europe, there's a difference.

I like Chinese food, Thai food, German beer, French cheese, Mexican food, Cuban food, etc.

Diversity of culture cannot be achieved without immigration.
 

jimbo

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Because diversity is the greatest thing to ever happen to America, and because we are a country of immigrants.

We are not a country of immigrants. The vast majority of legal occupants were born here and remain here by choice. It would be correct to say that we are a country of immigrant ancestors, but that's a different mixing pot.

Likewise diversity. How is diversity the greatest thing to ever happen. I'd rate diversity
about 648th behind winning the Revolutionary War and becoming a country. The Constitution, The lucky early on break of having perhaps the greatest assembly of statesmen ever to make both happen. The abolishment of slavery. The winning of both WWI and WWII. You get the idea.
 

eohrnberger

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There is a difference between legal immigration, which hardly anyone is against, and illegal immigration, which many are against.

Diversity is a good thing, however, it can't at the expense of e pluribus unum, meaning that there needs to be cultural and value assimilation by the legal immigrants.

This is not to say forcing the legal immigrants to give up their culture from the old country, but they do need to recognize that there is an existing and prevalent value system and culture in place that shouldn't be superseded, i.e. When in Rome . . .
 

Koke

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I like Chinese food, Thai food, German beer, French cheese, Mexican food, Cuban food, etc.

Diversity of culture cannot be achieved without immigration.

So food is the lone virtue of multiculturalism?
 

DifferentDrummr

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There is a difference between legal immigration, which hardly anyone is against, and illegal immigration, which many are against.

Diversity is a good thing, however, it can't at the expense of e pluribus unum, meaning that there needs to be cultural and value assimilation by the legal immigrants.

This is not to say forcing the legal immigrants to give up their culture from the old country, but they do need to recognize that there is an existing and prevalent value system and culture in place that shouldn't be superseded, i.e. When in Rome . . .

The majority of the left does not support illegal immigration.
 

eohrnberger

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The majority of the left does not support illegal immigration.

Didn't make the claim that they were.

"legal immigration, which hardly anyone is against, and illegal immigration, which many are against."

There are some open border supporters, which I think is a foolhardy, ill-informed, and not based in reality position.
 

notquiteright

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So food is the lone virtue of multiculturalism?

Go to any medical facility and see the doctor's list. read about research advances and see the names attached. See who paves our streets, builds our houses, hell works in the chicken processing plants. It really doesn't take much to see there is an advantage to a nation of many ethnic origins. See a list of names of those who died in our recent wars. read the names of our LEOs, our firemen, our EMTs.

so no and I doubt anyone would think that... :peace
 

Koke

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Go to any medical facility and see the doctor's list. read about research advances and see the names attached. See who paves our streets, builds our houses, hell works in the chicken processing plants. It really doesn't take much to see there is an advantage to a nation of many ethnic origins. See a list of names of those who died in our recent wars. read the names of our LEOs, our firemen, our EMTs.

so no and I doubt anyone would think that... :peace

Actually, if you look at the diversity of countries and compare it to their average IQ... it seems that the more diverse a country, the lower their collective average IQ.

IQ has a lot to do with the success of country as well.

The US is a little different when it comes to immigration when compared to Europe. The United States is much more forceful with their assimilation than Europe is, or at least it was. With the welfare state and mass immigration, however, immigrants don't need to assimilate. The welfare state is not only catastrophic at home, but for people incoming as well.
 

notquiteright

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We are not a country of immigrants. The vast majority of legal occupants were born here and remain here by choice. It would be correct to say that we are a country of immigrant ancestors, but that's a different mixing pot. Likewise diversity. How is diversity the greatest thing to ever happen. I'd rate diversity. about 648th behind winning the Revolutionary War and becoming a country. The Constitution, The lucky early on break of having perhaps the greatest assembly of statesmen ever to make both happen. The abolishment of slavery. The winning of both WWI and WWII. You get the idea.

