When did you start believing Russia was the Enemy of the United States/the Western World?

[Felis Leo]

This is for those in the room who consider themselves anti-Russian and view the Russian Federation presently led by Vladimir Putin as either the enemy or geopolitical rival of the United States and the Western World in general.

My particular animus towards Russia came about in 2008 when they invaded Georgia, and I realized just how thuggish the Russian regime truly was. I realized that Russia had been a rather sad, corrupt backwater. But the Georgian invasion made me realize the depth and sinister elements of Russian nationalism and the ruthlessness of the Russian state itself.

What about you? When did you have your awakening and realize that the Russian state was the enemy of the United States?

 

[Sampson Simpson]

Haven't they always been? There was a cooling off after Soviet Union collapsed. But lets be real,Putin is dangerous, and very adversarial to the US

 

[NeverTrump]

This is for those in the room who consider themselves anti-Russian and view the Russian Federation presently led by Vladimir Putin as either the enemy or geopolitical rival of the United States and the Western World in general.

My particular animus towards Russia came about in 2008 when they invaded Georgia, and I realized just how thuggish the Russian regime truly was. I realized that Russia had been a rather sad, corrupt backwater. But the Georgian invasion made me realize the depth and sinister elements of Russian nationalism and the ruthlessness of the Russian state itself.

What about you? When did you have your awakening and realize that the Russian state was the enemy of the United States?

I think it's pretty clear that the Cold War never ended and Russians just convinced the GOP that it did.

 

[Felis Leo]

Haven't they always been? There was a cooling off after Soviet Union collapsed. But lets be real,Putin is dangerous, and very adversarial to the US

Well, yes, Sampson Simpson, that is clear but I contend only in hindsight or to those who kept close watch on the developments within Russia throughout the late-1990s and into the early 2000s. Many (including myself) thought that the cooling-off period would lead the Russian Federation into becoming a fellow "Westernized" nation with open democratic institutions, increased civil liberties and rule of law, rather than a corrupt, nationalistic, militaristic autocracy. Many thought that the threat posed by Russia was largely over and that Russia would join the family of nations (the democratic law-governed ones, that is). I was wrong to have been so overly optimistic. And I do not think I was alone in my optimism.

 

[Chomsky]

Re: When did you start believing Russia was the Enemy of the United States/the Western World?

Ever since Joe Stalin occupied my family's former country, enslaving the family members that remained.

 

[Chomsky]

Well, yes, Sampson Simpson, that is clear but I contend only in hindsight or to those who kept close watch on the developments within Russia throughout the late-1990s and into the early 2000s. Many (including myself) thought that the cooling-off period would lead the Russian Federation into becoming a fellow "Westernized" nation with open democratic institutions, increased civil liberties and rule of law, rather than a corrupt, nationalistic, militaristic autocracy. Many thought that the threat posed by Russia was largely over and that Russia would join family of (democratic law-governed) nations. I was wrong to have been so overly optimistic. And I do not think I was alone in my optimism.

You are right here, and I believed the same.

But then in came Putin. Now as to whether Putin led the charge back to the old ways, or rather reflected the populace's changing direction, is perhaps a subject worthy of fruitful debate. But regardless, it is what it is.

 

[DaveFagan]

This is for those in the room who consider themselves anti-Russian and view the Russian Federation presently led by Vladimir Putin as either the enemy or geopolitical rival of the United States and the Western World in general.

My particular animus towards Russia came about in 2008 when they invaded Georgia, and I realized just how thuggish the Russian regime truly was. I realized that Russia had been a rather sad, corrupt backwater. But the Georgian invasion made me realize the depth and sinister elements of Russian nationalism and the ruthlessness of the Russian state itself.

What about you? When did you have your awakening and realize that the Russian state was the enemy of the United States?

