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- Dec 14, 2005
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- Very Conservative
I'm talking about USA--the most powerful government on earth.
ptsdkid said:I'm talking about USA--the most powerful government on earth.
ptsdkid said:Looks like the poll has touched a few loose nerve endings. No where did I say that I am for or against whiners and criticizers of our government. BTW, government and country are one and the same entity, afterall, we the people/taxpayers are the government. So the poll was geared to finding out who are the greatest whiners and criticizers. Sorry if aka 'Try Reading' couldn't 'Try Comprehending' that in the frst place.
If I had known ahead of time of who here would be upset that they wouldn't be an option--I would have sincerely listed them beforehand.
So it looks like I forgot to add these options to the poll:
*Fidel Castro
*Ramsey Clark
*John Kerry
*Nancy Pelosi
*Dingy Harry Reid
*FishX
*hipsterdufus
*tryreading
Please forgive me for this unintentional slip.
ptsdkid said:Looks like the poll has touched a few loose nerve endings. No where did I say that I am for or against whiners and criticizers of our government. BTW, government and country are one and the same entity, afterall, we the people/taxpayers are the government. So the poll was geared to finding out who are the greatest whiners and criticizers. Sorry if aka 'Try Reading' couldn't 'Try Comprehending' that in the frst place.
If I had known ahead of time of who here would be upset that they wouldn't be an option--I would have sincerely listed them beforehand.
So it looks like I forgot to add these options to the poll:
*Fidel Castro
*Ramsey Clark
*John Kerry
*Nancy Pelosi
*Dingy Harry Reid
*FishX
*hipsterdufus
*tryreading
Please forgive me for this unintentional slip.
ptsdkid said:Looks like the poll has touched a few loose nerve endings. No where did I say that I am for or against whiners and criticizers of our government. BTW, government and country are one and the same entity, afterall, we the people/taxpayers are the government. So the poll was geared to finding out who are the greatest whiners and criticizers. Sorry if aka 'Try Reading' couldn't 'Try Comprehending' that in the frst place.
If I had known ahead of time of who here would be upset that they wouldn't be an option--I would have sincerely listed them beforehand.
So it looks like I forgot to add these options to the poll:
*Fidel Castro
*Ramsey Clark
*John Kerry
*Nancy Pelosi
*Dingy Harry Reid
*FishX
*hipsterdufus
*tryreading
Please forgive me for this unintentional slip.
hipsterdufus said:Only 8 months left till the next war on Christmas. :roll:
earthworm said:Posters "signatures" should be limited to three lines..
:applaud :agree :usflag2: :bravo:CoffeeSaint said:I'd like to vote "All of the above."
1. Liberals recognize that our government has made it its sacred mission to remove all of our civil liberties, in order to make us easier to control.
2. Pacifists recognize that the war on terrorism is the facade behind which the oppression of the world and the destruction of everything noble and good about our society is perpetrated
3. Noam Chomsky is probably the single most perceptive intellectual ever to step out of the ivory tower, and to do so without a particularly self-aggrandizing agenda. I'll listen to his complaints with a lot more interest and attention than 99% of the rest of the population, taken as individuals.
4. Saddam Hussein has every reason to criticize, whine, and complain: he went from being a powerful dictator to an animal in a hole, to a laughing stock in a courtroom. We did this to him illegally, and in violation of almost every ideal we hold dear -- except the ideal that our genitalia are larger than anyone else's, and by God, we'll beat you to death with them if you laugh at us. Wouldn't you complain if the government illegally destroyed your life?
And I'd like you to add "Everyone else with half a brain" to your list.
CoffeeSaint said:I'd like to vote "All of the above."
1. Liberals recognize that our government has made it its sacred mission to remove all of our civil liberties, in order to make us easier to control.
2. Pacifists recognize that the war on terrorism is the facade behind which the oppression of the world and the destruction of everything noble and good about our society is perpetrated
3. Noam Chomsky is probably the single most perceptive intellectual ever to step out of the ivory tower, and to do so without a particularly self-aggrandizing agenda. I'll listen to his complaints with a lot more interest and attention than 99% of the rest of the population, taken as individuals.
