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Why Are LIBERALS So Deluded on FREE TRADE?

Hawkeye10 said:
I dont know you.

Do you know how to do good conversation?
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I know how to say what I want to say.

Anyone who doesn't like my comments can ignore them.




"The only valid censorship of ideas is the right of people not to listen." ~ Tommy Smothers
 
Henrin said:
The idea this thread is promoting is protecting markets from competition. It does this by basically forcing prices higher for outside markets and therefore pushing consumers towards less competitive businesses. This idea will boost poor performing markets, decrease growth in relation to what it otherwise would be, and provide less motivation for developing future markets.



I would love to see evidence to support that claim. What is happening here in the states is people not moving towards more productive and high paying jobs due to a failure to adopt to changing markets.
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What has happened is that American companies have simply refused to pay for training, even minimal. If people dont show up at the door ready to be productive on day one they are called unqualified, and a call is put out for people from some foreign land the someone else has trained. People who so very nicely also tend to be willing to work for less than Americans because they are judging everything by the pay of the homeland.

But in anycase your argument is KAPUT both because there are not enough jobs to go around AND because the workers slice of the GDP has been shrinking since 1968. The elite take more and more, by plan.
 
shrubnose said:
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i know how to say what i want to say.

Anyone who doesn't like my comments can ignore them.




"the only valid censorship of ideas is the right of people not to listen." ~ tommy smothers
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nonresponsive.

AKA: BAD CONVERSION SKILLS EXHIBITED.
 
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Hawkeye10 said:
What has happened is that American companies have simply refused to pay for training, even minimal. If people dont show up at the door ready to be productive on day one they are called unqualified, and a call is put out for people from some foreign land the someone else has trained. People who so very nicely also tend to be willing to work for less than Americans because they are judging everything by the pay of the homeland.
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I don't think you understand how markets work. Very high cost markets will not be able to compete as well as low cost markets for the simple reason that it costs more to produce the product and put it out on the market. Why should over priced markets get a boost over more competitively priced markets?

As for training, it depends on the skills available in the market if there is an incentive to provide training.

But in anycase your argument is KAPUT both because there are not enough jobs to go around AND because the workers slice of the GDP has been shrinking since 1968. The elite take more and more, by plan.
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There are an abundance of jobs available in the market place. If I recall there was a record in that area not that long ago.
 
Henrin said:
I don't think you understand how markets work. Very high cost markets will not be able to compete as well as low cost markets for the simple reason that it costs more to produce the product and put it out on the market. Why should over priced markets get a boost over more competitively priced markets?

As for training, it depends on the skills available in market if there is incentive to provide training.



There are an abundance of jobs available in the market place. If I recall there was a record in that area not that long ago.
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Which is ZERO when our government will agree to the import of as many highly exploitable trained foreigners as the elite want to run their works.

**** THE AMERICANS!

Our own government.

THUS DON!
 
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There is nothing wrong with free trade. What we have now is not free trade.
Most people that talk about free trade are only thinking of low wages in other countries generating cheap goods for "me".

They don't see the destruction wrought by long term trade imbalances, or if the see it they lack the political balls to do something about it. This cannot go on forever, so what are we waiting for?

A negative trade balance against you means you are selling off your country. Clinton knew it, Bush knew it, Obama knows it The truth is, the multinational corporations don't want to upset their apple cart. They are doing just fine.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Which is ZERO when our government will agree to the import of as many highly exploitable foreigners as the elite want to run their works.

**** THE AMERICANS!

Our own government.

THUS DON!
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This discussion is not over immigration. You can at least stay on topic in your own thread.
 
Henrin said:
This discussion is not over immigration. You can at least stay on topic in your own thread.
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I am on topic.

The fact that you dont know this earns you -1.
 
chuckiechan said:
There is nothing wrong with free trade. What we have now is not free trade.
Most people that talk about free trade are only thinking of low wages in other countries generating cheap goods for "me".

They don't see the destruction wrought by long term trade imbalances, or if the see it they lack the political balls to do something about it. This cannot go on forever, so what are we waiting for?

A negative trade balance against you means you are selling off your country. Clinton knew it, Bush knew it, Obama knows it The truth is, the multinational corporations don't want to upset their apple cart. They are doing just fine.
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yes indeed the democrats and clintons pushed thru nafa and gatt to enrich some democrat leaders like they USE low IQ's to vote and get fooled to also enrich themselves... the bush's wanted this type of trade to enrich their money BIG OIL... they both wanted to take from the middle class to enrich themselves..... a weak middle class is destruction for a nation
 
Hawkeye10 said:
I am on topic.