Georgia/Saakashvili and the CIA invaded Ossetia and killed Ossetians and Russians. The Russians retaliated and marched accross Georgia to the Capitol and stopped. They could have taken Georgia if they had any such intentions. Instead, they said "Au revoir, cokesuckaires," and went home. Yep! Sure sound like land grabbin' imperialists to me, or not? Ruthless, yes. Imperialists, no. I've never felt the USA threatened by Russia until the USA decided to meke Russia the goat in a new Cold War to keep MIC profits flowing. Sanctions, economic weapons, accusations, and lo and behoold, China and Russia are forced to become allies, especially economically. The USA will regret the economically part. The debt of the USA makes the Western Economic System a "house of cards" and now China and Russia are building viable alternatives to the Western Economic System. Russia is our enemy because we forced it to be that way. Don't bring up Ukraine and Crimea unless you are willing to acknowledge the CIA/NED/USAID/USA initiated coup d'etat and lack of recognition of that gov't by Crimea and Donbass. The USA thought they could control the Ukraine gas pipeline fed by Russian gas to the EU. TurkStream is about to connect to EU and also NordStream 2. Ukraine is going to get the big squeeze play unless they pay upfront for gas. Wait, it's coming to me, they can pay double for USA LNG. Wowser. USA stupid politics is going to wind up babysitting Ukraine and lending it more and more money as a major liability. Last words. Putin has done a magnificient job of resurrecting Russia from the shambles the USA/EU allowed the Nations to become. His job is to take care of Russians and he does. He's elected. Find a transcript of his annual press conference and see if he knows anything and weigh that info carefully by comparison against any Western leader. I've done my best to answer your question.
/

 

[Helix]

For me, it was when Ivan Drago said "I must break you."

 

[Helix]

On a more serious note, I consider Russia to be more of an adversary / somewhat hostile nation than an "enemy."

 

[PirateMk1]

I think it's pretty clear that the Cold War never ended and Russians just convinced the GOP that it did.

They convinced the democrats it never started.

 

[Xelor]

Temporally, 2014 is a point of demarcation; however, as the poll option implies that Ukrainian goings on are the lynchpin. They are not. Thought the Ukrainian usurpations are sources of my opprobrium toward Russia, or more precisely, toward Putin, they are merely coincident with Putin's commencement to undermine US democracy, which is the pivotal policy action that engendered my disdain for Putin, and by association, today's Russia/Kremlin.

 

[Crosscheck]

We may not be in an active war with Russia at this moment. But it is very hard to trust the Russians.


They are of a different culture than us. When our government tries to negotiate with them we wrongly assume we are dealing with someone who has similar values to us.


After having the Russians over for a state dinner at the White House I think it would behoove the staff to count the silverware.

 

[Lutherf]

This is for those in the room who consider themselves anti-Russian and view the Russian Federation presently led by Vladimir Putin as either the enemy or geopolitical rival of the United States and the Western World in general.

My particular animus towards Russia came about in 2008 when they invaded Georgia, and I realized just how thuggish the Russian regime truly was. I realized that Russia had been a rather sad, corrupt backwater. But the Georgian invasion made me realize the depth and sinister elements of Russian nationalism and the ruthlessness of the Russian state itself.

What about you? When did you have your awakening and realize that the Russian state was the enemy of the United States?

One of two things happened in Russia at the collapse of the Soviet Union. Either the collapse was planned as a way to more readily spread the ideals of Marxism/Leninism or the collapse merely resulted in the former party apparatus turning into street criminals rather than political ones. If the former is the case then Putin is likely leading the single biggest propaganda operation the world has ever seen and he’s doing so successfully. If the latter is the case then, over time, the influence of these corruptocrats will wane as they pass away and their operations get diluted by their successors.

 

[Manc Skipper]

Well, yes, Sampson Simpson, that is clear but I contend only in hindsight or to those who kept close watch on the developments within Russia throughout the late-1990s and into the early 2000s. Many (including myself) thought that the cooling-off period would lead the Russian Federation into becoming a fellow "Westernized" nation with open democratic institutions, increased civil liberties and rule of law, rather than a corrupt, nationalistic, militaristic autocracy. Many thought that the threat posed by Russia was largely over and that Russia would join the family of nations (the democratic law-governed ones, that is). I was wrong to have been so overly optimistic. And I do not think I was alone in my optimism.

I would agree with that impression, it seemed to be broadly positive until Putin won/took power. With his background, personal enrichment while "restoring his once-proud nation" etc etc
There was only one way it was going to go. Kleptocractic nationalism.

 

[MrWonka]

What about you? When did you have your awakening and realize that the Russian state was the enemy of the United States?

Russia has always been an adversary or frenemy in my book. I tried to give them the benefit of the doubt as much as possible during most of the 2000s, but Putin's rise was certainly the turning point where we had to stop kidding ourselves that they were going make the full transition into ally.