4. Saddam Hussein has every reason to criticize, whine, and complain: he went from being a powerful dictator to an animal in a hole, to a laughing stock in a courtroom. We did this to him illegally, and in violation of almost every ideal we hold dear -- except the ideal that our genitalia are larger than anyone else's, and by God, we'll beat you to death with them if you laugh at us. Wouldn't you complain if the government illegally destroyed your life?
And I'd like you to add "Everyone else with half a brain" to your list.
Trajan Octavian Titus said:Actually that would be the liberals who want to do that the Conservatives have breached certain ediqute yet broken no laws to fight the war on terror due to a very real threat Clinton did the same thing without a credible threat that posed a clear and present danger to the U.S. he tapped phone calls of political opponents and the like for no reason what so ever. Ever hear of project Echelon?
Yes pacifists are quite idiotic morons with no understanding of reality or the very real threat of Radical-Islamo-facism because they have selective amnesia and can't remember 9-11. Pacifists are the same people who appeased Hitler and nazi Germany. You want peace buddy you damn sure better be ready to kill to get it.
Noam Chomsky sides with every dictator and tyrant in history just as long as they're anti-American, he also works for the Pentagon yet claims to despise the U.S. military, he is a hypocrit of the highest order and a traitor to boot. I hope you know that Chomsky supported pol-pot the mad communist leader in Cambodia who after the U.S. pulled out of Vietnam murdered millions in the worst genocide since WW2, is that your hero, is that your hero!!!!!!!!
Actually we didn't do anything illegal unless you believe the one world government socialist traitors who take the sanctity of the U.N. over the soveriegnty of the United States of America, by the way a joint resolution of congress voted for the use of force in Iraq, and U.N. resolution 1441 threatened serious consequences if Saddam failed to fully comply, so in what way did we act in an illegal fashion? I love that you side with Saddam Hussein though that's just par for the course with you people.
CoffeeSaint said:And I love that you have categorized me based on one statement I made, in one argument, on one online forum. So I'm a socialist who worships Noam Chomsky, and thus a traitor, a coward, an idiotic moron, and a hypocrite?
Tell me, is there anyone you don't hate? Please include yourself in the list of potentials.
I've never heard of Project Echelon, and based on the amount of bile in your post here, I will believe nothing you say about it. But even if you are right, saying that Bill Clinton is a bad man doesn't make all conservatives right, and all liberals wrong. That sort of sweeping generalization is exactly what is wrong with this administration, and this war.
War does not make peace. War makes war.
I don't worship Noam Chomsky. I said I would listen to his complaints before those of most Americans, because I think he is a very intelligent man, who has a less self-aggrandizing agenda than most others in politics. I didn't say I thought he was always right; I don't. But I'll listen to him.
Invading a country to remove a leader you don't like is illegal. Whether or not we agree on the intelligence, justice, or rightness of the war makes no difference here; it was illegal. That was the only point I was making. I fail to see why an ability to understand Hussein's feelings is bad, or why you think it puts me on his side. I understand that what happened to him must have really sucked, in his eyes; doesn't mean I don't think it should have happened.
And remember, please: war is peace, and ignorance is strength. Keep on fighting for Big Brother; maybe you'll get to be in charge of the Ministry of Love.
Trajan Octavian Titus said:Actually that would be the liberals who want to do that the Conservatives have breached certain ediqute yet broken no laws to fight the war on terror due to a very real threat Clinton did the same thing without a credible threat that posed a clear and present danger to the U.S. he tapped phone calls of political opponents and the like for no reason what so ever. Ever hear of project Echelon?
Yes pacifists are quite idiotic morons with no understanding of reality or the very real threat of Radical-Islamo-facism because they have selective amnesia and can't remember 9-11. Pacifists are the same people who appeased Hitler and nazi Germany. You want peace buddy you damn sure better be ready to kill to get it.
