Why Do You People Want War With Russia ?

[Helix]

eh my leader is Nicola Sturgeon first Minister of Scotland/Alba (Ala-Pa) ... and Putin is no dictator he was elected president of the Russian federation in a election America also tried interfere in


Americans voted Trump as president and not Russians .... the spending by RT.com and sputnik on US election in 2016 was a all time low going by both facebook and twitter ... blame your electoral college system for putting Trump in power

Most Americans didn't vote for him.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

It seems that you are confusing Russia with the former Soviet Union (USSR?) which Russia seems to want to reinstate, by force if necessary.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dissolution_of_the_Soviet_Union

Nope, Putin has no intention of reviving the USSR, or any other form of Communism.

"Anyone who doesn't regret the passing of the Soviet Union has no heart. Anyone who wants it restored has no brains." - Vladimir Putin

What Putin wants is the restoration of the old Imperial Russian Empire, that of the old czars.
Putin sees himself AS a czar.

 

[Dittohead not!]

Read the threads in this subforum and see how many posters here are fear mongering and calling for actions and military build ups to counter an alleged Rian aggression that is imo more of a case of a Russian reaction to Western aggression via its proxies

One way to avoid a war is to be prepared for the possibility of war and be strong enough to discourage attacks. Had we done that 41 years ago, this date may be called "Japan backed off Day" instead of "Pearl Harbor day."

And had we not been prepared back in '62, the day the Soviets backed off might have ended quite differently.

 

[Chagos]

thread fails completely from the outset by OP committing the logical fallacy of begging the question.

 

[oneworld2]

One way to avoid a war is to be prepared for the possibility of war and be strong enough to discourage attacks. Had we done that 41 years ago, this date may be called "Japan backed off Day" instead of "Pearl Harbor day."

And had we not been prepared back in '62, the day the Soviets backed off might have ended quite differently.

Bad examples using Pearl Harbour and the Cuban missile crisis

You surely know the decision was made to move the fleet there from a safer place ( san something or other name escapes me temporarily ) with an enormous supply chain so as to open it up to attack and thus give a pretext to enter the war. The fleet commander complained so bitterly about the decision and the vulnerability that he was sacked from his post

Also the Cuban missiles were a response to US missiles recently placed in Turkey

 

[oneworld2]

Wow someone really believes that Russian elections are free?

And yours most definitely are not free , being sold to the corporate world as they are

 

[oneworld2]

Link to the US calling for war?

I was referring to some of the posters here and their jingoism

 

[Dittohead not!]

Bad examples using Pearl Harbour and the Cuban missile crisis

1 You surely know the decision was made to move the fleet there from a safer place ( san something or other name escapes me temporarily ) with an enormous supply chain so as to open it up to attack and thus give a pretext to enter the war. The fleet commander complained so bitterly about the decision and the vulnerability that he was sacked from his post

2. Also the Cuban missiles were a response to US missiles recently placed in Turkey

1. Nothing like a good Roosevelt set up the ships for the Pearl Harbor attack in order to get his declaration of war conspiracy. Not a lot to back it up, but it makes for good conversation anyway.

2. Yes, I'm quite aware of that. I'm also aware that the US was far better prepared for an eventual war in 1962, and that Krushchev likely wouldn't have backed off had we not been.

 

[oneworld2]

They are, they support pro-Russian, often far-right parties sin order to sow division in Western democracies, especially those of the former Warsaw pact.

And the West doesn't support the right wing nutters as and when it suits them ? What about those neonazis in Ukraine for example ? What about all the right wing death squad governments the US propped up in Central and South America throughout the 1970s and 80's ? What about the Saudi head choppers they snuggle up to ?

 

[oneworld2]

1. Nothing like a good Roosevelt set up the ships for the Pearl Harbor attack in order to get his declaration of war conspiracy. Not a lot to back it up, but it makes for good conversation anyway.

2. Yes, I'm quite aware of that. I'm also aware that the US was far better prepared for an eventual war in 1962, and that Krushchev likely wouldn't have backed off had we not been.

The fact is that the US put missiles into Turkey first so the Cuban missile crisis was initiated by the US

Your history is replete with false flags and bogus attacks so much so nobody in their right mind should believe a word that comes out of the state dept , CIA etc etc

 

[WillyPete]

i don't want war with Russia. the smart strategy would be to build massive alternative energy generating infrastructure and phase out natural gas as quickly as possible. collapse the price of NG, and then tell Russia to shove the pipeline up its ass. do the same with petroleum. i'm sure that they'll have a wonderful time intimidating their neighbors after their economy collapses.

will Europe do that, though? i doubt it. the US should do the same thing and tell Saudi Arabia to shove it. there's an equally low chance of that. however, my strategy would be a better strategy and investment than a ****ing war.

