Why I'm an anti-anti American.

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

10 things to celebrate
Why I'm an anti-anti-American



Dinesh D'Souza
Sunday, June 29, 2003

America is under attack as never before -- not only from terrorists but also from people who provide a justification for terrorism. Islamic fundamentalists declare America the Great Satan. Europeans rail against American capitalism and American culture. South American activists denounce the United States for "neocolonialism" and oppression.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2003/06/29/IN290713.DTL

 

[Urethra Franklin]

Scraping the barrel eh Trajan? "Today's" news, an article that's nearly 3 years old?

As you've posted it anyway - D'Souza's tone says it all. Rather than seeing foreign criticism as what it is - criticism (and I speak NOT of terrorist acts), he sees European or South American 'railing' as the US under attack. The Bush mentality that if you're not with us you're against us. It's exactly this immature, unintellectual, black and white perspective that has led to the mess in Iraq, a rise in Islamic terrorism, increasing hostility towards United Statesians when they travel abroad etc. Rather than asking "why does the entire world today not like what we're doing" and engaging in debate, it's straight on the defensive and into "let's nuke the muzzies" mode.

Very few people are anti-American, since America is of course a marvelous vast continent, country by country seeing sense and electing left wing governments. What many people are is anti-United Statesian, being long fed up with years of arrogace in US foreign policy, and constant attempts at political and cultural hegemony. If you'd like an end to being denounced for neocolonialism and oppression, get your government to stop it.

 

[Comrade Brian]

Also Trojan, you started a same exact thread in August:
http://debatepolitics.com/showthread.php?t=3218

 

[Inuyasha]

Can you spell "persecution complex"?

 

[KCConservative]

Trajan: I'm glad to see that article again. It's good to be reminded of why this country is so great and why she is worth fighting for..

 

[Axismaster]

Amen, as sucky as things have become in this country with the Patriot Act, more regulations, too many taxes, and other lost freedom, we are still freer than Europe.

 

[mikhail]

Hmmm this guy is slightly mistaken in this he seems to be american and proud but talks negatively about the place he came from.

I dont think anyone would dispute its far better to live in America than in most countries in the world.

as for social mobility hasnt it been dropping constantly over the last few decades.In any country there is examples of people who go from nothing to rich.


America because of it military and economic advantage over the rest of the world will always attract critcism because its foriegn policy is highly important.Alot of people in the middle east do hate America and there is reasons behind this that nobody can dismiss.

America is also alot less liberal than many countries in europe but this is more like a difference in opinions than pure hate.But there is criticisms to be made of any of the empires that have been the dominant force in the world and i should think there always will be.

 

[millsy]

I live in Finland right now, so I believe I have a decent understanding of the anti-American sentiment that exists in Europe right now. I really see it as not an ant-American, but rather anti George W. Bush, anti war in Iraq feeling. People here are fascinated by life in America and want to know about it, and want to travel there. I get the feeling that the people here are not full of hate, but rather are worried about where America is going.

What is really interesting is that I have a friend here who is from New Jersey who is a conservative republican, who does a lot of grassroot work for the republican party and stands very firmly behind President Bush. He sees it a little differently than I do (I am very liberal.........yes we have good fights). He sees the current Republican administration as a great representation of what is "a real American" and that disapproval of the administration is disapproval of America.

I of course disagree with that, and do not think that President Bush represents "real Americans" and neither do most of the people who have talked to me about why they "don't like" America.

Of course all of this is just an anecdote, so take it for what you will.

 

[Urethra Franklin]

, we are still freer than Europe.

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

In your dreams

 

[Inuyasha]

You 'd better be able to prove that or its just plain BS. Where, when and for how long have you lived in Europe?I don't think you have AFI and you just talking through the tube here.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

In your dreams

If you don't have the right of property then how can you consider yourselves to be free?

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Hmmm this guy is slightly mistaken in this he seems to be american and proud but talks negatively about the place he came from.

I dont think anyone would dispute its far better to live in America than in most countries in the world.

as for social mobility hasnt it been dropping constantly over the last few decades.In any country there is examples of people who go from nothing to rich.


America because of it military and economic advantage over the rest of the world will always attract critcism because its foriegn policy is highly important.Alot of people in the middle east do hate America and there is reasons behind this that nobody can dismiss.

America is also alot less liberal than many countries in europe but this is more like a difference in opinions than pure hate.But there is criticisms to be made of any of the empires that have been the dominant force in the world and i should think there always will be.

Except we are not an empire we are a Republic.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

You 'd better be able to prove that or its just plain BS. Where, when and for how long have you lived in Europe?I don't think you have AFI and you just talking through the tube here.

With out control over your own property then you can not be free.

