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What is a woman? What is a man?

Title IX of the United States Code applies to "sex" not gender, so college sports (in federally funded institutions) create women's NCAA and other college athletics programs to allow women (females) ostensibly equal opportunity in athletics. Doesn't say "gender." That's one.

With regard to private athletics organizations - leagues that are created by private individuals - say, the NFL, or the NHL, there is no law that says they have to be divided based on sex, and women are technically allowed to try out for and play for any pro team that will have them. There is a reason why women (meaning their sex - female) don't play in professional men's (meaning their sex) sports leagues - mainly the reason is that that in 99.99%+ of the cases, females cannot effectively compete physiologically in those leagues. So, that's the reason why sex is in fact a determining factor. Women can try out for the NBA, but men aren't allowed to try out for the WNBA. It's because of the advantage of their sex, not gender identity.

The existence of biological sex, moreover, is not an issue of law or legislation. It's an issue of biological science and genetics. There is no getting around that humans are animals, we are mammals, and we are primates. We have two sexes, like all other primates. And, those sexes have differences.
Title 9 was written years ago, in the same manner that the ERA mentioned only women. Since women are not mentioned in the body of the Constitution does it not apply to them?
 
What's the definition, or what are the definitions, if there are multiple usages.

To me, I define a woman as an adult human female, and a man as an an adult human male.

Female as denoting the sex that can bear offspring or produce eggs, distinguished biologically by the production of gametes (ova) which can be fertilized by male gametes. I define male as denoting the sex that produces small, typically motile gametes, especially spermatozoa, with which a female may be fertilized or inseminated to produce offspring.

These definitions do not require that a primate be fertile in order to be considered male or female. In primates as in other mammals, the sex is determined chromosomally, so an infertile female is still female, etc. But an analysis of chromosomes.

Humans have a lot of different ways of thinking about things, and complex emotional and psychiatric thoughts and feelings. So, it is certainly possible that a person will "identify" as something other than their sex, and therefore they might call themselves a woman or a man, when their sex is not female or male, etc. However, that doesn't change their sex. The person would still be a sexually a woman or a man, without reference to gender identity.
Women have an inner muscular strength that is designed to carry a growing baby for nine months and then labor intently and internally to push that baby out and deliver it when the time arrives and nourish that baby. The man was designed with an external strength to fend off danger and protect the woman and child. He works hard physically to build a life for his family ---- no matter the cost to himself. The man will stand against the terrors of night depending on none beside himself except for GOD's leading.

Mentally the woman keeps the man focused and organized. The man seeks to make life easier for the woman. The woman nurtures and cares for her children. The man strives to build independence in his children. All of this is somewhat over simplified. Yet, I've noted that as children, we tend to play our parents one against the other to get what we desire. So, it's logical that there are seemingly consistent expectations. The man tends not to wear his feelings on his sleeve, while the woman can become very emotional outwardly. Yet The man can blow off steam and get very upset because he keeps his emotions bottled up inside.
Men want things fixed NOW! Women are willing to work things out in a timely manner.
 
Title 9 was written years ago, in the same manner that the ERA mentioned only women. Since women are not mentioned in the body of the Constitution does it not apply to them?
Title IX isn't all that old, and the idea of "gender identity" and "gender expression" is an even newer concept. When I was a kid, around the time title 9 came into existence, the notion that one could properly use the word "gender" in relation to humans was very much frowned upon, grammatically. I had teachers who made that correction, that language has genders, not people.. Not that long ago, these concepts would have easily been dismissed as absurd.

Title IX refers to sex, and you asked for a law, and I gave it to you. It does not apply to gender, and by your own theories sex =/= gender. You can't have it both ways. Either sex does equal gender, or it doesn't equal gender. If it doesn't, then it is not "erasing" anyone, and it's not hate speech or a phobia, to say that a man gender identifies as a woman, but is still a man in terms of biological sex. The law created the women's - biological women's - sports in colleges and universities to try to afford biological women equal opportunity. It never had anything to do with men who identify as or express as women.