 

[Mach]

Hey, I saw Red Dawn, I know school kids would one day be our last defense against the Ruskies!

Once Putin took power...probably shortly after that. But you're right to question...I don't *really* recall when.
Once they stopped moving towards Democracy, maybe that's actually like 2006 or something. But there was always that latent red-scare era upbringing in the back of the mind.
Remember, Hunt for Red October too...the Arnold movie Red Heat, I mean, Russia was the villain in American popular culture for a long time.

 

[Myview]

Russia's national personality just believes there is a spy behind every tree and everyone is out to get them. It might be a product of being invaded multiple times but they have always been antagonistic and fiercely over reactive to what they see as threats.

 

[RabidAlpaca]

They convinced the democrats it never started.

Please provide some sources of Democrat politicians that believe there was never a cold war. Talking out of your ass as usual.

 

[Felis Leo]

One of two things happened in Russia at the collapse of the Soviet Union. Either the collapse was planned as a way to more readily spread the ideals of Marxism/Leninism or the collapse merely resulted in the former party apparatus turning into street criminals rather than political ones. If the former is the case then Putin is likely leading the single biggest propaganda operation the world has ever seen and he’s doing so successfully. If the latter is the case then, over time, the influence of these corruptocrats will wane as they pass away and their operations get diluted by their successors.

I would say it was the latter situation. I do not think the men presently in charge of Russia are die-hard Marxist-Leninists who want to recreate a Utopian Workers State.

 

[Lutherf]

I would say it was the latter situation. I do not think the men presently in charge of Russia are die-hard Marxist-Leninists who want to recreate a Utopian Workers State.

I really don't believe that Marxism/Leninism had a goal of creating a utopian worker's state. I'm decidedly more of the opinion that Marxism/Leninism was primarily a mechanism to encourage the proletariat to accept subjugation by the state. However, that's probably a discussion better suited to a different thread.

 

[Waddy]

Russia is not an enemy. They just want security for their country. The US is the aggressor. How many foreign bases does the US have? Russia?

We have a lot more to fear from China.

 

[Sampson Simpson]

Well, yes, Sampson Simpson, that is clear but I contend only in hindsight or to those who kept close watch on the developments within Russia throughout the late-1990s and into the early 2000s. Many (including myself) thought that the cooling-off period would lead the Russian Federation into becoming a fellow "Westernized" nation with open democratic institutions, increased civil liberties and rule of law, rather than a corrupt, nationalistic, militaristic autocracy. Many thought that the threat posed by Russia was largely over and that Russia would join the family of nations (the democratic law-governed ones, that is). I was wrong to have been so overly optimistic. And I do not think I was alone in my optimism.

is there a time in Russian history where they weren't ruled by asshole dictators? it's up to the people to instill change, outside forces can't ever do that. We are seeing that in Iraq and Afghanistan

 

[Sampson Simpson]

They convinced the democrats it never started.

What? are you a parrot? I don't get why all these forums are flooded with childish people posting the dumbest **** ever. What do they seriously get out of making no arguments and just flooding the forum with dumb one liners and deflections?

 

[Felis Leo]

is there a time in Russian history where they weren't ruled by asshole dictators? it's up to the people to instill change, outside forces can't ever do that. We are seeing that in Iraq and Afghanistan

Mmmmm...well, you got me. I cannot think of a time when Russia was not ruled over by brutal autocrats. Even those who are looked at with some degree of sympathetic admiration, like Nikita Kruschev, Mikhail Gorbachev and Tsar Peter the Great were pretty damn ruthless.

 

[FreedomFromAll]

Well, yes, Sampson Simpson, that is clear but I contend only in hindsight or to those who kept close watch on the developments within Russia throughout the late-1990s and into the early 2000s. Many (including myself) thought that the cooling-off period would lead the Russian Federation into becoming a fellow "Westernized" nation with open democratic institutions, increased civil liberties and rule of law, rather than a corrupt, nationalistic, militaristic autocracy. Many thought that the threat posed by Russia was largely over and that Russia would join the family of nations (the democratic law-governed ones, that is). I was wrong to have been so overly optimistic. And I do not think I was alone in my optimism.

No you were not alone in your optimism, but you forgot to wait and see first, like everyone else.