 

[Inuyasha]

With out control over your own property then you can not be free.

What the hell does that mean with regard to Europe TOT?

 

[Comrade Brian]

Except we are not an empire we are a Republic.

The US is an empire. Anyways Trojan, you still try to deny facts.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

The US is an empire. Anyways Trojan, you still try to deny facts.

The United States of America is a Republic, for good or ill that's what it is. I don't deny facts I sometimes wish we were an empire so that I might do what I wish with enemies of the state, but alas, juris prudence and habeas corpus, you lucky ****.


Give me empire and I shall show you what it means to be a tyrant.

 

[IceteaGreen]

With out control over your own property then you can not be free.

I would also love to hear what does it means too, as we have full property here in Belgium, and Europe (just bought a nice li'll house atm btw...yay :2razz: )

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

I would also love to hear what does it means too, as we have full property here in Belgium, and Europe (just bought a nice li'll house atm btw...yay :2razz: )

What's your taxation rate? Appx 37.5%? How can that be considered freedom of property?

 

[Inuyasha]

What's your taxation rate? Appx 37.5%? How can that be considered freedom of property?

Where in the world did you get that figure. You better go to Europe and buy some property. My property taxes in Chicago are much higher than the eax I oay on my Spanish property which I have owned since 1976 and I am nit even a citizen of that country. You have a very vivid imagunation. Check these things out before you make such foolish and silly statements You have NFI what is going on.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

What the hell does that mean with regard to Europe TOT?

Well in socialist nations freedom of property is a dream.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Where in the world did you get that figure. You better go to Europe and buy some property. My property taxes in Chicago are much higher than the eax I oay on my Spanish property which I have owned since 1976 and I am nit even a citizen of that country. You have a very vivid imagunation. Check these things out before you make such foolish and silly statements You have NFI what is going on.

Well Chicago isn't much better than Europe, if you owned your Spanish property since 1976 I can guarantee that it will not be passed down to your son. Your property will be taken and made to serve the public good.

 

[Urethra Franklin]

Well Chicago isn't much better than Europe, if you owned your Spanish property since 1976 I can guarantee that it will not be passed down to your son. Your property will be taken and made to serve the public good.

Time to wake up trajan. Your dream's gone on a bit too long.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Time to wake up trajan. Your dream's gone on a bit too long.

A dream? Excuse me sir or ms. why is it that you people try to come here so frequently to get out of the sh!t hole that you call Europe?

I mean I know I'm not trying to move to Europe but it seems like so many Europeans want to move here, that's a bit off from the speech which we so often hear from your countrymen wouldn't you agree? Oh that's right you don't have countrymen do you?

What is Europes population growth rate again? I believe you have more people leaving your decaying states than you do have people being born, your's is a dying civilization, good riddance to bad rubbish I say.

 

[Urethra Franklin]

A dream? Excuse me sir or ms. why is it that you people try to come here so frequently to get out of the sh!t hole that you call Europe?

I mean I know I'm not trying to move to Europe but it seems like so many Europeans want to move here, that's a bit off from the speech which we so often hear from your countrymen wouldn't you agree? Oh that's right you don't have countrymen do you?

What is Europes population growth rate again? I believe you have more people leaving your decaying states than you do have people being born, your's is a dying civilization, good riddance to bad rubbish I say.

Funny, but you can't move in Paris for United Statesians settling here for a bit of culture and civilization. Proof: the mulitple real estate agencies, American grocery stores and "American in France" periodicals - even (sadly) a flourishing American church and cathedral. It's rather a 2 way street love.
If you'd like to check France's birth rate, you'll find we have no worries, the average French family continuing to produce 3 children. As for other states with falling birthrates, more than enough immigrants are banging on the door for a taste of the good life.

 

[Inuyasha]

If you study the figures you will see that Western European immigration since the late 70's has dropped so low that there are no longer any quotas for those nations. Even the Irish who have always been the largest number of Western European illegals are no longer coming here and many who are here are leaving or have left for Ireland. The Western Europeans who come to the US come on specialty visa H-1B research, guest proffessors etc, A type for government personnel and B-1 reps of foreign companies.

The European immigrants who are flooding the US are the same ones who are flooding Western Europe like Romania, Pòland, Bulgaria the former Soviet countries like the Ukraine etc. I know this as fact because i work as an interpreter/translator for the INS in the Northern District. Please don't **** on my leg and tell me it's raining.

UF lets be fair. Culture is an accomplishment of the individual. I have met many Europeans whose idea of culture doesn't extend beyond yogurt. On the other hand, there are many Americans who are highly cultured. The uncouth American is more myth than truth. The is true of the stereotype obnoxious Frenchman or the snooty Englishman these are stereotypes that only the lowest bottom feeders would believe.