Trajan Octavian Titus said:Why aren't conservatives on the list it's the liberals who love the government and think that it should be the cure to all problems. Conservatives dislike the government and believe that it should have very limited functions; defense and the preservation of national security being two of the most important.
tryreading said:The Conservatives dislike the Government? They have controlled Congress for ten years, and the White House for five. How much smaller has our government gotten during that time?
The Republicans have called the Democrats the tax-and-spend party for as long as I can remember. But when the Conservative Republicans have control, they spend more on government and create more government debt than the Democrats ever did. It can't all be blamed on the war, either.
You are believing a lie, which has now been exposed.
ptsdkid said:Looks like the poll has touched a few loose nerve endings. No where did I say that I am for or against whiners and criticizers of our government. BTW, government and country are one and the same entity, afterall, we the people/taxpayers are the government. So the poll was geared to finding out who are the greatest whiners and criticizers. Sorry if aka 'Try Reading' couldn't 'Try Comprehending' that in the frst place.
If I had known ahead of time of who here would be upset that they wouldn't be an option--I would have sincerely listed them beforehand.
So it looks like I forgot to add these options to the poll:
*Fidel Castro
*Ramsey Clark
*John Kerry
*Nancy Pelosi
*Dingy Harry Reid
*FishX
*hipsterdufus
*tryreading
Please forgive me for this unintentional slip.
libertarian_knight said:Government and country are not the same thing. like duh. I mean there are 300 million people (or so) on this country, are 300 million of them in the government? Do 300 million of them (including the infirm, young, and foriegn) take part in governing the country? What if the person is neither net tax-payer nor net tax recipient?
The government is a subset portion of the country, it is a PART. Albeit problmeatic part, like a bad hip or more apporpriately cancer, but a part none the less.
Furthermore, because this country or any other CLAIMS to be fulfilling the "will of the poeple" does not make it necessarily so. History, including large swathes of American History are full of the states attempts to subvert the will of some, the majority, or all of a population (outside those acting "as state").
The reality is, those who complaim most about government are of three groups 1) injured by government unduely (maybe even duely too), 2) Witness to abuse of power or injustice (as power tends to corrupt, and powerless unocrrupted people don't like corruption). or 3) the agents and actors of government itself anyway, becuase they can't rule the universe as they see fit, so they need more law, more power, more time, more support, more money, more control, more secrataries, more departments, more oganization, more oil, more oil indepenence, more more more more more, more whatever (and this fits is all agents or actors, regardless of party or position).
Incidentally, to use your flawed logic equating state and country, I would submit, then, since you say they are the same: those who criticisze the critics, are the biggest of all whiners. Since the critics prevent them from realizing their mythical utopia. So they whine that people are not "supporting the government."
Trajan Octavian Titus said:Agreed but you must admit that the government does have some very necessary functions; such as, defense and securtiy only the federal government has the authority and the ability to wage war on a large enough scale necessary for victory. However, after victory and sustainable security is achieved the government should retain it's limited intervention in the lives of the individual.
libertarian_knight said:Should government exist, it's role should be limited to defense, not foriegn wars of agression. Security should be limited to securing the Blessings of Liberty, which are in high contradiction at times to the security espoused by the statists. TO which, the US federal government, through law and court, has decided it is NOT the role of the federales or the police to protect people from harm anyway.
The federal government has be consistantly shown to disfavor rights, like people being secure in thier persons, papers, houses, and effects; or secure in their liberty to decide medical and social behavior that does not violate other's liberty; or secure in their right to criticize the state at any time; or to obtain redress of grievences due to state intervention; or secure in thier paychecks.
You are right, national governments are the only groups who can STEAL enough money to fund wars though. Of course, the only reason national governments are the only institutions with the "authority" to "provide defense and security" is because they outlaw, arrest, and convict anyone else that tries.
Not allowing people to "take the law into their own hands" is more about establishing supremacy of the state, and much less about mitigation of the adverse effects of vigilantism and "mob justice."