Who's Spinning Intel? Captured Iraqi documents tell a different story

[Iriemon]

Umm I posted evidence to back my assertions including (but not limited to) translated captured Iraqi documents.

Exactly how do the documents you posted (even if we accepted the Free Republic version of them) establish an "ongoing collaborative relationship" between AQ and Iraq which you assert is a "well established fact"?

Only one of the documents you cited had anything to do with AQ, and that was about one 1995 meeting between an Iraqi official and Bin Laden. That one meeting is nothing new. As the numerous intellegence reports indicate, nothing came out of it, Hussein rebuffed further contacts with AQ.

The rest of the other documents that had nothing to do with AQ. Which begs the question as to why you posted them in the first place.

Where are the documents that prove as an undisputed fact and "ongoing collaborative relationship" between AQ and Iraq?

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

The real joke that you still haven't addressed is that even Bush admits that there were no connections between Saddam and AQ.

Show me where he said that or STFU your little trolling comments are just annoying at this point, you don't even bring anything to the table, all you do is say nun'uh and don't even look at the evidence, it's really sad to watch.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Those documents, even accepting the Free Republic version of them, do not establish

Exactly how do those documents you cited, even accepting the Free Republic version of them,

A) It's not freerepublic documents that is where he posted them his site is right here: JVERITAS - TRANSLATING THE IRAQ DOCUMENTS so you could join a discussion in relation to them. And BTW freerepublic lets liberals on unlike the DU.

B) I have seen the original documents on the military site I know they're real because I linked to them here when they first came out.

C) These were only a very small portion of these documents that have been translated, there are thousands upon thousands of them and they have since been taken off the internet in mass because they were a security concern in that they had detailed knowledge of WMD's in there.

D) The weekly standard has collected far more of these translations than anyone else.

establish an "ongoing collaborative relationship" between AQ and Iraq which you claim as "well established fact"?

This one right here is an order to fund and support foreign terrorists IE AQ and a whole host of other Islamic Extremists do you know what the Feedayeen is?:

2003 Document: Saddam Ordered To Treat The Arab Feedayeen Terrorists The Same As Iraqi Soldiers



Document ISGQ-2004-00060580 is a memo that contains a direct order form Saddam Hussein in the middle of the war asking to treat the Arab Feedayeen i.e. the non Iraqi Foreign Arab Terrorists as equal as the Iraqi soldier in salary and benefits and not just any soldier but like those in the Special Forces. These are the same Arab terrorists who stayed in Iraq after the removal of the regime and caused those horrible attacks mostly on innocent civilians. This document is a follow on another document where the Iraqi were training Foreign Arab terrorist since the year 2000 (please see those two translations: Document: Iraqi Intelligence To Train Arab Feedayeen Terrorists In the Year 2000 http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1617431/posts Document: Saddam Regime Training and Using Foreign Arab Terrorists As Suicide Bombers. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1600367/posts ). The extremely strong connection between Saddam and Terrorism is something that we need to tell the whole world about it, because for this reason alone we would have all the right to remove this Terrorist Regime after the 9/11, we just cannot afford to live with it.


Begining of the translation

In the Name of God the Most Merciful The Most Compassionate

Republic Of Iraq
Directorate of the General Military Intelligence
No 9/39/1/
Date: 4 April 2003

Secret

To: The 8th Directorate
Subject: Order

The secret and urgent letter of the Presidential Secretariat K-1997 on 29/3/2003 including… The order of The President The Leader to the armed forces God protects him and according to the following:

The Volunteers Arab Feedayeen will be treated the treatment of the solider in the army (Special Forces) regarding the salary and benefits.

Please review and take what is necessary.

Signature

Staff General

Director of the General Military Intelligence

April 2003
End of the Translation

Only one of the documents you cited had anything to do with AQ, and that was about one 1995 meeting between an Iraqi official and Bin Laden. That one meeting is nothing new.

