Why do people want to have kids?

[Catz Part Deux]

I never wanted to have kids, but after I got knocked up, I made do. And, to my surprise, I found it was the best thing that ever happened to me.

 

[Gray_Fox_86]

Had I known the difficulties and expense we were to face, would I have gone ahead with it? Good Heavens, yes. If I do nothing else of importance with my life, I have created a new person. He may change the world one day. Or he may not. He may make some lucky girl very happy, and that's good enough for me. My husband & I will die some day, but a part of us will live on in our son and then his children and their children. You just cannot put a price on that.

You know your child may choose not to have any children of their own. What then? Do you know that Aberham Lincoln's desecendents are all dead now? The last one died in the 80s. What I am saying is that society is changing. Its not that people are choosing to not having children any more. Its that society is not interacting enough with another to make children and that those children will make children. I read that 20% of males in the States will never be married let alone have children. I really believe your child will be a good person. Because that is all what matters.

 

[UtahBill]

You know your child may choose not to have any children of their own. What then? Do you know that Aberham Lincoln's desecendents are all dead now? The last one died in the 80s. What I am saying is that society is changing. Its not that people are choosing to not having children any more. Its that society is not interacting enough with another to make children and that those children will make children. I read that 20% of males in the States will never be married let alone have children. I really believe your child will be a good person. Because that is all what matters.

We have several friends who have no grandchildren, and I offer to let them "adopt" one of ours til they get thru college...none have accepted the offer yet. We also know some people who have had lots of kids and now have 30 or so grandkids...and grandma wants to buy all of the kids and grandkids presents for every occasion. That gets expensive.
I personally think that people should not have more kids than they can raise right. But, it is their choice.
I also know a few authoritarian men whose kids left the family as soon as possible, never to be seen again.
But the worst case of parenting has to be the divorced co-worker who admitted that he was a bad father, as his son told him the following..." I will probably never marry, but if I do, we won't have kids, but if we do have kids, YOU will never see them".

 

[Gray_Fox_86]

We have several friends who have no grandchildren, and I offer to let them "adopt" one of ours til they get thru college...none have accepted the offer yet. We also know some people who have had lots of kids and now have 30 or so grandkids...and grandma wants to buy all of the kids and grandkids presents for every occasion. That gets expensive.
I personally think that people should not have more kids than they can raise right. But, it is their choice.
I also know a few authoritarian men whose kids left the family as soon as possible, never to be seen again.
But the worst case of parenting has to be the divorced co-worker who admitted that he was a bad father, as his son told him the following..." I will probably never marry, but if I do, we won't have kids, but if we do have kids, YOU will never see them".

Very good post, Utah. I wish more people held your wisdom.

 

[IceteaGreen]

Funny to see this thread now that I'm parent of a cute li'll 2 month daughter. Neither of us were really dying to have children, because of all the reasons presented by the op but one day we just decided to let nature decide and a brief look in her eyes has 10, even 100 times more weight than all the perfectly good reasons mentioned (and this comes from a pure cartesian-atheist-almost nihilist guy :2razz

I was thinking the following a few days ago: I always thought 'what does not kill you makes you stronger'. I lost both my parents/grandparents at a young age, got into terrible troubles, had a taste of true poverty (having to choose between eating and heating yourself). I was also thinking that I could probably survive loosing my wife but...

But there is now only 1 loss that I don't think I could survive to, it is the loss of my daughter...

THAT for me summarize the meaning of having a child


-Green

 

[UtahBill]

Funny to see this thread now that I'm parent of a cute li'll 2 month daughter. Neither of us were really dying to have children, because of all the reasons presented by the op but one day we just decided to let nature decide and a brief look in her eyes has 10, even 100 times more weight than all the perfectly good reasons mentioned (and this comes from a pure cartesian-atheist-almost nihilist guy :2razz

I was thinking the following a few days ago: I always thought 'what does not kill you makes you stronger'. I lost both my parents/grandparents at a young age, got into terrible troubles, had a taste of true poverty (having to choose between eating and heating yourself). I was also thinking that I could probably survive loosing my wife but...

