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What's worse for you Trump supporters: A fair election where Trump lost or defeating a Democratic Conspiracy where Trump wins?

As a Trump supporter, which is worse for you?


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exoplanet

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I know it's kind of a lose/lose situation for Trump supporters, so that's why I phrased it as "worse". This is intended for Trump supporters to answer for themselves, not for others to try and answer for them. Although I suppose I can't keep others from responding.
 

Rhakron90

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I know it's kind of a lose/lose situation for Trump supporters, so that's why I phrased it as "worse". This is intended for Trump supporters to answer for themselves, not for others to try and answer for them. Although I suppose I can't keep others from responding.

The only downside to Trump winning is that the majority of Dems wouldn't accept it, and Leftist violence in major cities would likely explode once again.

Apart from that... It'd simply mean that we would have to be incredibly vigilant from here on out, in order to prevent further instances of fraud.
 

Cardinal

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The only downside to Trump winning is that the majority of Dems wouldn't accept it, and Leftist violence in major cities would likely explode once again.

Apart from that... It'd simply mean that we would have to be incredibly vigilant from here on out, in order to prevent further instances of fraud.

If there's fraud you better tell trump's lawyers quick. They keep telling judges that there's been no fraud.
 

chuckiechan

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I know it's kind of a lose/lose situation for Trump supporters, so that's why I phrased it as "worse". This is intended for Trump supporters to answer for themselves, not for others to try and answer for them. Although I suppose I can't keep others from responding.
An honest election is better than a crooked win.

You don’t even need Trumps name in the poll unless you are trying to prove a point.
 

What if...?

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If there's fraud you better tell trump's lawyers quick. They keep telling judges that there's been no fraud.
The rhetoric is fraud. The cases are attempts to disenfranchise eligible voters by technicalities.
 

exoplanet

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An honest election is better than a crooked win.

You don’t even need Trumps name in the poll unless you are trying to prove a point.
There is no crooked win in either scenario. There is corruption in one, but it is not successful.
 

CHuDWah

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I know it's kind of a lose/lose situation for Trump supporters, so that's why I phrased it as "worse". This is intended for Trump supporters to answer for themselves, not for others to try and answer for them. Although I suppose I can't keep others from responding.


I'm not a Trump supporter so I'll respect your wishes and not vote in your poll. But why would your second option be "worse"? Trump would get a second term and his claims of voter fraud would be validated. Seems like a win-win for him.
 

exoplanet

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I'm not a Trump supporter so I'll respect your wishes and not vote in your poll. But why would your second option be "worse"? Trump would get a second term and his claims of voter fraud would be validated. Seems like a win-win for him.
I think it's fair to assume that the best possible outcome for them would be a free and fair election that Trump wins. Since this is not an option, I think choosing the worst is fair.
 

Captain Adverse

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I know it's kind of a lose/lose situation for Trump supporters, so that's why I phrased it as "worse". This is intended for Trump supporters to answer for themselves, not for others to try and answer for them. Although I suppose I can't keep others from responding.

Can't answer a "choice between the lesser of two evils" kind of poll.

Option 1 is irrelevant in the US Presidential Election situation, as the President is NOT "elected by the popular vote." The President is chosen by the Electoral College. In fact, there have been 4 prior Presidents, with Trump's win in 2016 at #5.

John Quincy Adams in 1824.

Rutherford B. Hayes in 1876.

Benjamin Harrison in 1888.

George W, Bush in 2000.

So Trump could be the Constitutionally elected victor IF his "path to victory" via legal challenges in several States ultimately results in his re-election via the Electoral College vote.

Option 2. is also irrelevant. There is some level of fraud in just about every election; usually fairly minor in so far as we are currently aware. However, in THIS election which changed the process rather drastically with a "last minute" change in mail-in balloting we are face with opened doors to several kinds of voter fraud. Some of which are being pressed in legal battles as I write.

Moreover, I point to the biggest flaw in your own OP statement I bolded above. Your presumption that either choice is a "lose/lose" situation for those of us who voted for Trump. It belies any real interest in our participation. As far as the OP is concerned, we "LOSE" no matter what choice we make.

So, I can't vote. I don't doubt however that there will be members who never supported Trump, nor voted for him who will be happy to participate. :coffee:
 

Mr Person

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An honest election is better than a crooked win.

You don’t even need Trumps name in the poll unless you are trying to prove a point.

Why do Trump's lawyers keep telling judges that they have no evidence of fraud?

Maybe I'm just an 'ole country lawyer, but it seems to me that that's a bad way to go about proving the existence of fraud. 🤷
 

exoplanet

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Can't answer a "choice between the lesser of two evils" kind of poll.