As the numerous intellegence reports indicate, nothing came out of it, Hussein rebuffed further contacts with AQ.

No he did not, he actively trained them, according to some uncomfirmed report he later rescinded his offer of Asylum to OBL and that's it nothing about not working together. But even that is further evidence because the offer of asylum to OBL was made in the first place.

The rest of the other documents that had nothing to do with AQ. Which begs the question as to why you posted them in the first place.

They had everything to do with AQ and Saddam's support for international Islamic fascist terrorism.

<<<SEE BELLOW>>>

Where are the documents that prove as an undisputed fact and "ongoing collaborative relationship" between AQ and Iraq?

DOCEX, I don't have all the DOCEX documents they have been taken off of the internet don't you understand English? Here's another article on DOCEX: http://www.nysun.com/article/29746

 

[faminedynasty]

It's amazing that someone--anyone-- is still clinging to this myth. Not even the administration would embarass itself with these obvious falsities anymore. It is no less absurd to believe that there was a substantial link between Saddam and AQ than it is to believe that Saddam had WMDs leading up to the war. And believing either of those TO THIS DAY is no less absurd than believing that we ARE being greeted as liberators in Iraq, showered in flowers and love in a bloodless war that is going to pay for itself with Iraqi oil revenues.
We all have biases and ideologies, certain assumptions about the underlying principles of the world. But if we are so commited to being a partisan hack that we cannot accept reality when we it is slapping us in the face, then we are no longer an objective thinker and are simply trying to fit the world around our ideology.
There is no credible source that is portraying pre-war Iraq as the terrorist training ground of the middle east. Post-war may be another story.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

It's amazing that someone--anyone-- is still clinging to this myth. Not even the administration would embarass itself with these obvious falsities anymore

See this right here proves you have no idea what you're talking about, I heard Cheney reafirm the AQ/Iraq links on Rush Limbaugh in a live interview, and that's how this whole thing started so if you want ot go toe to toe with me you better have something better than detainee testimony IE you better have corrobarting documentation.

 

[faminedynasty]

See this right here proves you have no idea what you're talking about, I heard Cheney reafirm the AQ/Iraq links on Rush Limbaugh in a live interview, and that's how this whole thing started so if you want ot go toe to toe with me you better have something better than detainee testimony IE you better have corrobarting documentation.

We are all well aware that Cheney continues to spout ridiculous nonsense. His credibility mirrors his approval ratings. I thought he was the last man on earth living entirely in the land of makebelieve, but I now know that you are there with him. As you will recall, Cheney's appearance on Limbaugh and his comments were quite an embarassment to the administration.

 

[Stinger]

We are all well aware that Cheney continues to spout ridiculous nonsense. His credibility mirrors his approval ratings. I thought he was the last man on earth living entirely in the land of makebelieve, but I now know that you are there with him. As you will recall, Cheney's appearance on Limbaugh and his comments were quite an embarassment to the administration.

Can you refute the documents, yes or no? Your simple dismissals and baseless attacks on Cheney certainly don't. The ties between Saddam and al Qaeda is clearly spelled out the the evidence that has been presented and the links will offer you more. Where is the evidence which refutes it?

 

[Iriemon]

A) It's not freerepublic documents that is where he posted them his site is right here: JVERITAS - TRANSLATING THE IRAQ DOCUMENTS so you could join a discussion in relation to them.

LMFAO! "Jveritas" is a Freeper since 2001 who writes stuff like this (and this is just in the last 3 days!):

I am just your humble freeper

I am very frustrated as well. I think the President decided four years ago to fight and win the war in the field rather than argue with the traitors and their media about WMD and other pre-war issues.

Yep because the President did not go along with terrorist appeasers like the UN, EU, China, and Russia.

This traitor Reid will say and do what ever he wants because has a treasonous liberal media to cover for him. Anyway the President will crush this traitor like a bug.