Oh, does the constitution apply to women? Of course, the constitution applies to women even though the word words women and woman are not mentioned in the Constitution. The words "man" and "men" are also not mentioned in the constitution. Not once. The word "person" is mentioned 51 times, and the word "people" is mentioned 10 times. So, yeah, women and men both being persons and people, the Constitution does apply to them. https://constitutioncenter.org/interactive-constitution/full-text Anything else?
 
Title IX isn't all that old, and the idea of "gender identity" and "gender expression" is an even newer concept. When I was a kid, around the time title 9 came into existence, the notion that one could properly use the word "gender" in relation to humans was very much frowned upon, grammatically. I had teachers who made that correction, that language has genders, not people.. Not that long ago, these concepts would have easily been dismissed as absurd.

Title IX refers to sex, and you asked for a law, and I gave it to you. It does not apply to gender, and by your own theories sex =/= gender. You can't have it both ways. Either sex does equal gender, or it doesn't equal gender. If it doesn't, then it is not "erasing" anyone, and it's not hate speech or a phobia, to say that a man gender identifies as a woman, but is still a man in terms of biological sex. The law created the women's - biological women's - sports in colleges and universities to try to afford biological women equal opportunity. It never had anything to do with men who identify as or express as women.

Oh, does the constitution apply to women? Of course, the constitution applies to women even though the word words women and woman are not mentioned in the Constitution. The words "man" and "men" are also not mentioned in the constitution. Not once. The word "person" is mentioned 51 times, and the word "people" is mentioned 10 times. So, yeah, women and men both being persons and people, the Constitution does apply to them. https://constitutioncenter.org/interactive-constitution/full-text Anything else?
Specific wording in laws does not necessarily mean what you interpret it to mean. Man can also refer to women, the interpretation of the law is the responsibility of the Article 3 branch.
 
Specific wording in laws does not necessarily mean what you interpret it to mean. Man can also refer to women, the interpretation of the law is the responsibility of the Article 3 branch.
Nobody has suggested Title IX applies to men. It was specifically written to address the fact that women's sports was virtually non-existent, and there was a metric ton of funding for men's sports, and next to nothing for women's sports. So to create opportunities for women, Title IX was passed.
 
Define the terms “sex” and “gender” however you like, but there are limits when you want to apply either science or rational thought to those definitions.
 
Define the terms “sex” and “gender” however you like, but there are limits when you want to apply either science or rational thought to those definitions.
The thrust of the trans lobby argument is that "there is no such thing as biological sex" and it's all a gender identity spectrum.

No such thing as biological sex is the tip of the trans-lobby spear. and https://bariweiss.substack.com/p/med-schools-are-now-denying-biological?s=r and

The definition of sex is "it doesn't exist - it's a myth." The definition of gender identity is "whatever a person says they identify as." That's what they want.

And, they will say at the same time that all gender is a social construct, and things that we associate with women (like dresses, dolls, pink, etc.) are not really women things, they're just socially adapted items that our culture assigns to women. Yet, they want to reinforce that "social construct" by having schools and doctors encourage and facilitate physical hormone treatments and surgery on kids because they wear dresses, like pink, and have tea parties instead of playing football.
 
The thrust of the trans lobby argument is that "there is no such thing as biological sex" and it's all a gender identity spectrum.

No such thing as biological sex is the tip of the trans-lobby spear. and https://bariweiss.substack.com/p/med-schools-are-now-denying-biological?s=r and

The definition of sex is "it doesn't exist - it's a myth." The definition of gender identity is "whatever a person says they identify as." That's what they want.

And, they will say at the same time that all gender is a social construct, and things that we associate with women (like dresses, dolls, pink, etc.) are not really women things, they're just socially adapted items that our culture assigns to women. Yet, they want to reinforce that "social construct" by having schools and doctors encourage and facilitate physical hormone treatments and surgery on kids because they wear dresses, like pink, and have tea parties instead of playing football.