Option 1 is irrelevant in the US Presidential Election situation, as the President is NOT "elected by the popular vote." The President is chosen by the Electoral College. In fact, there have been 4 prior Presidents, with Trump's win in 2016 at #5.

John Quincy Adams in 1824.

Rutherford B. Hayes in 1876.

Benjamin Harrison in 1888.

George W, Bush in 2000.

So Trump could be the Constitutionally elected victor IF his "path to victory" via legal challenges in several States ultimately results in his re-election via the Electoral College vote.

Option 2. is also irrelevant. There is some level of fraud in just about every election; usually fairly minor in so far as we are currently aware. However, in THIS election which changed the process rather drastically with a "last minute" change in mail-in balloting we are face with opened doors to several kinds of voter fraud. Some of which are being pressed in legal battles as I write.

Moreover, I point to the biggest flaw in your own OP statement I bolded above. Your presumption that either choice is a "lose/lose" situation for those of us who voted for Trump. It belies any real interest in our participation. As far as the OP is concerned, we "LOSE" no matter what choice we make.

So, I can't vote. I don't doubt however that there will be members who never supported Trump, nor voted for him who will be happy to participate. :coffee:
I understand if you don't want to participate. However, factually speaking, getting a majority in enough states is how most electoral votes are awarded (with the exceptions of Iowa and Maine, but that they are not necessary to win). That is if you get the majority of votes in PA - you get PA's electoral votes, get the majority in Nevada - you get their electoral vote and so on until the winner gets "A majority of Americans in enough states" to vote for them.

I'm not sure why you think option 2 involving "We have a widespread, orchestrated, deeply rooted voter fraud operation" is irrelevant to the charges being leveled after this election.
 

exoplanet

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And just to be clear folks, this poll is asking which is WORSE for you. Two people have selected a free and fair Biden win as their pick as the WORST option. I believe I left the option open to change your response if you want.
 

Captain Adverse

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I understand if you don't want to participate. However, factually speaking, getting a majority in enough states is how most electoral votes are awarded (with the exceptions of Iowa and Maine, but that they are not necessary to win). That is if you get the majority of votes in PA - you get PA's electoral votes, get the majority in Nevada - you get their electoral vote and so on until the winner gets "A majority of Americans in enough states" to vote for them.

Actually, the Constitution leaves it up to each State Legislature to determine how Electors are chosen. Most have selected not only via popular vote, but other than the two States you mention, it is winner take all.

However, the choice still remains with State Legislatures. They could literally decide to change the process and simply appoint Electors. Moreover, once an Elector is chosen and seated in the Electoral College, they can vote "unfaithfully" as happened with seven back in 2016. 4 voted for Trump, 2 for Hillary, and 2 for 3rd party.

I'm not sure why you think option 2 involving "We have a widespread, orchestrated, deeply rooted voter fraud operation" is irrelevant to the charges being leveled after this election.

Because your question is "What's worse for you Trump supporters:.."

You are casting either as "worse." There is no "positive" choice.

Why would I vote for a choice that simply serves to reinforce your (and the rest of the "disloyal opposition's") confirmation bias?
 

exoplanet

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Actually, the Constitution leaves it up to each State Legislature to determine how Electors are chosen. Most have selected not only via popular vote, but other than the two States you mention, it is winner take all.

However, the choice still remains with State Legislatures. They could literally decide to change the process and simply appoint Electors. Moreover, once an Elector is chosen and seated in the Electoral College, they can vote "unfaithfully" as happened with seven back in 2016. 4 voted for Trump, 2 for Hillary, and 2 for 3rd party.
The states have already clearly laid out how they choose electors and that involves the majority of votes. Given that Biden has appears to have amassed those votes in the right areas, there is no need for states to change their rules for Biden to get the electoral votes he needs.

Because your question is "What's worse for you Trump supporters:.."

You are casting either as "worse." There is no "positive" choice.

Why would I vote for a choice that simply serves to reinforce your (and the rest of the "disloyal opposition's") confirmation bias?
I understand why you wouldn't want to, I just wondered why you thought it wasn't relevant. But that's ok. :)
 

CHuDWah

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I think it's fair to assume that the best possible outcome for them would be a free and fair election that Trump wins. Since this is not an option, I think choosing the worst is fair.


Your OP states, "This is intended for Trump supporters to answer for themselves, not for others to try and answer for them." It seems that's what we're both doing. That said, I agree with the bolded but again, I'm not eligible to vote in your poll. However, I'm not convinced Trump supporters would consider your second option the worse.
 

exoplanet

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Your OP states, "This is intended for Trump supporters to answer for themselves, not for others to try and answer for them." It seems that's what we're both doing. That said, I agree with the bolded but again, I'm not eligible to vote in your poll. However, I'm not convinced Trump supporters would consider your second option the worse.
The options I present in my poll, are basically just the most popular narratives about what happened in the election. There are edge cases of course and different ways you can phrase things, but essentially this is what polls are asking people.