Harry Reid is one of the nastiest, meanest, rudest, and most arrogant traitors to ever reach a high political office.

With these traitors it is hard to predict what they are going to do. They will only think about power and whether this treasonous bill will give them better chance at power or reduce this chance, that is all what they care about.

Being an extreme hypocrite is an important trait of liberals. It is rarely that you encounter a liberal who is not an extreme hypocrite. Liberals are hypocrite on every issue.

I cannot believe that the democrats are that stupid to think that the meanest, nastiest, rudest, most arrogant, most fake, most uncharismatic, most dull person to ever run for President like Hillary Clinton is going win the Presidency. The bigger problem for her is that no matter how hard she tries she cannot hide her horrible character, her nasty screeching voice, and her mean facial looks, and the media cannot cover this for her no matter how hard they try.

No doubt. He is one of the meanest, nastiest Senators to ever take office. But worst, he is a TRAITOR.

We just despised his [Clinton's] utterly failed and do nothing Presidency that lead to a lot of problems including 9/11 terrorists attacks.

It is time for a national prime time speech from the President to expose these traitors. We do not care anymore about whether a national speech will raise the popularity of the President or not, we are beyond this idiocy of public support and we should not care about it anymore, we need to expose the traitors at home and fight them and we need to crush the terrorists abroad and destroy them forever. Wars are fought and won by a determined and strong leader like President Bush, by the military might of our brave troops, and by the support of a minority of Patriots. The independence war and the civil war were supported, fought and won by a minority of Patriots. I came to that in this war.

User Posts

He sounds about as objective and balanced as PTSDKid.

Sorry. I'm not accepting him blindly as an objective source of information about the Iraqi documents.

But if these documents prove an "ongoing corroboration" between Hussein and Al-Queda, why weren't they cited by the 2006 Senate Intellgence Committee.

And BTW freerepublic lets liberals on unlike the DU.

Oh really? Not according to your man Jveritas:

"This is a Conservative Republican forum not for left wing liberal democrats."

User Posts

B) I have seen the original documents on the military site I know they're real because I linked to them here when they first came out.

C) These were only a very small portion of these documents that have been translated, there are thousands upon thousands of them and they have since been taken off the internet in mass because they were a security concern in that they had detailed knowledge of WMD's in there.

D) The weekly standard has collected far more of these translations than anyone else.

Great. When do we get a report from an objective source proving this? Why hasn't the WH reviewed these docs? They could use a little good PR for their war.

This one right here is an order to fund and support foreign terrorists IE AQ and a whole host of other Islamic Extremists do you know what the Feedayeen is?:

Not Al-Queda. Fedayeen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In any case that was in April 2003, after the invasion. Not proof of an ongoing corroboration.

No he did not, he actively trained them, according to some uncomfirmed report he later rescinded his offer of Asylum to OBL and that's it nothing about not working together. But even that is further evidence because the offer of asylum to OBL was made in the first place.

From the 2006 (the year the Republicans still had contol of the Senate) Senate Intellegence Report:

Conclusion 2: Postwar findings have indicated that there was only one meeting between representatives of Saddam Hussein and representatives of al-Qaeda. These findings also identified two occasions "not reported prior to the war, in which Saddam Hussein rebuffed meeting requests from an al-Qa'ida operative. The Intelligence Community has not found any other evidence of meetings between al-Qa'ida and Iraq."

Conclusion 4: "Postwar findings support the April 2002 Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) assessment that there was no credible reporting on al-Qa'ida training at Salman Pak or anywhere else in Iraq. There have been no credible reports since the war that Iraq trained al-Qa'ida operatives at Salman Pak to conduct or support transnational terrorist operations."

They had everything to do with AQ and Saddam's support for international Islamic fascist terrorism.

Is that what the freepers are saying?

DOCEX, I don't have all the DOCEX documents they have been taken off of the internet don't you understand English? Here's another article on DOCEX: Saddam, Al Qaeda Did Collaborate, Documents Show - March 24, 2006 - The New York Sun

I'm willing to bet that the Senate Intellegence Committee had better access to DOCEX that you.