Biological sex is a basic, scientific fact. Far more fluid societal gender behavioral norms are equally as real. Find someone who challenges either of those assertions and you’ve found someone who is, um, challenged.
 
Biological sex is a basic, scientific fact. Far more fluid societal gender behavioral norms are equally as real. Find someone who challenges either of those assertions and you’ve found someone who is, um, challenged.
I just found that college professor who challenges the idea that biological sex is a basic, biological fact. He states what is taught in University gender studies courses - biological sex doesn't exist.
 
I just found that college professor who challenges the idea that biological sex is a basic, biological fact. He states what is taught in University gender studies courses - biological sex doesn't exist.
What does finding a college professor prove?
 
What does finding a college professor prove?
You said - "Find someone who challenges either of those assertions and you’ve found someone who is, um, challenged" - and so, I found someone who challenges both of those assertions. And, he's a sitting professor at a major north American university being interviewed for exactly this topic on a major north American program.

Here's another interesting article from Harvard University. https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2021/8/11/biology-lecturer-gender-comments-backlash/ "Human Evolutionary Biology lecturer Carole K. Hooven’s comments on a Fox News show last month maintaining the existence of two sexes and defending the usage of the terms “male” and “female” to refer to biological sex in medical classes sparked backlash..." LOL - really? maintaining THE EXISTENCE OF TWO SEXES and defending the usage of the terms "male" and "female" is "sparking backlash" at Harvard University.

Think about that.

And this gem from Scientific American - "Nearly everyone in middle school biology learned that if you’ve got XX chromosomes, you’re a female; if you’ve got XY, you’re a male. This tired simplification is great for teaching the importance of chromosomes but betrays the true nature of biological sex. The popular belief that your sex arises only from your chromosomal makeup is wrong. The truth is, your biological sex isn’t carved in stone, but a living system with the potential for change." -- The science of DNA denoting that XY chromosomes make a male, and XX make a female is a "tired simplification" and "biological sex isn't carved in stone, but a living system with the potential for change." The writer thinks that a primate's sex will sometimes change on its own, lol. This writer apparently thinks there is a "potential" for a primate to just change sexes. However, the article never discusses the "change" referred to in paragraph one. The article simply discusses how intersex conditions can sometimes arise due to genetic malformations.

It's like saying that it's a myth that humans have one head, two legs and one stomach, but then the the "CT" lobby (Conjoined Twin lobby) try to convince everyone that the idea that primates have one head is a myth and a "tired simplification" because sometimes there are conjoined twins born.
 
You said - "Find someone who challenges either of those assertions and you’ve found someone who is, um, challenged" - and so, I found someone who challenges both of those assertions. And, he's a sitting professor at a major north American university being interviewed for exactly this topic on a major north American program.

Here's another interesting article from Harvard University. https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2021/8/11/biology-lecturer-gender-comments-backlash/ "Human Evolutionary Biology lecturer Carole K. Hooven’s comments on a Fox News show last month maintaining the existence of two sexes and defending the usage of the terms “male” and “female” to refer to biological sex in medical classes sparked backlash..." LOL - really? maintaining THE EXISTENCE OF TWO SEXES and defending the usage of the terms "male" and "female" is "sparking backlash" at Harvard University.

Think about that.

And this gem from Scientific American - "Nearly everyone in middle school biology learned that if you’ve got XX chromosomes, you’re a female; if you’ve got XY, you’re a male. This tired simplification is great for teaching the importance of chromosomes but betrays the true nature of biological sex. The popular belief that your sex arises only from your chromosomal makeup is wrong. The truth is, your biological sex isn’t carved in stone, but a living system with the potential for change." -- The science of DNA denoting that XY chromosomes make a male, and XX make a female is a "tired simplification" and "biological sex isn't carved in stone, but a living system with the potential for change." The writer thinks that a primate's sex will sometimes change on its own, lol. This writer apparently thinks there is a "potential" for a primate to just change sexes. However, the article never discusses the "change" referred to in paragraph one. The article simply discusses how intersex conditions can sometimes arise due to genetic malformations.

