Who is responsible for the explosions in the two Baltic Sea gas pipelines?

[The Mark]

Do you always stay quiet and never ask what might be the cause of something?
Are you never curious about anything?

Of course.

But there's no real purpose to speculation here, so far as I can tell.

 

[Schrott]

The United States. There is very little doubt in my mind. Btw, it's disingenuous to not put the U.S. in your poll.

Not a fan of Tucker Carlson, but for once he summarizes what I already knew:

Tucker is very much wrong, NS2 never delivered any gas and would have never delivered any gas. NS1 is out of service since 4 weeks, no gas delivering to Europe.
Gas export by Russia via the Ukraine pipeline is down to 8% of all gas imports of Europe.
Europe has freed itself of Russian gas, with a lot of money.
NS1 and NS2 were obsolete
Blowing them up, obsolete, is Putlers play book, FEAR. Showing Europe that its undersea infrastructure is very vulnerable, creating FEAR and trying to put a wedge into the support for the Ukraine.

 

[Rumpel]

Blowing them up, obsolete, is Putlers play book, FEAR. Showing Europe that its undersea infrastructure is very vulnerable, creating FEAR and trying to put a wedge into the support for the Ukraine.

So it is, probably.

 

[Rumpel]

Btw, it's disingenuous to not put the U.S. in your poll.

But it is! Can't you read?
There is is:

some other country​

 

[EnigmaO01]

Donald Trump and his supporters. You can blame them for the Florida hurricane too and whatever else comes up. As a wise man once said, "To recognize a problem shows discernment. To blame someone else for the problem shows great political potential."

Please stop hijacking this thread with your snarky comments.

 

[Bum]

Who is responsible for the explosions in the two Baltic Sea gas pipelines?​

My first choice was Taco Bell, but I think they pulled out of Russia like a cheap and regretful date....

 

[EnigmaO01]

I don't know and will not speculate except to say that Russia had the means to shut the pipelines down without having to damage them. Why blow up what you can turn off at the tap? This is all very murky.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

It's a message to show what they can do with other pipelines. It's no coincidence one of the explosions was close to the Danish pipeline and a power cable and around the same time as the Danish pipeline that will supply Poland as Russia used to began operation.

 

[EnigmaO01]

Now 14 out of 17 say: Russia.
But why?
What interest may Russia has in this?

As I indicated in my previous post it's a shot across the bow from Russia what can happen to other pipelines or energy related transfer equipment. It would have been an act of war or close to an act of war if Russia had attacked the Baltic Pipeline itself. It's no coincidence one of the explosions was close to the Baltic pipeline and and an undersea power cable that is presently not in use, and the timing of the opening of the Baltic gas line.

To me is this very clearly a provication by Putin, "Be careful what you do we can do serious damage to you."

 

[Captain America]

It was Antifa! Dammit Obama!

 

[jmotivator]

I would guess natural causes/Human Error. It could be be as simple as sub-standard materials coupled with overpressure.

It would be weird for it to be the Russians since they could have just shut down the pipeline with the same effect.

It doesn't make sense to be anybody else, either, since all the other countries can only lose from the loss of the pipeline...

 

[Cardinal]

I haven't voted yet

I would guess natural causes/Human Error. It could be be as simple as sub-standard materials coupled with overpressure.

It would be weird for it to be the Russians since they could have just shut down the pipeline with the same effect.

It doesn't make sense to be anybody else, either, since all the other countries can only lose from the loss of the pipeline...

Not great reasons, but they're reasons:

1) Bombing another country's pipe would have been an act of wire.
2) Raises the price of gas, which is more or less Russia's only economic lifeline.
3) Increases the European feeling of vulnerability in the coming winter, so it's psychological warfare to stop them from helping Ukraine.

Is it stupid for Russia to blow up their own pipe? Yes, absolutely. But what about the last seven months has Russia done that's in its own best interests?

 

[Peter]

MI6. Military Intelligence, section six; a former official and present-day popular name for the intelligence and espionage agency of the British Government.

Why?
MI6 are busy looking for a replacement for James Bond at the moment so it can't be them.

 

[jmotivator]

I haven't voted yet

Not great reasons, but they're reasons:

1) Bombing another country's pipe would have been an act of wire.
2) Raises the price of gas, which is more or less Russia's only economic lifeline.
3) Increases the European feeling of vulnerability in the coming winter, so it's psychological warfare to stop them from helping Ukraine.

Is it stupid for Russia to blow up their own pipe? Yes, absolutely. But what about the last seven months has Russia done that's in its own best interests?

Fair points, I suppose, but destroying one of their main distribution lines would be counter productive if driving up the price was the goal. Too many alternatives once the price gets too high.

Psychological warfare is also possible, but he could do that by shutting down the pipeline.

All of these reasons kind of come together if we look at it from a scorched earth or Last Days of the Reich perspective. While the last few months have proven Putin's hubris, it's easy to contemplate that he overestimated this own military and is not trapped in a megalomaniacal sunk cost fallacy... but I still can't fit destroying his own pipeline into that MO.

 

[Evilroddy]

It's a message to show what they can do with other pipelines. It's no coincidence one of the explosions was close to the Danish pipeline and a power cable and around the same time as the Danish pipeline that will supply Poland as Russia used to began operation.