This. Just think of where we would be today if we'd spent the last 50 odd years giving the third world modern infrastructures, instead of weapons.

 

[Godric1970]

Most Americans didn't vote for him.

i never said you did it was your electoral system that got him elected

 

[Divine_Wind]

Serious question , why do you people want war with Russia ?...

Who are "you people" and why do you think they want war with Russia? What affiliation, if any, do you have with Russia or Putin?

 

[Helix]

This. Just think of where we would be today if we'd spent the last 50 odd years giving the third world modern infrastructures, instead of weapons.

i agree.

 

[Helix]

i never said you did it was your electoral system that got him elected

our electoral college system doesn't work, and should be replaced, iMO.

 

[Divine_Wind]

our electoral college system doesn't work, and should be replaced, iMO.

It does work, but not without its faults. That said, good luck with a constitutional amendment changing it just like those who seek to get rid of the anchor baby clause in the 14th Amendment.

 

[Helix]

It does work, but not without its faults. That said, good luck with a constitutional amendment changing it just like those who seek to get rid of the anchor baby clause in the 14th Amendment.

it failed to prevent a dangerously unqualified candidate from becoming president, which was half of its purpose. i no longer support it.

 

[Bullseye]

And yours most definitely are not free , being sold to the corporate world as they are

Obama won twice yet his designated successor lost. Which corporations wanted that?

 

[maxparrish]

The fact is that the US put missiles into Turkey first so the Cuban missile crisis was initiated by the US

Your history is replete with false flags and bogus attacks so much so nobody in their right mind should believe a word that comes out of the state dept , CIA etc etc

Naturally this is want you want to believe; as predictable as the sunset. However, scholars don't believe this was the primary cause for Khrushchev's harebrained scheme. There have been many plausible motives and the fall of communism presented an opportunity to learn more. However, the Soviet archives have only added more questions than they answered, and made Khrushchev's actions all the more baffling.

Among the most plausible motives were as a prelude to put an end to the Berlin question and its destabilizing influence on oppressed East Germans; defend Cuba after the bay of pigs failure, and use it as a platform for further communist revolution in Latin America, and to instantly redress the Soviet ICBM missile gap that had favored the Americans. The inclusion of Turkey was an after thought to Khrushchev's original acceptance of Kennedy's and his terms.

 

[Divine_Wind]

it failed to prevent a dangerously unqualified candidate from becoming president, which was half of its purpose. i no longer support it.

Ummm....IMO that wasn't the fault of the Electoral College, that was the fault of the Democrats running a deplorable candidate.

 

[Geoist]

Serious question , why do you people want war with Russia ?

America only goes to war with countries it knows (or thinks) it can easily beat.

There is no threat of war with Russia.

 

[Geoist]

Oh so a bunch of leftists in Canada speak for western democracy now? Remember we [the West] have been meddling in other's elections for a long time.

We also have been invading other sovereign countries for a long time. I suppose we should just lay down if someone invaded ours?

 

[Helix]

Ummm....IMO that wasn't the fault of the Electoral College, that was the fault of the Democrats running a deplorable candidate.

the unappealing Democratic candidate didn't win the electoral college. the electoral college could have chosen anyone else. i'm fine with letting the popular vote elect the candidate, and the popular vote soundly rejecting that candidate in subsequent elections.

 

[Divine_Wind]

the unappealing Democratic candidate didn't win the electoral college. the electoral college could have chosen anyone else. i'm fine with letting the popular vote elect the candidate, and the popular vote soundly rejecting that candidate in subsequent elections.

Sorry, but the Electoral College did it's job by voting for the candidate it's voters chose. Just because Hillary won the popular vote primarily from two states doesn't mean the Electoral College failed. It worked precisely as the Founders designed it. The Democrats were done in because their corruption leaked due to illegal hacking by the ****ing Russians. The Republicans were more honest; after all Trump was last on their list. Like studying the JFK election, studying the 2016 election will win some people their doctor's theses and earn someone a pulitzer. However, it won't be by complaining about the EC or who won the popular vote. It will be by studying the dynamics at each step of the election.

 

[Helix]

Sorry, but the Electoral College did it's job by voting for the candidate it's voters chose. Just because Hillary won the popular vote primarily from two states doesn't mean the Electoral College failed. It worked precisely as the Founders designed it. The Democrats were done in because their corruption leaked due to illegal hacking by the ****ing Russians. The Republicans were more honest; after all Trump was last on their list. Like studying the JFK election, studying the 2016 election will win some people their doctor's theses and earn someone a pulitzer. However, it won't be by complaining about the EC or who won the popular vote. It will be by studying the dynamics at each step of the election.

Clinton was a lousy candidate who won the popular vote. IMO, the electoral college should have prevented Trump from assuming office. since that did not happen, i support eliminating the electoral college, as this stopgap has failed its intended purpose.