It's like saying that it's a myth that humans have one head, two legs and one stomach, but then the the "CT" lobby (Conjoined Twin lobby) try to convince everyone that the idea that primates have one head is a myth and a "tired simplification" because sometimes there are conjoined twins born.
What, you don’t think a college professor can be an idiot?
 
What, you don’t think a college professor can be an idiot?
They can be, and the problem is that there is a shit-ton of these idiots and they are now controlling the "narrative" and they are pushing this bullshit. This is not just one idiot who everybody ignores. The people who say things like "primates have two sexes" are the ones receiving "backlash" from universities and in the media. We're almost living in bizarro world.
 
Sex and gender identity are not inextricable.

There are two sexes. Male and female. If you possess a Y chromosome, you are a male. If you don't you are female. The are multiple gender identities, such as girl, boy, man, woman, transgirl, transboy, transman, transwoman, etc. We usually pair feminine genders with the female sex and masculine genders with the male sex. This is not, however, required, and some women were born with a Y chromosome, and some men were born with no Y chromosome. We have specific labels for these people whose gender doesn't match that traditionally associated with their sex such as transgender and intersex, but that doesn't mean they aren't the gender they live as.

Sex cannot be changed. Gender can be, and occasionally it is. And rarely, gender simply doesn't match sex all the way from birth.
So just to be clear, even this (bolded) doesn't really work for sex. A person can possess a Y chromosome and still be female, even have children. Our genetic sex cannot be changed, not really (as we know yet), but then it also can't be considered as easy as "either you have a Y chromosome and are male or don't have one and are female". Some people do have multiple sets of DNA in their body, which means they do not fall into these binary categories.
 
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This thread is about what is a man and what is a woman. I gave my definition. Do you have one that is different?

That's not a simplistic view. That's reality. People born with deformities like male and female genital forms are intersex. That's a very rare condition, and it doesn't change the fact that there are men and there are women. Those with intersex conditions are called intersex, hermaphrodites, or that they have ovotesticular syndrome.

Why does it matter? For a lot of reasons, not the least of which is eligibility to participate in women's sports, eligibility for women's scholarships, and other such sex-based issues.

I don't think it "doesn't except for shitty humans." It matters to my daughters who will be competing in sports, hoping for awards, scholarships, and opportunities in women's sports. It seems to me pretty shitty to have Lia Thomas transition and compete against my daughters. Isn't that shitty?

The brain is complex, but stop conflating gender identity with sex. The trans folks always remind us not to do that, but then they proceed immediately, as you did, to conflate gender identity and sex. A person can identify as female, while being of the male sex. Those are two different things. The notion that only the gender identification matters, and not the biological sex is simply counterfactual and contrary to reality.
Intersexed people make up about 1% of society. Being transgender is half that at best count. Intersexed is less rare than transgender.
 
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Biological sex is the only physical reality. Gender identity is pseudoscientific nonsense based on one's subjective experience...it's basically the equivalent of thinking you talked to Jesus but having no physical evidence of this. It's fine if people want to believe that. You do you, and live your best life however you want to. Just don't force the rest of society to pretend your subjective experience has any connection to reality.

A man is a person having a Y chromosome, having a penis, and of the sex that does not bear children. A woman is a person lacking a Y chromosome, having a vagina, and of the sex that bears children. In the rare cases that a person has some but not all of these things (i.e. intersex people) it gets trickier, but it would still be based on the physical realities of their body and not the subjective genderfeelz of their soul.
 