Well to be clear- that 'different' melting pot had as bigoted 'nativists' as this one now. The Irish, the Germans, the Poles were all seen as inferior to the English. They were as ridiculed in their day as the Hispanics are now. And let's not forget the Asians, not even allowed in until WWII... :roll:

Our nation has been becoming more and more diverse since the Founding Fathers and some would opine if not for the massive floods of Irish, Germans and Poles the Federals would have been hard pressed to fill the uniforms of their units in defeating the South.

We tend to ignore the effects diversity have had in the past if we only see 'us' vs 'them' without historic context when viewing the latest wave of immigrants.
 

notquiteright

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Actually, if you look at the diversity of countries and compare it to their average IQ... it seems that the more diverse a country, the lower their collective average IQ. IQ has a lot to do with the success of country as well. The US is a little different when it comes to immigration when compared to Europe. The United States is much more forceful with their assimilation than Europe is, or at least it was. With the welfare state and mass immigration, however, immigrants don't need to assimilate. The welfare state is not only catastrophic at home, but for people incoming as well.

V-dare usually harps on IQ. Where do you gets this ahhhhh 'fact'??? Fact is we don't need to all be high IQ people to defeat Nazi Germany, or land a man on the moon first. We need as many folks willing to do the very dirtiest of jobs to keep our nation running. We get much of the cream of the high IQ types from around the world as any hospital or research center will show you.

Immigrants assimilate as well as any past group, you forget little Italy, Warsaw, Dublin in our major cities back when we were 'more forceful'????

Selective history is how we wound up in Iraq, that wasn't a high IQ move- wanna blame that on the immigrants as well??? :peace
 

Koke

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V-dare usually harps on IQ. Where do you gets this ahhhhh 'fact'??? Fact is we don't need to all be high IQ people to defeat Nazi Germany, or land a man on the moon first. We need as many folks willing to do the very dirtiest of jobs to keep our nation running. We get much of the cream of the high IQ types from around the world as any hospital or research center will show you.

Immigrants assimilate as well as any past group, you forget little Italy, Warsaw, Dublin in our major cities back when we were 'more forceful'????

Selective history is how we wound up in Iraq, that wasn't a high IQ move- wanna blame that on the immigrants as well??? :peace

Lol you just named all European groups who assimilated fairly well together. That's they are usually high intelligence well functioning societies. Their cultures might be different, but they all function fairly similarly.

Iraq has nothing to do with IQ. It's electing neolib and neocon warhawks in our government who are there for money and the corruption. Not sure how you think these two correlate.
 

Grim17

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Because diversity is the greatest thing to ever happen to America, and because we are a country of immigrants.

LMMFAO... It's because immigrants tend to vote democrat, so the more the better.

.
 

jimbo

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Well to be clear- that 'different' melting pot had as bigoted 'nativists' as this one now. The Irish, the Germans, the Poles were all seen as inferior to the English. They were as ridiculed in their day as the Hispanics are now. And let's not forget the Asians, not even allowed in until WWII... :roll:

Our nation has been becoming more and more diverse since the Founding Fathers and some would opine if not for the massive floods of Irish, Germans and Poles the Federals would have been hard pressed to fill the uniforms of their units in defeating the South.

We tend to ignore the effects diversity have had in the past if we only see 'us' vs 'them' without historic context when viewing the latest wave of immigrants.

"Because diversity is the greatest thing to ever happen to America, and because we are a country of immigrants."

The post I was responding to. I happen to disagree with both statements. Especially when they are being used as an excuse to allow free and open borders and to allow illegal entry.
 

NoLeftNoRight

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Well to be clear- that 'different' melting pot had as bigoted 'nativists' as this one now. The Irish, the Germans, the Poles were all seen as inferior to the English. They were as ridiculed in their day as the Hispanics are now. And let's not forget the Asians, not even allowed in until WWII... :roll:

Our nation has been becoming more and more diverse since the Founding Fathers and some would opine if not for the massive floods of Irish, Germans and Poles the Federals would have been hard pressed to fill the uniforms of their units in defeating the South.
We tend to ignore the effects diversity have had in the past if we only see 'us' vs 'them' without historic context when viewing the latest wave of immigrants.

