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Why is it wrong to kill a human?

Noodlegawd

Noodlegawd

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In our abortion discussions, we're often told that abortion is wrong because it kills of a human. We often argue over whether a zygote, embryo, or fetus is really a human, at least in any meaningful sense, but we never really get down to why that matters.

There's no question that a zygote/embryo/fetus is not the same thing as a newborn infant for at least a considerable portion of a pregnancy. It has some things in common with one, but lacks many others.

So a fundamental question we should ask ourselves and discuss is why we think it is wrong to kill a human in the first place. What's so special about the humans who we all agree that it's wrong to kill and, whatever that is, why does it supposedly apply to a zygote, embryo, or fetus?
 
Tlrmln said:
In our abortion discussions, we're often told that abortion is wrong because it kills of a human. We often argue over whether a zygote, embryo, or fetus is really a human, at least in any meaningful sense, but we never really get down to why that matters.

There's no question that a zygote/embryo/fetus is not the same thing as a newborn infant for at least a considerable portion of a pregnancy. It has some things in common with one, but lacks many others.

So a fundamental question we should ask ourselves and discuss is why we think it is wrong to kill a human in the first place. What's so special about the humans who we all agree that it's wrong to kill and, whatever that is, why does it supposedly apply to a zygote, embryo, or fetus?
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This is a can of worms I don't think someone like yourself can afford to open
 
Tlrmln said:
In our abortion discussions, we're often told that abortion is wrong because it kills of a human. We often argue over whether a zygote, embryo, or fetus is really a human, at least in any meaningful sense, but we never really get down to why that matters.

There's no question that a zygote/embryo/fetus is not the same thing as a newborn infant for at least a considerable portion of a pregnancy. It has some things in common with one, but lacks many others.

So a fundamental question we should ask ourselves and discuss is why we think it is wrong to kill a human in the first place. What's so special about the humans who we all agree that it's wrong to kill and, whatever that is, why does it supposedly apply to a zygote, embryo, or fetus?
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You need an explanation of why it's wrong to kill a human? Would you be OK if you were the one killed, or someone in your family?
 
Crovax said:
This is a can of worms I don't think someone like yourself can afford to open
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Why "someone like" myself, in particular?
 
Fishking said:
You need an explanation of why it's wrong to kill a human? Would you be OK if you were the one killed, or someone in your family?
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No, I don't need an explanation specifically, anti-abortion people do. I've asked this question many times to them directly, and their response was about as meaningful as yours, essentially amounting to "just cuz."
 
Tlrmln said:
In our abortion discussions, we're often told that abortion is wrong because it kills of a human. We often argue over whether a zygote, embryo, or fetus is really a human, at least in any meaningful sense, but we never really get down to why that matters.

There's no question that a zygote/embryo/fetus is not the same thing as a newborn infant for at least a considerable portion of a pregnancy. It has some things in common with one, but lacks many others.

So a fundamental question we should ask ourselves and discuss is why we think it is wrong to kill a human in the first place. What's so special about the humans who we all agree that it's wrong to kill and, whatever that is, why does it supposedly apply to a zygote, embryo, or fetus?
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Most people can rationalize killing a human at some point; why it suddenly becomes acceptable, why the person they kill deserves to be killed, and why they didn't have a choice. What makes killing a human wrong, unacceptable, and offensive to people in psychologically healthy societies free of political and ethnic violence is when people are killed in a psychopathic manner. Psychopaths enjoy torturing and murdering. Inflicting human suffering is enjoyable and fun. They are emotionally unhealthy, antisocial, and dangerous. Psychopaths make communities feel unsafe, especially if they prey on the community like a serial killer, but society often turns around and moralizes killing psychopaths as punishment because it helps them feel safe and in control again.
 
Tlrmln said:
No, I don't need an explanation specifically, anti-abortion people do. I've asked this question many times to them directly, and their response was about as meaningful as yours, essentially amounting to "just cuz."
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Not really. Laws against killing other humans are pretty integral to having a functioning society. Do you propose rule by anarchy and warlords?
 
Fishking said:
Not really. Laws against killing other humans are pretty integral to having a functioning society. Do you propose rule by anarchy and warlords?
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I didn't ask about laws. I asked why it's wrong. But if I may extrapolate, are you saying that killing humans is wrong, generally speaking, because it would be harmful to a functioning society?
 
Aletheia said:
When FOX said old people should risk dying to help businesses, I guess their logic is that business profits were more important than lives?
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How would old people help businesses by risking death?
 
Tlrmln said:
How would old people help businesses by risking death?
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Go look up FOX excerpts to inform yourself. If you come up with a different reason, please post here. I'd be interested to see the alternative explanation.
 
Tlrmln said:
I didn't ask about laws. I asked why it's wrong. But if I may extrapolate, are you saying that killing humans is wrong, generally speaking, because it would be harmful to a functioning society?
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Killing a human is not wrong, but it is an unacceptable way to gain merit, so society imposes a punishment.
 