If someone polls "Did Biden win the election?" this is at least part of what I think is underlying people's thought process about what's happened. The only real difference is that I'm presenting it as a preference. For non-Trump supporters would be a trivial question and isn't interesting at all.

I understand why this poll might be distasteful for Trump supporters, but it seems quite relevant to the situation we're in right now.
 

CHuDWah

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The options I present in my poll, are basically just the most popular narratives about what happened in the election. There are edge cases of course and different ways you can phrase things, but essentially this is what polls are asking people.

If someone polls "Did Biden win the election?" this is at least part of what I think is underlying people's thought process about what's happened. The only real difference is that I'm presenting it as a preference. For non-Trump supporters would be a trivial question and isn't interesting at all.

I understand why this poll might be distasteful for Trump supporters, but it seems quite relevant to the situation we're in right now.


I do find the poll interesting and I understand why you constructed it as you did. Although I expressed my opinion as to its choices, I'm not a Trump supporter so I realize that opinion is irrelevant within the poll parameters
 

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I know it's kind of a lose/lose situation for Trump supporters, so that's why I phrased it as "worse". This is intended for Trump supporters to answer for themselves, not for others to try and answer for them. Although I suppose I can't keep others from responding.

Having valid and secure elections are the most important thing, even if it goes against what you want.
 

exoplanet

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Having valid and secure elections are the most important thing, even if it goes against what you want.
Yes, I hope it was clear though that for the second option I meant a Democratic conspiracy that simply fails (rather than Trump winning because of fraud). Another way of thinking about it is: Do we need to clean up an apparatus that has committed widespread fraud, or do we have to deal with a clear majority of Americans who support more liberal ideals than Trump?
 

Fishking

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Yes, I hope it was clear though that for the second option I meant a Democratic conspiracy that simply fails (rather than Trump winning because of fraud). Another way of thinking about it is: Do we need to clean up an apparatus that has committed widespread fraud, or do we have to deal with a clear majority of Americans who support more liberal ideals than Trump?

I think, at the very least, we need to have a more transparent system that gives people more confidence in it, even if the current one has no issues. So there is that at the very least. But yes...I understood your options. Having a system that's corrupted but still didn't quite beat Trump is only kicking the can down the road and it still being an issue.
 

Moi621

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I know it's kind of a lose/lose situation for Trump supporters, so that's why I phrased it as "worse". This is intended for Trump supporters to answer for themselves, not for others to try and answer for them. Although I suppose I can't keep others from responding.

Yes, @exoplanet , Vote Fraud happens.



Luckily, my part of The O.C. defeated the Democratic Party
that stole the previous election in the 48th Congressional District of California.

How?
Same day voter registration & ballot harvesters working the homeless camps
among other means.
Although legal in California, illegal in many States. Democrats



Historically, we know "dirty games" escalate.
LBJ spied on Barry Goldwater's life.
NIXON upped the degree. Bipartisan


Of course NIXON lost to voter fraud in '60
due to shenanigans in Illinois & Texas. Democrats


And so it goes.
Get rid of computers and go to hard copy voting.
No completed registration before verifying eligibility.
Establish Federal standards minimally for Federal offices.
Ballot verification before counting.
This should include voter ID when appearing in person.
Computer verify in person voters are not voting multiple times.
Which Party is opposed? Democrats

And then there is making it difficult for voters to vote as Hillary
and her DNC did in the '16 primaries via lost registrations, etc.
at voting stations in Sanders strong holds. intra Democrats


Go figure!



Moi
Voted Obama '08.
My State did more than Obama to stop the foreclosure crisis.







Don't 🇨🇦ize
🇺🇸
 

iguanaman

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Having valid and secure elections are the most important thing, even if it goes against what you want.
So when the one term mistake said that the election would be fraudulent IF he lost he was wrong?
 

exoplanet

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Given the feedback I've seen in the thread, I don't feel like people understood the question as it was phrased (choose the "worse" option). I'll have to pay more attention to the way I set things up if I do another poll. I think people naturally assume that they are choosing what they would prefer.
 

bongsaway

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An honest election is better than a crooked win.

You don’t even need Trumps name in the poll unless you are trying to prove a point.
Yeah, americans didn't buy into the bullcrap from 2016 this time around.
 

Fishking

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So when the one term mistake said that the election would be fraudulent IF he lost he was wrong?

That's what it looks like. Though I do get annoyed by those who spent 4 years claiming invalid elections because of Russian interference being preachy about it now.
 
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