You are comparing the modern world with the way the world was 100 - 150 years ago or more.

People are not coming here now to assimilate or be productive. The majority are coming here for the free American gravy train...paid for by your taxes and mine.
 

NoLeftNoRight

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LMMFAO... It's because immigrants tend to vote democrat, so the more the better.
.

I was trying to keep an open mind and not insinuate this even if it's true. To a large extent I agree. However you can see some have already rebuked that as expected.
 

NoLeftNoRight

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First, they don't necessarily want "open borders." A few do, but it doesn't seem to be an especially popular opinion on the left.

This may be true. And it's why this thread was posed as a question rather than a statement. Maybe there should be a poll.


They're just generally opposed to things like immigration-policy-by-outright-bigotry, or banning legal immigrants while they're mid-flight to America after going through a 2-year-process to get their now-worthless green card.

Speaking of bigotry, it is well documented that Mr. Obama's administration was quite bigoted in that the percentage of Christian immigrants allowed by his administration was far proportionately less than Muslim immigrants from the same regions.
Documented: Obama?s ?Traditional Muslim Bias? against Christians
So on this point it's important to point out that Mr. Trump is not showing any degree of "bigotry" unusual for recent presidents. At least the last one.
In fact, my opinion would be that Trump is showing less "bigotry" since there is a foundation for his concerns and most Americans share those concerns for our safety following a number of tragic incidents both domestic and abroad that were tied to Muslim activity.

America is actually not densely populated at all and has plenty of room to expand if it wants to, and furthermore, immigrants actually tend to commit fewer crimes than natives, and are very good about paying their taxes.

Land area is not a good judge of a nations ability to support a growing population. Especially when statistics show a major percentage of that immigrant population will end up with considerable taxpayer subsidies. ** Edit time may expire before I can get the link for this posted here....**


Also, America lets in very few immigrants, relative to its population and most other developed nations. It's certainly nothing like Germany who, let's keep in mind, have literal open borders with like 20 different countries.

Would you please post your source on the metrics and number of immigrants America has allowed in over the last 20 years? Thank you.


In other words, none of the things you've heard on talk radio about America's immigration policy or what "the other guy" supports are actually true, here in reality.

"None". That is too broad a brush to paint an accurate picture. CLEARLY some of the things you hear ARE accurate.

So I can't answer your question, since it's based on stuff that doesn't actually exist.


We are not, as a nation, in debt? That doesn't exist you say? The majority of immigrants don't come here seeking to bring their culture with them and keep them? So the majority of Hispanics have taken on themselves to learn English you are saying? Please visit Miami Florida. Resistance to integration does not exist? Germany is not having problems with immigrants you say? That "does not exist" as you say?
I think you may be uninformed or naive....or both.
 
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NoLeftNoRight

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I'm sure a small number of people on the left think like that. However, most don't.

Do we actually know how immigrants tend to vote? The "small number of people on the left who think like that", are unfortunately the leftist politicians who have the legislative power to get them here regardless of what their constituency feels? Which begs the question...if they are going against their constituents, why would those constituents repeatedly re-elect them?
 
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NoLeftNoRight

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It should also be pointed out that had Democrats in power in Washington followed the LAW on immigration, Mr. Trump would not need to take these actions.

It is IMPERATIVE that SOMEONE stand up and make sure the laws that are good for America ARE enforced.

Mr. Trump happens to be the first President in some time who is willing to follow the law.

Because the law breaking regarding immigration has been so widespread and for so long, people have gotten used to it and now demand their "rights" to ignore the laws.

Sad
 

DifferentDrummr

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Do we actually know how immigrants tend to vote? The "small number of people on the left who think like that", are unfortunately the leftist politicians who have the legislative power to get them here regardless of what their constituency feels? Which begs the question...if they are going against their constituents, why would those constituents repeatedly re-elect them?

The same applies to Republican politicians who never bring any jobs into their districts.
 
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