EnigmaO01:

Alas, that is all just speculation. Neither of us have any direct evidence to support your claims or my ignorance. But that is where we are at this time.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

 

[Rumpel]

I would guess natural causes/Human Error. It could be be as simple as sub-standard materials coupled with overpressure.

There is an indication that very strong bombs were used to destroy those pipelines.
Only governments have access to such bombs.

And the question now is: "Which government did it?"
The most likely answer is: "Russia!"

 

[jmotivator]

There is an indication that very strong bombs were used to destroy those pipelines.
Only governments have access to such bombs.

And the question now is: "Which government did it?"
The most likely answer is: "Russia!"

It could be, but so many stories like this throughout history have been used as pretense to catastrophic wars. If someone did that, they did it to provoke a response, so until we have solid evidence, my position is to err on the side of caution and not take the bait.

 

[jpevans]

It is mystery or a puzzle or a riddle or an enigma - as I said .....

Maybe start a pole. I vote enigma...

 

[jpevans]

There is an indication that very strong bombs were used to destroy those pipelines.
Only governments have access to such bombs.

And the question now is: "Which government did it?"
The most likely answer is: "Russia!"

Super villains have access to all the latest tech...

Seriously a Russian ship was seen in the vicinity. 2+2=

 

[Rumpel]

Seriously a Russian ship was seen in the vicinity. 2+2=

2 + 2 = 4

 

[Rumpel]

Maybe start a pole. I vote enigma...

A pole dancing or a poll thread?
A poll thread we have already here.

 

[antiquity]

Tucker is very much wrong, NS2 never delivered any gas and would have never delivered any gas. NS1 is out of service since 4 weeks, no gas delivering to Europe.
Gas export by Russia via the Ukraine pipeline is down to 8% of all gas imports of Europe.
Europe has freed itself of Russian gas, with a lot of money.
NS1 and NS2 were obsolete
Blowing them up, obsolete, is Putlers play book, FEAR. Showing Europe that its undersea infrastructure is very vulnerable, creating FEAR and trying to put a wedge into the support for the Ukraine.

Wait a minute.....have you seen the footage of the boiling gas erupting from the Baltic. If the pipe line was out of service what do you think this is from?

 

[basionok]

The damage to Russia’s Nord Stream 1 and 2 pipelines means Europe is indefinitely deprived of one of its key gas supply routes, Gazprom spokesman Sergey Kupriyanov said on Friday.

Technical data “allows [Gazprom] to say with certainty” that the sharp pressure drops were caused by physical damage, the spokesman stressed.

At the time of the incident, the pipelines were not transporting gas, but both were filled with 800 million cubic meters of gas and ready for service, equivalent to Denmark’s consumption for three months.

“Essentially, Europe is indefinitely deprived of one of the key routes for obtaining a crucial energy resource. Russia and Gazprom spent a huge amount of energy and money to build and launch these pipelines because this is the shortest and safest, as we thought, way for Russian gas to reach European consumers. Now the pipelines are standing with puncture holes,” Kupriyanov said at a UN Security Council meeting.

“Gazprom has begun searching for possible solutions to get the Nord Stream system back up and running, but the timeline cannot yet be estimated… This is a very difficult technical task,” Kupriyanov said, noting that in order to assess the situation, Gazprom will have to start with a physical inspection of the damaged areas.

Europe ‘indefinitely deprived’ of key gas supply route – Gazprom

Gazprom has commented on the damage done to Europe’s most important gas connector by alleged sabotage

www.rt.com

 

[basionok]

Maria Zakharova said that the UK’s offer to assist Denmark in the investigation into sabotage at the Nord Stream and Nord Stream 2 gas pipelines resembled "foxes fighting for chickens’ rights."

"The UK offered Denmark its help in investigating sabotage at Nord Streams, the office of [UK] Prime Minister [Liz Truss] reported. Foxes are fighting for chickens’ rights."

Russian diplomat slams London’s assistance in investigation into pipeline incident

"Foxes are fighting for chickens’ rights," the diplomat wrote

tass.com

 

[basionok]

"You have to look at who are the state actors that have the capability to do this. And that means the [UK’s] Royal Navy and the United States’ Navy <…> I think that’s pretty clear," Macgregor said. He also noted the publication by Poland’s former foreign minister (2007-2014), European parliament member Radoslaw Sikorski, who thanked the United States for damaging the Nord Stream 1 and Nord Stream 2 gas pipelines on his Twitter page.

Ex-advisor to the Pentagon chief called the notion that Moscow was behind the incident at the pipelines absurd. "The Russians did not do this," he said, adding that Germany’s involvement in the incident was "extremely unlikely" either.

Ex-advisor to Pentagon chief suggests US, UK might be behind Nord Streams incident

Douglas Macgregor called the notion that Moscow was behind the incident at the pipelines absurd

tass.com

 

[MrNiceGuy]

European leaders blame sabotage as gas pours into Baltic from Nord Stream pipelines

Ursula Von der Leyen warns of ‘strongest possible response’ to attacks on European energy infrastructure

www.theguardian.com

Who is responsible for the explosions in the two Baltic Sea gas pipelines?

Who is your prime suspect?

I can't imagine why Russia would sabotage its own pipelines. They can simple shut it off. No need to blow it up.