 

[Iriemon]

Can you refute the documents, yes or no? Your simple dismissals and baseless attacks on Cheney certainly don't. The ties between Saddam and al Qaeda is clearly spelled out the the evidence that has been presented and the links will offer you more. Where is the evidence which refutes it?

It has been clearly spelled out by every major intellegence study over the base 5 years by the Israeli intellegence agency, the CIA, the Pentagon, the 9/11 commission, and the Senate that there is no evidence of corraborative links between Hussein and Al-Queda. There is evidence that supports that Hussein was a secularist whose top minister was a Christian and had few if any common interests with radical islamists like Al-Qeuda and Bin Laden who were more interested in removing secularists like Hussein than working with him.

 

[jfuh]

It has been clearly spelled out by every major intellegence study over the base 5 years by the Israeli intellegence agency, the CIA, the Pentagon, the 9/11 commission, and the Senate that there is no evidence of corraborative links between Hussein and Al-Queda. There is evidence that supports that Hussein was a secularist whose top minister was a Christian and had few if any common interests with radical islamists like Al-Qeuda and Bin Laden who were more interested in removing secularists like Hussein than working with him.

Why bother with whatever all the facts actually state when you can simply make up some crap and then start screaming it's all the left's fault? These apologetics are just simply looking for someone to point the finger at for their continued failures and incompetencies. But now that they don't have the "predictions" that they made back in 02 ~ 06 they are left with making stuff up and yelling it's so.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

I'll show anyone of you dipshits objective bring it on I challenge all 3 of you to a debate.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

LMFAO! "Jveritas" is a Freeper since 2001 who writes stuff like this (and this is just in the last 3 days!):

I am just your humble freeper

I am very frustrated as well. I think the President decided four years ago to fight and win the war in the field rather than argue with the traitors and their media about WMD and other pre-war issues.

Yep because the President did not go along with terrorist appeasers like the UN, EU, China, and Russia.

This traitor Reid will say and do what ever he wants because has a treasonous liberal media to cover for him. Anyway the President will crush this traitor like a bug.

Harry Reid is one of the nastiest, meanest, rudest, and most arrogant traitors to ever reach a high political office.

With these traitors it is hard to predict what they are going to do. They will only think about power and whether this treasonous bill will give them better chance at power or reduce this chance, that is all what they care about.

Being an extreme hypocrite is an important trait of liberals. It is rarely that you encounter a liberal who is not an extreme hypocrite. Liberals are hypocrite on every issue.

I cannot believe that the democrats are that stupid to think that the meanest, nastiest, rudest, most arrogant, most fake, most uncharismatic, most dull person to ever run for President like Hillary Clinton is going win the Presidency. The bigger problem for her is that no matter how hard she tries she cannot hide her horrible character, her nasty screeching voice, and her mean facial looks, and the media cannot cover this for her no matter how hard they try.

No doubt. He is one of the meanest, nastiest Senators to ever take office. But worst, he is a TRAITOR.

We just despised his [Clinton's] utterly failed and do nothing Presidency that lead to a lot of problems including 9/11 terrorists attacks.

It is time for a national prime time speech from the President to expose these traitors. We do not care anymore about whether a national speech will raise the popularity of the President or not, we are beyond this idiocy of public support and we should not care about it anymore, we need to expose the traitors at home and fight them and we need to crush the terrorists abroad and destroy them forever. Wars are fought and won by a determined and strong leader like President Bush, by the military might of our brave troops, and by the support of a minority of Patriots. The independence war and the civil war were supported, fought and won by a minority of Patriots. I came to that in this war.

User Posts

He sounds about as objective and balanced as PTSDKid.

Sorry. I'm not accepting him blindly as an objective source of information about the Iraqi documents.