The fact that you dont know this gets you -1.
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Do you think these foreigners that were "imported into the country" will get the training that was denied to citizens of the country?
 
chuckiechan said:
There is nothing wrong with free trade. What we have now is not free trade.
Most people that talk about free trade are only thinking of low wages in other countries generating cheap goods for "me".

They don't see the destruction wrought by long term trade imbalances, or if the see it they lack the political balls to do something about it. This cannot go on forever, so what are we waiting for?

A negative trade balance against you means you are selling off your country. Clinton knew it, Bush knew it, Obama knows it The truth is, the multinational corporations don't want to upset their apple cart. They are doing just fine.
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Not really as long as you have a domestic market for your high skill goods and services, like the US, you do not need a favourable trade balance. Not everything has be imported and exported in free trade there is room a for a healthy domestic economy which the US has, it is just no longer manufacturing.
 
Henrin said:
Do you think these foreigners that were "imported into the country" will get the training that was denied to citizens of the country?
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I already told you that someone else paid to train them.

Good paying attention.

*Sarcasm*

EDIT: I am playing with Henrin(I like U man), I had to edit post 30 to make this post true. But ya, American companies refuse to spend the money for training, then import cheaper more trouble free labor as a result, which they can do because they bought the government.

WIN/WIN/WIN
 
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Carjosse said:
Not really as long as you have a domestic market for your high skill goods and services, like the US, you do not need a favourable trade balance. Not everything has be imported and exported in free trade there is room a for a healthy domestic economy which the US has, it is just no longer manufacturing.
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We need a diverse manufacturing base because populations are diverse. IOW, we need jobs to match many talents. We need pencil pushers and press operators. As our industries are vanquished, we begin to suffer "institutional amnesia", and forget how to invent and make things, and those who can't push pencils properly are out of work.

China is leap frogging us due to them not being slowed down by pesky R&D costs. They just steal it.
 
I think you're confusing liberalism with neo-liberalism. They aren't the same thing.

Both liberals and conservatives employ neo-liberal policies. Though, the trend for the major free trade agreements seems to favor conservatives as the major initiators... but it seems like liberals still carry the ball, so.

The reason it can go either way is because big money is involved, and big money knows no partisan lean.
 
chuckiechan said:
We need a diverse manufacturing base because populations are diverse. IOW, we need jobs to match many talents. We need pencil pushers and press operators. As our industries are vanquished, we begin to suffer "institutional amnesia", and forget how to invent and make things, and those who can't push pencils properly are out of work.

China is leap frogging us due to them not being slowed down by pesky R&D costs. They just steal it.
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The world economy has changed and so has technology with it. We do not need press operators when we can just use robots to do it or pay someone in China $2/hour. The world has changed it is not the 1960s anymore. The economies of developed countries have changed they now rely on high-skill labour, and if you do not have skill or refuse to change you are out of luck. China is not leap frogging the US, they are bogged down by the most corrupt and inefficient government in the entire world and suffering demographic problems.
 
Northern Light said:
I think you're confusing liberalism with neo-liberalism. They aren't the same thing.

Both liberals and conservatives employ neo-liberal policies. Though, the trend for the major free trade agreements seems to favor conservatives as the major initiators... but it seems like liberals still carry the ball, so.

The reason it can go either way is because big money is involved, and big money knows no partisan lean.
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Too bad U dont seem to know that these partisan games are instigated by the elite, to take the attention off of what they are doing....picking our pockets.
 
chuckiechan said:
We need a diverse manufacturing base because populations are diverse. IOW, we need jobs to match many talents. We need pencil pushers and press operators. As our industries are vanquished, we begin to suffer "institutional amnesia", and forget how to invent and make things, and those who can't push pencils properly are out of work.
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Industries come and go and with it the skills required to succeed in the market place are altered. It is the peoples job to keep their skills up to date or else they will fall behind. This is been a fact of economic reality since forever.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Too bad U dont seem to know that these partisan games are instigated by the elite, to take the attention off of what they are doing....picking our pockets.
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If you've paid attention to my posts whatsoever since I joined DP, you'd know that I am constantly referring to the financial elite, aristocrats and plutocrats. They're the ones running the show and the partisan politics they employ are just part of the puppet strings.

Your critique of me is baseless.
 
Northern Light said:
If you've paid attention to my posts whatsoever since I joined DP, you'd know that I am constantly referring to the financial elite, aristocrats and plutocrats. They're the ones running the show and the partisan politics they employ are just part of the puppet strings.

Your critique of me is baseless.
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Glad to hear it, but I dont know you outside of this thread.
 
Van Basten said:
How can you know of the existence of something that doesn't exist?
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Because we know to treat the illusion as real if there be profit in it.

We Zen Folk are a practical people.

Seriously.
 
Liberals (as a whole) are no more or less diluted then Conservatives (as a whole).

The OP wreaks of baiting.
 
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