Biological sex is the only physical reality. Gender identity is pseudoscientific nonsense based on one's subjective experience...it's basically the equivalent of thinking you talked to Jesus but having no physical evidence of this. It's fine if people want to believe that. You do you, and live your best life however you want to. Just don't force the rest of society to pretend your subjective experience has any connection to reality.

A man is a person having a Y chromosome, having a penis, and of the sex that does not bear children. A woman is a person lacking a Y chromosome, having a vagina, and of the sex that bears children. In the rare cases that a person has some but not all of these things (i.e. intersex people) it gets trickier, but it would still be based on the physical realities of their body and not the subjective genderfeelz of their soul.
You just cannot stop with your transphobic nonsense. trans people are not delusional because of their gender incongruence, despite what you want to believe.


What are you being forced to do and what are the supposed penalties of you resist the trans trans social movement that you claim exists? Is that resistance a felony or misdemeanor? How many people are in prison for their trans resistance?
 
You just cannot stop with your transphobic nonsense. trans people are not delusional because of their gender incongruence, despite what you want to believe.
Their condition is comparable to anorexics who see themselves subjectively as fat slobs, despite objectively being dangerously underweight. Body dysmorphia and self-harm are very sad conditions.
What are you being forced to do
I have no problem with trans people exercising the same individual rights as everyone else: The right to marry who they want, alter their body if they are adults, serve in the military, be protected from discrimination/harassment in the workplace, etc. The thing about all these individual rights is that no one else has to do anything beyond leave them alone. They should be able to do any of those things, and it doesn't matter whether their adopted gender is "real" or not, since no one else needs to validate them.

But when people demand that women's sports be open to men, when people demand that male rapists of women be housed in female prisons, or when people tell others "their pronouns" in the first two seconds of their acquaintance...these things *do* make demands of society. And society can and absolutely should push back. Because these things, unlike the individual rights in the previous paragraph, demand that the rest of us participate in this charade.
 
Their condition is comparable to anorexics who see themselves subjectively as fat slobs, despite objectively being dangerously underweight. Body dysmorphia and self-harm are very sad conditions.

I have no problem with trans people exercising the same individual rights as everyone else: The right to marry who they want, alter their body if they are adults, serve in the military, be protected from discrimination/harassment in the workplace, etc. The thing about all these individual rights is that no one else has to do anything beyond leave them alone. They should be able to do any of those things, and it doesn't matter whether their adopted gender is "real" or not, since no one else needs to validate them.

But when people demand that women's sports be open to men, when people demand that male rapists of women be housed in female prisons, or when people tell others "their pronouns" in the first two seconds of their acquaintance...these things *do* make demands of society. And society can and absolutely should push back. Because these things, unlike the individual rights in the previous paragraph, demand that the rest of us participate in this charade.

Oh no, someone asked me to get their pronouns correct! Hurry, call the ACLU! :LOL:
 
Oh no, someone asked me to get their pronouns correct! Hurry, call the ACLU! :LOL:
Don't worry, the ACLU has been overtaken by illiberal thugs like Chase Strangio who agree with you. It no longer has any connection to fighting for civil liberties. I'd look to groups like FIRE instead. 🔥
 
Don't worry, the ACLU has been overtaken by illiberal thugs like Chase Strangio who agree with you. It no longer has any connection to fighting for civil liberties. I'd look to groups like FIRE instead. 🔥

It's OK, Gatsby. I never mistook you as supporting the ACLU. :coffee:
 
Once upon a time. But certainly not in its current incarnation.

That sounds like something a righty would say. "I'll support rights, but not for those people." :rolleyes:
 
That sounds like something a righty would say.
I told you a couple days ago, I am entirely uninterested in your unintelligent partisan pissing contests. You midwits can go back and forth owning the libs/cons like it's a team sport, but I won't be playing or even spectating.
"I'll support rights, but not for those people." :rolleyes:
You don't have a right to someone else calling you by a certain pronoun.
 
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