But if these documents prove an "ongoing corroboration" between Hussein and Al-Queda, why weren't they cited by the 2006 Senate Intellgence Committee.



Oh really? Not according to your man Jveritas:

"This is a Conservative Republican forum not for left wing liberal democrats."

User Posts



Great. When do we get a report from an objective source proving this? Why hasn't the WH reviewed these docs? They could use a little good PR for their war.




Not Al-Queda. Fedayeen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In any case that was in April 2003, after the invasion. Not proof of an ongoing corroboration.



From the 2006 (the year the Republicans still had contol of the Senate) Senate Intellegence Report:

Conclusion 2: Postwar findings have indicated that there was only one meeting between representatives of Saddam Hussein and representatives of al-Qaeda. These findings also identified two occasions "not reported prior to the war, in which Saddam Hussein rebuffed meeting requests from an al-Qa'ida operative. The Intelligence Community has not found any other evidence of meetings between al-Qa'ida and Iraq."

Conclusion 4: "Postwar findings support the April 2002 Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) assessment that there was no credible reporting on al-Qa'ida training at Salman Pak or anywhere else in Iraq. There have been no credible reports since the war that Iraq trained al-Qa'ida operatives at Salman Pak to conduct or support transnational terrorist operations."



Is that what the freepers are saying?



I'm willing to bet that the Senate Intellegence Committee had better access to DOCEX that you.

Regulators . .. . mount up! Your whole post does one thing it makes me laugh, and when I'm sober tomorrow I'm going to shred it because it's bullshit. If you're done with assertions then I'll have my leave with you now. Are DOCEX documents like Kryponite to you?

 

[MSgt]

I'll show anyone of you dipshits objective bring it on I challenge all 3 of you to a debate.

Moderator's Warning:

No no. Bad TOT.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

We are all well aware that Cheney continues to spout ridiculous nonsense.

But you just said the administration no longer stands by the AQ Saddam connections, so then you now are admitting to being a liar?

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

From the 2006 (the year the Republicans still had contol of the Senate)

Ya you got two RINO's on that committee one of which (Chuck Hagel) has publicly denounced the Bush administration and announced that he would not vote for him as President. Do I really have to bust out the dissenting opinions or article that debunks their bullshit again?

I'm willing to bet that the Senate Intellegence Committee had better access to DOCEX that you.

Your adhominem attacks against the translatior not withstanding the Senate Intelligence Report is a joke which has been proven beyond any shadow of a doubt.

 

[Iriemon]

Ya you got two RINO's on that committee one of which (Chuck Hagel) has publicly denounced the Bush administration and announced that he would not vote for him as President. Do I really have to bust out the dissenting opinions or article that debunks their bullshit again?

I read the dissent of 4 out of the 15 members of the Committee Their bitch was that this was finger pointing and to them, a waste of time. I did not see in their dissent where they specifically challenged the conclusions of Committee based on conflicting evidence.

Your adhominem attacks against the senators on the committee is a joke notwithstanding your citation to Weekly Standard articles.

Your adhominem attacks against the translatior not withstanding the Senate Intelligence Report is a joke which has been proven beyond any shadow of a doubt.

Oh yes, it was ad hominem, and completely justified. Your reliance on a rabid partisan freeper for your claim of "undisputed fact" is the joke.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

I read the dissent of 4 out of the 15 members of the Committee Their bitch was that this was finger pointing and to them, a waste of time. I did not see in their dissent where they specifically challenged the conclusions of Committee based on conflicting evidence.

Your adhominem attacks against the senators on the committee is a joke notwithstanding your citation to Weekly Standard articles.

They said: "The conclusions in the reports were crafted with more partisan bias than we have witnessed in a long time in Congress," and you don't consider that specifically challenging the conclusion?

Oh yes, it was ad hominem, and completely justified. Your reliance on a rabid partisan freeper for your claim of "undisputed fact" is the joke.

So you admit that you have no evidence that this is a bad translation?