Whole turkey, frozen vs fresh

[ecofarm]

People pay extra for organic honey.

Think about that.

The bees must be on organic land with sufficient organic food supply. I hear it makes a difference, more flavor from the main flower type.

 

[Thorgasm]

The bees must be on organic land with sufficient organic food supply. I hear it makes a difference, more flavor from the main flower type.

People think Angus is a grade of beef, too. It isn't. It's a breed of cow.

 

[Helix]

Biointensive+ outproduces conventional and includes diversity. Labor cost is higher, petrol cost is lower. Can't harvest multicultures with a tractor.

Organic alone is not a guarantee of production or even efficiency.

and you can lose three pumpkin harvests to squash bugs. it was only three because eventually i said **** it and gave up. at least the tomatoes usually do pretty well.

 

[Thorgasm]

90% of America's Pumpkins are grown within 90 miles of Peoria, IL.

 

[ecofarm]

and you can lose three pumpkin harvests to squash bugs. it was only three because eventually i said **** it and gave up. at least the tomatoes usually do pretty well.

Organic doesn't include diversity; thus, "biointesive+". An organic farmer's best defense against pests, disease, drought and other risks is diversity. Squash bugs don't eat everything. As an emergency measure, there's organic pesticides or predator introduction. There's no excuse for the difficulty you propose. It's a diversity problem first and perhaps later a management problem. It really has nothing to do with organic production.

 

[ecofarm]

People think Angus is a grade of beef, too. It isn't. It's a breed of cow.

Honey is a kind of a protein (oil/nitrogen based, ultimately sugar) concentrate in the sense of bioacumulation/magnification and it's harvested locally. Toxins would concentrate, as would phytochems. I believe lab tests would show a difference.

 

[Helix]

Organic doesn't include diversity; thus, "biointesive+". An organic farmer's best defense against pests, disease, drought and other risks is diversity. Squash bugs don't eat everything. As an emergency measure, there's organic pesticides or predator introduction. There's no excuse for the difficulty you propose. It's a diversity problem first and perhaps later a management problem. It really has nothing to do with organic production.

they ate my pumpkins before they could get full sized. i eventually turned to pesticides, but by then it was too late. i moved the patch to my father in law's yard instead.

as for growing most things organically, our population growth is too significant for that to be viable even if we stop eating meat. we'll be needing corn that will grow in a desert before long. of course, if disease or war takes a lot of us out before then, it's possible. either way, we're not there yet. enjoy your efforts to grow crops the way you like. i'll do the same. i look forward to it every spring.

 

[Thorgasm]

Honey is a kind of a protein (oil/nitrogen based, ultimately sugar) concentrate in the sense of bioacumulation/magnification and it's harvested locally. Toxins would concentrate, as would phytochems. I believe lab tests would show a difference.

It's really hard to keep the bees from getting into something non-organic. Bees can travel two miles generally from the hive. They have been observed even two to three times farther than that.

Organic bee vomit. It's makes me laugh.

I want to start a brand of bottled water that is gluten-free.

 

[ecofarm]

they ate my pumpkins before they could get full sized. i eventually turned to pesticides, but by then it was too late. i moved the patch to my father in law's yard instead.

My point is nothing organic or conventional was the problem. It's an ecology and management thing.

as for growing most things organically, our population growth is too significant for that to be viable even if we stop eating meat.

False. Even with eating meat organics can feed everyone and more. But it requires more than organics. It requires all the things that go into any high production farm.

we'll be needing corn that will grow in a desert before long. of course disease or war takes a lot of us out before then, it's possible, though. either way, we're not there yet.

We run out of water before land.

enjoy your efforts to grow crops the way you like. i'll do the same. i look forward to it every spring.

Organic production techniques have greatly improved income, health (both human and ecological) and standard of living throughout the developing world. It's provided access to high income international markets and clean water supplies. The developing world has no intention of repeating our mistakes. An integrated production system will produce superior results, less harm, less depletion and faster development.

 

[ecofarm]

It's really hard to keep the bees from getting into something non-organic. Bees can travel two miles generally from the hive. They have been observed even two to three times farther than that.

Organic bee vomit. It's makes me laugh.

I want to start a brand of bottled water that is gluten-free.

Certification requires sufficient radius.

 

[Thorgasm]

Certification requires sufficient radius.

I am sure they do their best.

 

[ecofarm]

I am sure they do their best.

It depends on food supply. Not a difficult calculation. Organic honey is only organic flowers, usually primarily of a specific type like blueberry or strawberry. No toxins, no pesticides, etc.

 

[Thorgasm]

It depends on food supply. Not a difficult calculation. Organic honey is only organic flowers, usually primarily of a specific type like blueberry or strawberry. No toxins, no pesticides, etc.

I can only see that being feasible if the hive is in a remote, unpopulated area with no farming or organic farms surrounding it. I guess it is possible.

 

[ecofarm]

I can only see that being feasible if the hive is in a remote, unpopulated area with no farming or organic farms surrounding it. I guess it is possible.

There are organic farms that are thousands of acres of monoculture, using outrageous amounts of water, full robot and such. Organics only covers the use of synthetics. It doesn't cover diversity, water use or a multitude of other issues.

On smaller farms, food supply can reduce the utilized radius.

