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Why Don't U.S. Socialists Understand That Total Government Power & Total Authoritarian Control Cannot Coexist With Freedom ?

Hey there Nomad! I feel bad for you, as the overwhelming majority of the US population couldn't handle the concepts of Libertarian Socialism. It doesn't distill down very well to a blue vs. red debate.
It does seem to make a lot of people short circuit. Though I don't know that's a US specific problem, as there are only like 3 areas on Earth where the majority of the local population is amicable to the ideas of libertarian socialism.
 
The number one reason cited by American workers for why they don’t participate is because our shitty working environments. Maybe if American capitalists weren’t garbage at running workplaces, setting work schedules, providing decent pay and benefits, etc, our worker participation rate would be higher.

But they only care about maximized short term profits.
Why don't your " Scandinavian" countries have this problem .
Their capitalists are mostly white .
 
It's not like history is not filled with step by step instructions of exactly how to institute and maintain total mandated compliance of the populace .
How is it they still do not know what is required ?
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Greta post! a nice combo of ignorance and fear mongering.
 
That's my nomination for most pathetic post of the week.

History shows a movement away from authoritarianism and towards representation. A few hundred years ago, there were no free countries. Now there are many and more each generation.
yup
 
It's not like history is not filled with step by step instructions of exactly how to institute and maintain total mandated compliance of the populace .
How is it they still do not know what is required ?
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Yet it is the right that are the Putin lovers and want a "President for life" like Russia has. They are the ones to fear. The ones working with Putin to undermine this country and democracy.
 
But they love trump, love trump's relationship with putin and overlook everything putin has done.

This era is so dumb.
Trump is a fascist, praises dictators, and wants to be a dictator who rejects elections and creates a family dynasty but his supporters oppose authoritarian policies.


You cannot fix stupid.
 
Why don't your " Scandinavian" countries have this problem .
Their capitalists are mostly white .
What does white skin have to do with anything? Your racism is showing.

You somehow think that American progressives support an authoritarian government when we most certainly do not. Our views look more like Social-democratic Canada. I'm a market socialist, civil libertarian progressive, and my political views border on lefty anarchy.
 
What does white skin have to do with anything? Your racism is showing.

You somehow think that American progressives support an authoritarian government when we most certainly do not. Our views look more like Social-democratic Canada. I'm a market socialist, civil libertarian progressive, and my political views border on lefty anarchy.
So why don't Scandinavian countries have our capitalist problems ?
 
It's not like history is not filled with step by step instructions of exactly how to institute and maintain total mandated compliance of the populace .
How is it they still do not know what is required ?
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You're living in the past, man. The best way to gain or maintain perpetual totalitarianism is to control people's minds, the next best is to control their options, and only as a last resort to control their actions. Propaganda, psychological manipulation and computerized - even personalized - information manipulation these days has the potential to be vastly more advanced than even the Nazis or Soviets could accomplish. That then raises an interesting (if scary) question: If a few decades from now a state were able to arrange matters such that their citizens actually wanted to live under autocratic, oligarchic or plutocratic rule - happy to submit to whatever mandates the authorities deemed fit without the perceived risks and failures of democracy - would their freedoms actually be curtailed in any meaningful sense?
 
So why don't Scandinavian countries have our capitalist problems ?
Their governments have been given sufficient power to regulate the worst capitalist abuses and protect workers/consumers. Obviously.

You'd probably call that socialism
 
It does seem to make a lot of people short circuit. Though I don't know that's a US specific problem, as there are only like 3 areas on Earth where the majority of the local population is amicable to the ideas of libertarian socialism.
My guess is that all governments seek as much control and authority as they can get and use propaganda to discredit anything other than that system put in place. The US is just a perfect example. The system in the US, AKA the swamp, really doesn't care who is in charge as long as they are system democrats or system republicans. Everything else is to be discredited and demonized before any logical reflection can take place. Most, if not all the world's governments function this way. Anyway, the ideas of LibSoc are really interesting, but I can't see how they could be implemented by most populations today. It would require a much more sophisticated citizen, as well as modified economic and monetary systems, and all those are extremely difficult to change.
 
Why don't your " Scandinavian" countries have this problem .
Their capitalists are mostly white .

Interesting. So you think whites are naturally superior?

It could be that their capitalist companies are more highly regulated and they can’t engage in many of the practices American companies can that exploit their workers.
 
It's not like history is not filled with step by step instructions of exactly how to institute and maintain total mandated compliance of the populace .
How is it they still do not know what is required ?
Simple. They do. The problem is that you don't understand Socialism.
 
Everyone to have their every need looked after by government , OR ELSE !
Really ?
Well they are all just smiling and waving , aren't they ?
Our U.S. democrats will give lap dances to their socialist hero's !
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Why on earth would you hire representatives and then run away from them like you don't know how they got there?

In a well run society, the government works for you. You literally hire them to take care of things on your behalf.

You should move to Somalia, or the like, they literally have no government. Try it out.
 
So why don't Scandinavian countries have our capitalist problems ?
Racism has nothing to do with the inherently predatory problems of capitalism. White conservatives also seek to deny equal rights and opportunities to women, people of other religions, immigrants, and LGBT people too. This is a social problem of which race is just one aspect.
 
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Racism has nothing to do with the inherently predatory problems of capitalism. White conservatives also seek to deny equal rights and opportunities to women, people of other religions, immigrants, and LGBT people too. This is a social problem of which race is just one aspect.
So why don't white conservative Scandinavians deny equal rights to these other groups as well ?
 
1. The US has very few, if any, socialists. Most people are just liberals.
2. It is silly to just assume an outcome like China even if the US did become socialist.
3. The assumption is that there is either total freedom or total authoritarianism is silly and alarmist given that every successful advanced society has successfully navigated between those two extreme positions.
America was DESIGNED for Freedom and Liberty ! Not Socialism or "DEMOCRACY" !
For good reason !
 
Racism has nothing to do with the inherently predatory problems of capitalism. White conservatives also seek to deny equal rights and opportunities to women, people of other religions, immigrants, and LGBT people too. This is a social problem of which race is just one aspect.
Lisa.
Please show us the "Laws" that allows what you claim exists.
Not Laws that stop favoritism to one group(s) based on their Sex or Race etc.
Doesn't America have "Sexist" and "Racist" laws to combat Sexism and racism ?
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Lisa.
Please show us the "Laws" that allows what you claim exists.
Not Laws that stop favoritism to one group(s) based on their Sex or Race etc.
Doesn't America have "Sexist" and "Racist" laws to combat Sexism and racism ?
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The 1964 Civil Rights act prevents favoritism based on race, creed, color gender/sex, age, and disability. You should learn it. The Equal Protection Clause of the 14th Amdnement does the very same. The idea that they are rights shared equally by all not and privileges enjoyed by the majority or just some of the people also seems to be lost on you.

What supposed preferential treatment are you referring to?

So why don't white conservative Scandinavians deny equal rights to these other groups as well ?
Conservative Scandinavians are to the left of party-line Democrats in the US. They are not the fascists of the GOP.

Conservatives and Republicans in the US oppose the surrender at Appomattox courthouse and most recently, VE day. It is a long fall from the time when Republicans denounced traitors, racists and nazis instead of pandering to them.
 

Why Don't U.S. Socialists Understand That Total Government Power & Total Authoritarian Control Cannot Coexist With Freedom ?​



I reject the entire premise of the OP. It assumes fact not in evidence, and is ridiculous on its face.
Do you understand the bolded sentence? What part of "total governmentment power & total Authoritarian Control" do you not grasp? Total control and power doesn't ring any alarms?
 
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