But there is now only 1 loss that I don't think I could survive to, it is the loss of my daughter...

THAT for me summarize the meaning of having a child


-Green

Hold that thought dear to your heart. And consider having another child. Every little girl needs a younger sibling to boss around.:2razz:

 

[scourge99]

I have never had any desire to have any kids, and I am completely baffled why almost everyone I meet wants to have them, either now or when they're older. Since I'm sure that some of you folks have kids or want them, maybe you could enlighten me. As I see it, it's a simple cost/benefit analysis:

COSTS:
- The financial costs are obscene. I would estimate at least $300K (in today's dollars) to raise them to age 18, and then more if you're paying for their college.
- The time/effort commitments are huge, especially when the kids are young.
- Having kids takes away your mobility, making you less able to move to a new area, start a new career, drop your significant other if it doesn't work out, or take worthwhile risks like investments/businesses.
- Kids can be emotionally draining, especially in the teenage years.
- It would be devastating if something bad ever happened to them, and painful just to worry about that possibility.
- Studies have shown that children rarely make their parents happier...the net effect of having kids is to make people LESS happy on average.

BENEFITS:
- None that I can think of?

I don't see any unique personal benefit to having kids. Children are stressful, time consuming,non-refundable, and all of the benefits (both personal and otherwise) can be achieved via other means (friends, adoption, volunteer/social work, etc).

On the other hand, there aren't many reasons NOT to have kids if you want them.

 

[Gray_Fox_86]

We have several friends who have no grandchildren, and I offer to let them "adopt" one of ours til they get thru college...none have accepted the offer yet. We also know some people who have had lots of kids and now have 30 or so grandkids...and grandma wants to buy all of the kids and grandkids presents for every occasion. That gets expensive.
I personally think that people should not have more kids than they can raise right. But, it is their choice.
I also know a few authoritarian men whose kids left the family as soon as possible, never to be seen again.
But the worst case of parenting has to be the divorced co-worker who admitted that he was a bad father, as his son told him the following..." I will probably never marry, but if I do, we won't have kids, but if we do have kids, YOU will never see them".

I also wanted to add to this post. By suggessting that regardless if you have a kid, they will not necessarily grow into loving you. You can only raise them good and hope they return the love back one day. Because I know of several individuals who had loving parents but once they left the house they rarely made contact with their family, parents, siblings, etc.

 

[Khayembii Communique]

I'd like to have kids without having to deal with them. Like a Grandpa. That'd rock.

 

[UtahBill]

I also wanted to add to this post. By suggessting that regardless if you have a kid, they will not necessarily grow into loving you. You can only raise them good and hope they return the love back one day. Because I know of several individuals who had loving parents but once they left the house they rarely made contact with their family, parents, siblings, etc.

You are describing me...I joined the navy, wrote regularly, got almost no responses from any of them, except when a few of my siblings wanted to 'borrow' money. In my defense, there was no love to return. My parents had hard lives, and never learned to love, not even their own kids. It happens...

 

[roguenuke]

3) If you're into sociology, you can run real life tests.

I think this is how my husband's father feels about his grandchildren.

While we were living in NC, next door to them, from the first time they gave my oldest son a stuffed white polar bear, he told my son that it was a red cow. Drove me frickin' crazy. Luckily, my son has shown that the counter-teaching paid off, because the other night when my husband was putting him to bed with his polar bear, my son insisted that it was a polar bear when his dad called it a red cow.