It's not a gimmick and, when it comes to personal health, animal products is where the bang for buck resides.

 

[vesper]

I see nothing wrong with frozen turkeys. But when it comes to good prime rib you need to visit your meat market and get good aged beef. The stuff you get at Kroger or Costco etc. will be disappointing.

I never stuffed a turkey always fixed a mean dressing instead but I would always fill the cavity of the bird with celery, onion, apple, herbs and orange. It helps to keep the bird moist and seasoned. I always had a house full to feed. The bird I would roast the day before once it cooled I would carve and place it into a container and pour a can of turkey broth over it to keep it moist. It would be heated up and served first and be quite moist. Trust me your guests will not know it wasn't just roasted and rave about how moist it is.

 

[Thorgasm]

I see nothing wrong with frozen turkeys. But when it comes to good prime rib you need to visit your meat market and get good aged beef. The stuff you get at Kroger or Costco etc. will be disappointing.

I never stuffed a turkey always fixed a mean dressing instead but I would always fill the cavity of the bird with celery, onion, apple, herbs and orange. It helps to keep the bird moist and seasoned. The bird I would roast the day before once it cooled I would carve and place it into a container and pour a can of turkey broth over it to keep it moist. It would be heated up and served first and be quite moist. Trust me your guests will not know it wasn't just roasted and rave about how moist it is.

My local Kroger has good meat.

 

[Helix]

My point is nothing organic or conventional was the problem. It's an ecology and management thing.



False. Even with eating meat organics can feed everyone and more. But it requires more than organics. It requires all the things that go into any high production farm.



We run out of water before land.



Organic production techniques have greatly improved income, health (both human and ecological) and standard of living throughout the developing world. It's provided access to high income international markets and clean water supplies. The developing world has no intention of repeating our mistakes. An integrated production system will produce superior results, less harm, less depletion and faster development.

you're more optimistic than i am. either way, the greater risk is disease or some preventable war, IMO. there are multiple checks on human population growth.

 

[vesper]

My local Kroger has good meat.

I will buy my frozen turkeys from Kroger but not a standing rib roast or other expensive cuts of meat.

 

[ecofarm]

you're more optimistic than i am.

I've witnessed organic techniques change lives and land in the developing world. In agricultural countries, there are colleges devoted to organic methods. It's a valuable degree for any farmer.

Conventional agriculture utilizes oil like the transportation sector. Synthetic fertilizer is basically oil. It's using power to fix nitrogen. It's not carbon, it's oil, and it's not sustainable.

The bottom line difference between an organic farm and a conventional one is the latter is oil based. Oil is also basically the only "ingredient" in synthetic pesticides. Oil is used for the machinery harvest of monocultures. Oil is used to ship products (beyond organics).

Agriculture is a faster route to energy independence than transportation.

I don't think you're seeing the whole picture. This isn't about gardens. See signature.

 

[PoS]

The Nerdy King of all things Cuisine, Alton Brown, said that there is absolutely no difference between frozen and fresh, except for like about $2.00 a pound. He always buys frozen, and said that there is no reason not to, because there is no difference in taste or quality.

He also said don't waste your money on "free range" turkeys, either, because "free range" simply means that the cages are open for 15 minutes a day to let them roam free.

Yup, all turkeys taste the same, which is why we're having lamb this Christmas. :mrgreen:

 

[Kobie]

Yup, all turkeys taste the same, which is why we're having lamb this Christmas. :mrgreen:

I'm going with the traditional Christmas goose. As in, I'll grab my girl's ass while she's making me a ham. HAM I SAY

You can't have two turkey holidays within a month of each other. F that ****. Turkey is for thanksgiving, ham or a nice roast is for Christmas, ham is for Easter, hot dogs and gunpowder are for the fourth of july, corned beef and alcoholism are for St. Patrick's Day, some nice tree bark is for arbor day. Period. End of discussion.

 

[PoS]

I'm going with the traditional Christmas goose. As in, I'll grab my girl's ass while she's making me a ham. HAM I SAY

Goose is great. I spent Christmas in Denmark with my friend many years ago, and his family served that with a bunch of other stuff- very salty but excellent.

 

[Kobie]

Goose is great. I spent Christmas in Denmark with my friend many years ago, and his family served that with a bunch of other stuff- very salty but excellent.

Goose is gamy af. I am ok with duck, but goose is kinda grody.

 

[Superfly]

The reverse is to cook low and slow till almost done then blast furnace hot for the sear.

Oh. Thanks. Honestly, sounds like a long, boring way to overcook a steak. :lol:

I turn my cast iron skillet on until it starts to smoke just a bit, then I toss my steak in (after it is salted and at room temp) with no oil or fat, for 2 minutes, each side. Then 1 minute basting with butter, flip, 1 minute basting with butter, and done. Perfect medium rare for about a 1 lb ribeye.

 

[Superfly]

You bring up very good points, however, I'm not in charge, and haven't been since I figured out I never was. Although the 4 drumsticks could motivate me to take a sta... on second thought, I better not.

:lol: :lol:

Maybe you could intice her with the idea that it's less thawing time, less cooking time and a much more tender bird? Never, ever tell her about the 4 drumsticks. Never let her know your weaknesses.