What would you consider this portion in regards to abortoin

[Zyphlin]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

 

[MaggieD]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

I'd call it Pro Choice. (That's pretty much my personal position, by the way. But at 20 weeks.)

 

[Spriggs05]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

I'm not sure since it depends how long after the first trimester they are willing to tolerate abortion, if it is 12 weeks and 1 day , then pro life, if at more than 17 weeks, then pro choice. Boundary at about 13/14 weeks judging from the pro lifers on this forum. Personally I think 25 weeks legal or up until the point that it is recognisably human until 25 weeks.

 

[Gipper]

I'm pro-choice and I'd call it pro-life, as I don't consider an embryo to be a human being. A fetus, however, I do.

 

[OscarB63]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

I'm pro-life and I think that most people who are pro-life would call this pro-choice. I also think that most people who are pro-choice would consider the position to be pro-life.

 

[sangha]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

I would call them a confused Moral Fascist

 

[jamesrage]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

The definition of pro-life is opposition to legalized abortion.So that person is pro-choice.Now that person may not be as rabid abortionist as say someone who thinks abortion should be legal all the way until the baby pops out, but that person is still pro-choice
Pro-life | Define Pro-life at Dictionary.com
opposed to legalized abortion; right-to-life.

Pro-choice | Define Pro-choice at Dictionary.com
supporting or advocating legalized abortion

 

[Ontologuy]

The position appears to be a compromise between pro-choice and pro-life, likely stemming from a capitulation by pro-choice into dropping the more hard-line pro-choice stance of total adherence to Roe and Webster.

Thus it is neither pro-choice or pro-life, but merely movement between the two.

 

[Jerry]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

That's pro-choice.

 

[Zyphlin]

The definition of pro-life is opposition to legalized abortion.

So just so I understand you...you consider anyone who doesn't believe in complete illegalization of abortion to be pro-choice? So someone who believes it's okay only in cases of the mother's life is in danger, and that's it, would be "pro-choice" because they're open to legalized abortions in a specific fashion?

 

[molten_dragon]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

I'm pro-choice, and would also call that position pro-choice. It matches my own position fairly closely, though I'd push the window out to 20 weeks, and I'd add an exception after that if it was found that the fetus wasn't viable.

 

[Jerry]

So just so I understand you...you consider anyone who doesn't believe in complete illegalization of abortion to be pro-choice? So someone who believes it's okay only in cases of the mother's life is in danger, and that's it, would be "pro-choice" because they're open to legalized abortions in a specific fashion?

Yes. If you would allow an elective choice in any situation, you are pro-choice. Pro-life means it's only acceptable to kill the ZEF when it would be acceptable to kill a born person. You can't kill a 10 year old because they were conceived through rape, or are a hindrance to your career, or it's hard to pay their bills, so the pro-life view is you cannot abort for those reasons either.

 

[sangha]

Yes. If you would allow an elective choice in any situation, you are pro-choice. Pro-life means it's only acceptable to kill the ZEF when it would be acceptable to kill a born person. You can't kill a 10 year old because they were conceived through rape, or are a hindrance to your career, or it's hard to pay their bills, so the pro-life view is you cannot abort for those reasons either.

I have to admit that is logically consistent. More consistent than thinking the first trimester should be the dividing line.

 

[jamesrage]

So just so I understand you...you consider anyone who doesn't believe in complete illegalization of abortion to be pro-choice? So someone who believes it's okay only in cases of the mother's life is in danger, and that's it, would be "pro-choice" because they're open to legalized abortions in a specific fashion?

I would argue that anyone who supports legalized on-demand-abortion is pro-choice,because most people who are pro-life oppose on-demand-abortion . So I wouldn't consider favoring abortion only to save the mother's life to be pro-choice assuming doctors have verified that carrying the child to 50% viabilty and that a vaginal or c-section birth will cost the mother her life.

 

[Redress]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

I would call that person "me". It would generally fall under "pro-choice" since abortion on demand in the first trimester is generally close to the definition of "pro-choice".

And don't get me started on my hatred of the labels "pro-choice" and "pro-life"....