 

[Aunt Spiker]

I have never had any desire to have any kids, and I am completely baffled why almost everyone I meet wants to have them, either now or when they're older. Since I'm sure that some of you folks have kids or want them, maybe you could enlighten me. As I see it, it's a simple cost/benefit analysis:

COSTS:
- The financial costs are obscene. I would estimate at least $300K (in today's dollars) to raise them to age 18, and then more if you're paying for their college.
- The time/effort commitments are huge, especially when the kids are young.
- Having kids takes away your mobility, making you less able to move to a new area, start a new career, drop your significant other if it doesn't work out, or take worthwhile risks like investments/businesses.
- Kids can be emotionally draining, especially in the teenage years.
- It would be devastating if something bad ever happened to them, and painful just to worry about that possibility.
- Studies have shown that children rarely make their parents happier...the net effect of having kids is to make people LESS happy on average.

BENEFITS:
- None that I can think of?

Awe - so cute! You're just ignoring human traits like feelings, desires, wants and nature.

A cost-conscientious liberal. . . so sweet!

 

[UtahBill]

If you have to ask how much kids cost, you can't afford them.....:2razz:

 

[UtahBill]

I think this is how my husband's father feels about his grandchildren.

While we were living in NC, next door to them, from the first time they gave my oldest son a stuffed white polar bear, he told my son that it was a red cow. Drove me frickin' crazy. Luckily, my son has shown that the counter-teaching paid off, because the other night when my husband was putting him to bed with his polar bear, my son insisted that it was a polar bear when his dad called it a red cow.

sounds like teasing, and grandpas should be able to do that....or am I missing something?

 

[d0gbreath]

I wasn't really conscious of ever having thought: "Gee, I want some kids". They just arrived as a side-effect of promiscuous activity. I think we used Bristol Palin's birth control methods.

 

[Gray_Fox_86]

You are describing me...I joined the navy, wrote regularly, got almost no responses from any of them, except when a few of my siblings wanted to 'borrow' money. In my defense, there was no love to return. My parents had hard lives, and never learned to love, not even their own kids. It happens...

Life sucks, heh?

 

[StandUpChuck]

Life sucks, heh?

That's a particularly rude response to someone who is being open with you about his life. UB has been through things you would barely survive. He's not sitting around whining about chicks picking out wedgies, he's facing life's hardships with strength, dignity and an optimism he had to learn, because his parents never got out of their own hell long enough to teach him those things.

As far as the discussion, there are absolutely no guarantees of anything when you have kids. That's hardcore life. I have no idea how close my son will be to me when he's a man. Young adults tend to break away from their parents in a very direct way & keep moving for years. Those with good relationships with their parents will come back home emotionally, but only after they are true adults. I cannot plan what type of relationship we will have then, because he will be entirely his own person then. All I can do is make sure he knows there's always loving arms for him when he returns. What he gives back is not the reward for parenting. Parenting itself is the reward.

 

[UtahBill]

Life sucks, heh?

well, it did, til I moved on with my life. Most of my siblings stayed close to our parents, never thinking that the grass can actually be greener some place else....
Best thing I ever did was marry a good woman, from a good family. My in-laws became my parents, for all intents and purposes.
Great people....and HUGGERS, something I was not familiar with, but when you weigh 150#, and your farmer FIL is 4 " taller and 90# heavier, and he hugs you, it is futile to resist....:2razz:

 

[Gray_Fox_86]

That's a particularly rude response to someone who is being open with you about his life. UB has been through things you would barely survive. He's not sitting around whining about chicks picking out wedgies, he's facing life's hardships with strength, dignity and an optimism he had to learn, because his parents never got out of their own hell long enough to teach him those things.

As far as the discussion, there are absolutely no guarantees of anything when you have kids. That's hardcore life. I have no idea how close my son will be to me when he's a man. Young adults tend to break away from their parents in a very direct way & keep moving for years. Those with good relationships with their parents will come back home emotionally, but only after they are true adults. I cannot plan what type of relationship we will have then, because he will be entirely his own person then. All I can do is make sure he knows there's always loving arms for him when he returns. What he gives back is not the reward for parenting. Parenting itself is the reward.

I was not being rude! Jesus, you really thought that was rude? What I was simply saying was that he had a hard life early on because of his parents. So it must have sucked. Because he should have been loved by his parents. I mean where did he get his niceness from?!