Aletheia said:
Go look up FOX excerpts to inform yourself. If you come up with a different reason, please post here. I'd be interested to see the alternative explanation.
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Sorry, it's your claim, and a bizarrely vague one at that. I'm not going to hunt through an entire news website to try to figure out your point or find evidence for it. If you don't want to explain it or back it up with anything, that's fine. I'll just ignore it.
 
Tlrmln said:
Sorry, it's your claim, and a bizarrely vague one at that. I'm not going to hunt through an entire news website to try to figure out your point or find evidence for it. If you don't want to explain it or back it up with anything, that's fine. I'll just ignore it.
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Not gong to do your research for you. It's common knowledge and easy to look up, if you haven't already.
 
Aletheia said:
Not gong to do your research for you. It's common knowledge and easy to look up, if you haven't already.
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Your claim, your research. Your statement isn't even coherent.

And in any case, stop trying to derail the thread.
 
Fishking said:
You need an explanation of why it's wrong to kill a human? Would you be OK if you were the one killed, or someone in your family?
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The rule of law is not about right or wrong. Those concepts are subjective, law is objective.

So, do you think that killing a human is wrong BECAUSE it's illegal?
 
Tlrmln said:
In our abortion discussions, we're often told that abortion is wrong because it kills of a human. We often argue over whether a zygote, embryo, or fetus is really a human, at least in any meaningful sense, but we never really get down to why that matters.

There's no question that a zygote/embryo/fetus is not the same thing as a newborn infant for at least a considerable portion of a pregnancy. It has some things in common with one, but lacks many others.

So a fundamental question we should ask ourselves and discuss is why we think it is wrong to kill a human in the first place. What's so special about the humans who we all agree that it's wrong to kill and, whatever that is, why does it supposedly apply to a zygote, embryo, or fetus?
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Tell me Tirmin, where do my weeds go when I weed the garden?

How about the cow or chicken? They have a heartbeat.

Upon being aborted the soul can say, "Well, I paid some debt, I should be able to get in a better line for next time." Or it can say, "I've been aborted, how am I going to get into any line now?"
 
If we categorically thought killing humans was wrong we wouldn't send soldiers to war and 27 states would not still have the death penalty. Apparently there are criteria that determine when it is ok and not ok to kill a human.
 
Exquisitor said:
Tell me Tirmin, where do my weeds go when I weed the garden?

How about the cow or chicken? They have a heartbeat.

Upon being aborted the soul can say, "Well, I paid some debt, I should be able to get in a better line for next time." Or it can say, "I've been aborted, how am I going to get into any line now?"
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Assuming one believes in souls...
 
Tlrmln said:
I didn't ask about laws. I asked why it's wrong. But if I may extrapolate, are you saying that killing humans is wrong, generally speaking, because it would be harmful to a functioning society?
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Yeah...the explanation I added to why the laws exists explains the why. You wouldn't have an amazing society to live in if people could kill whoever. Like I said, it would result in warlords and such ruling everything, even then, the warlords would have rules about killing others. They just might be only not be allowed to kill inside their own tribe/group.
 
Tlrmln said:
In our abortion discussions, we're often told that abortion is wrong because it kills of a human. We often argue over whether a zygote, embryo, or fetus is really a human, at least in any meaningful sense, but we never really get down to why that matters.

There's no question that a zygote/embryo/fetus is not the same thing as a newborn infant for at least a considerable portion of a pregnancy. It has some things in common with one, but lacks many others.

So a fundamental question we should ask ourselves and discuss is why we think it is wrong to kill a human in the first place. What's so special about the humans who we all agree that it's wrong to kill and, whatever that is, why does it supposedly apply to a zygote, embryo, or fetus?
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In the evolution of mankind, the reason we survived as a species is because of our cooperation with each other. We were interdependent. Our families, and by extension our tribes, would not have survived, were it not for our cooperation with our own species. We hunted, gathered, defended and cared for one another because our own lives depended on it. Our interdependence on other human life makes the inviolability of human life hard wired into our DNA.

Our species, in the most fundamental way, honors human life because without it, we perish. Any proto-human species that didn't feel that way would have become extinct.
 
Argent said:
If we categorically thought killing humans was wrong we wouldn't send soldiers to war and 27 states would not still have the death penalty. Apparently there are criteria that determine when it is ok and not ok to kill a human.
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What are some of those criteria?
 
Fishking said:
Yeah...the explanation I added to why the laws exists explains the why. You wouldn't have an amazing society to live in if people could kill whoever. Like I said, it would result in warlords and such ruling everything, even then, the warlords would have rules about killing others. They just might be only not be allowed to kill inside their own tribe/group.
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So...laws.....governing when and who we can kill and why...establishes a society in which we can all reasonably prosper and be happy?
 
Tlrmln said:
What are some of those criteria?
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Lemme take a guess -- killing people during war is protecting the country so that it makes ok; killing people who commit certain types of crimes is ok because we don't like those people; killing zefs is ok because women think they should have agency over their bodies. There are laws that allow those killings.
 
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