 

[Redress]

The definition of pro-life is opposition to legalized abortion.So that person is pro-choice.Now that person may not be as rabid abortionist as say someone who thinks abortion should be legal all the way until the baby pops out, but that person is still pro-choice
Pro-life | Define Pro-life at Dictionary.com
opposed to legalized abortion; right-to-life.

Pro-choice | Define Pro-choice at Dictionary.com
supporting or advocating legalized abortion

Just to be clear, the definition of "pro-choice" is not "the opposite of pro-life".

 

[jamesrage]

Just to be clear, the definition of "pro-choice" is not "the opposite of pro-life".

Pro-choice favors legalized on demand abortion.Pro-life side opposes legalized on-demand-abortion.So pro-choice is the opposite of pro-life.

 

[Redress]

Pro-choice favors legalized on demand abortion.Pro-life side opposes legalized on-demand-abortion.So pro-choice is the opposite of pro-life.

Which has nothing to do with what I said. You said that since "pro-life" opposed abortion on demand, this made it "pro-choice". Pro-choice is not defined by pro-life.

 

[Jerry]

Which has nothing to do with what I said. You said that since "pro-life" opposed abortion on demand, this made it "pro-choice". Pro-choice is not defined by pro-life.

We know. No one said pro-choice was defined by pro-life.

 

[Zyphlin]

I think the confusion comes into play in that James quoted the definitions, but then has been arguing something else.

The definitions he quoted put the deliniating line at whether or not someone agrees with legalized abortion.

His PERSONAL definition seems to change that to whether or not someone believes in "Abortion on demand" (which, he can correct me if I'm wrong, he seems to be defining as "any point in which abortoin can be undergone for any reason) or not is what differentiates the two. So pro-choice would be anyone who believes in "abortion on demand" in any fashion and pro-life would be anyone who believes in "no abortion on demand" in any fashion.

I think a bit of confusion came into play because he chose to quote dictionary definitions that don't fit his own definition

 

[DiAnna]

It is clearly a pro-choice position, although I voted that I was unsure because the position allows such an unacceptably (to me) short timeframe, after which the woman's choice is definitely removed.

 

[Phys251]

First of all, I hate the term "pro-life." I'm consider myself to be "pro-life," because I favor affordable neonatal health care, paid maternity leave, Head Start, affordable health care for impoverished children, and all sorts of other things that increase the probability of survival AFTER birth. And oh yeah, I'm staunchly pro-choice. I see zero conflict there--none.

Second, that is an EXCELLENT op. Of all the major social issues out there, abortion probably has the most diversity in terms of positions. What should a woman's rights be prior to conception? Prior to 12 weeks? Prior to 21? Prior to birth? And what exceptions to those rules would there be? Though labels can be useful, if ill-defined, they can pigeonhole people into the wrong category.

 

[Jerry]

First of all, I hate the term "pro-life." I'm consider myself to be "pro-life," because I favor affordable neonatal health care, paid maternity leave, Head Start, affordable health care for impoverished children, and all sorts of other things that increase the probability of survival AFTER birth. And oh yeah, I'm staunchly pro-choice. I see zero conflict there--none.

The terms "pro life" and "pro choice" only discribe a general position on abortion and do not discribe a position on any other issue.

 

[Superfly]

I'm pro-life and said that I felt it would be pro-choice. I can appreciate the arguments of others, but I'm of the belief that life begins at conception, so any removal of the baby/fetus/zygote/whatever makes you feel better calling it, is abortion, in my opinion.

 

[SmokeAndMirrors]

Say you have an individual who holds the following view.

During the first trimester, abortion should be legal for any reason. However, after the first trimester it will be illegal save for instances where the woman's physical health is severely in danger OR in the case of rape and incest where an investigation provides reason to believe they were prevented from seeking the abortion earlier by the perpetrator (which essentially would require the occurence to be reported to the police or child services, and thus verifiable).

Would you refer to this person "Pro-Life" or "Pro-Choice?

I would consider them a mild pro-choicer, who is a bit naive about the reality of the speed at which are legal system works.

However, I would also say they don't have a true appreciation or sense of compassion for the heart of the issue, due to the fact that the particulars of the stance rely on judging and possibly even blaming the woman for being victimized and the trauma that can cause.

But to my mind, someone who's anti-abortion thinks elective abortion should be illegal, period.