 

[Gray_Fox_86]

That's a particularly rude response to someone who is being open with you about his life. UB has been through things you would barely survive. He's not sitting around whining about chicks picking out wedgies, he's facing life's hardships with strength, dignity and an optimism he had to learn, because his parents never got out of their own hell long enough to teach him those things.

As far as the discussion, there are absolutely no guarantees of anything when you have kids. That's hardcore life. I have no idea how close my son will be to me when he's a man. Young adults tend to break away from their parents in a very direct way & keep moving for years. Those with good relationships with their parents will come back home emotionally, but only after they are true adults. I cannot plan what type of relationship we will have then, because he will be entirely his own person then. All I can do is make sure he knows there's always loving arms for him when he returns. What he gives back is not the reward for parenting. Parenting itself is the reward.

Also it is people like you who are unaware that it isn't just UB who suffers from living. It is everyone in this world.

 

[roguenuke]

sounds like teasing, and grandpas should be able to do that....or am I missing something?

No. He told us that he was trying to see if he could make the little one call a white polar bear, a red cow. He really was trying to experiment with my kid. Now, granted, once he found out it bothered me, it turned into teasing, of me.

 

[UtahBill]

No. He told us that he was trying to see if he could make the little one call a white polar bear, a red cow. He really was trying to experiment with my kid. Now, granted, once he found out it bothered me, it turned into teasing, of me.

Back when our kids were teens, we teased each other a bit. When one of my son's friends was over having dinner with us, my son started in on my weight issues. His friend was aghast. He said that if he teased his dad like that, his mom would be all over him.

A classic between me and our son....in High School, he was on the swim team, in very good shape, and I had a pot belly. He comes up, taps my stomach, and says "Old man, I'm never going to have one of those".

I waited, and waited, many years I waited..
when he was about 30, I tap him on his pot belly, and said "Kid, I didn't get one of those til I was over 40...."

It can be a fun game, if it isn't overplayed...

 

[StandUpChuck]

Also it is people like you who are unaware that it isn't just UB who suffers from living. It is everyone in this world.

Cut with the "people like you" business, buster. I've read your posts. You have no idea what true suffering is. Yet.

 

[Gray_Fox_86]

Cut with the "people like you" business, buster. I've read your posts. You have no idea what true suffering is. Yet.

Yet? So you are wishing me to have a bad life? Yeah, thanks....

 

[UtahBill]

Yet? So you are wishing me to have a bad life? Yeah, thanks....

I doubt she means it like that...
the thing we should all be grateful for, that we don't have it worse...
I have lost 3 friends in the last 5 years, to fatal diseases. One lasted a week after a stroke, another lasted 6 months after diagnosis of pancreatic cancer, and one took 4 years of pain to finally die from prostate cancer. Another is suffering from colon and prostate cancer now, is on chemo but it doesn't look good. Yet another just got dx'd with pancreatic cancer, and for him it is just one more thing on a long list of ailments that should have killed him by now.

Just about the time you think all is well, stuff happens. We thought we had it made shortly after we retired, then our 7 year old granddaughter was dx'd with an inoperable brain tumor. since then she has grown a new tumor, but it was operable. That surgery set her back some, she had to have physical therapy for months to get back to her normal walking, which isn't normal for the rest of us. The dust almost got settled on that, then I was dx'd with Parkinson's Disease. It sounds worse than it is, doctor says I have 20 years before it will get so bad that I can die. I can handle 20.....that will be long enough to see our youngest grandchild graduate college.
But no matter what, things can get worse, and for some of my friends, it already has. About all we can do is keep our chins up, and face it head on.
However, there is one bright silver lining in all this, for most of my friends and relatives. We don't go thru life alone, we have kids and grandkids and friends to remnd us of the good things that have happened over many years...
OK, sermon is over, pay your tithing and donations to my paypal account..:2razz: