What happen when the good guy has a guy?

[Μολὼν λαβέ]

"The Daily Show" as a source??? Seriously???

Well lets look at what we just saw here: The Daily Show takes ONE incident and tries to project it over a wide array of situations. It also ignores the vast number of positive outcomes of a "a good guy with a gun". What this article is doing is demanding perfection and if we can't have have perfection, then throw it all out. It's a growing attitude among people in America and especially those on the left.

What do you expect from a poster with the word "troll" in his screen name?

 

[flogger]

How do these numbers support your assertion that defensive gun use occurs rarely?

Because I can read ?

 

[flogger]

There is no tool that levels the playing field as much as a gun. It allows a 100lb woman to defend herself effectively against an size attacker. I don't want to kill, but if I have to, I will. You seem to want to push some mindset at me that just isn't true.

The problem you have there is the attacker will have his gun out first and it is far more likely that this attacker will have one in the US

As I said you picked JUST gun violence. As predicted.

This is the gun forum and as has been illustrated defensive gun use represents a tiny fraction of your gun deaths/injuries

US incarceration statistics are more due to drug violations than gun violations. Thanks for not looking at data properly.

It was the relative gun deaths statistic that was the one you chose to miss :roll:

 

[flogger]

Nice deflection on your own governments limitation on free speech.

What is it you think I'm not allowed to say I wonder ?

Your fearful, and paranoid obsession about gun owners is just another example of how the UK has neutered it's male population

Yeah 'real' men want to have the ability to point guns at people right ? :roll:

 

[blackjack50]

The problem you have there is the attacker will have his gun out first and it is far more likely that this attacker will have one in the US



This is the gun forum and as has been illustrated defensive gun use represents a tiny fraction of your gun deaths/injuries



It was the relative gun deaths statistic that was the one you chose to miss :roll:

Why not require criminals to turn in guns and get them registered?

 

[LaMidRighter]

My understanding is that Idaho won't be Constitutional until 1 July and then it will be resident only. West Virginia just overturned a veto and went Constitutional this past Tuesday.

Vermont has been a Constitutional Carry state all along. Alaska went that route in 2003 and AZ followed in 2010. Maine went Constitutional last year. Kansas, Idaho, Mississippi and Wyoming are almost there or allow the practice for residents. Puerto Rico is the one that surprised me as being Constitutional Carry but, according to Wikipedia, they're still enforcing prior restrictions until some court stuff gets done.

We are trying but still have some holdouts in the legislature. Hopefully their voters start throwing them on their asses in the following years to come.

 

[LaMidRighter]

Yes you guys all seem to have a personal story of gun heroism that justifies your obsessions. Sorry but I don't really believe that any such incident ever took place. :roll:

I've had three and I am in a safe city, never had to fire a round and no report.

 

[BretJ]

Because I can read ?

Which link discussed defensive use of a firearm in which a shot was never fired or the bad guy survived?

 

[BretJ]

Why not require criminals to turn in guns and get them registered?

In the UK, they assume everyone is a potential criminal, hence their assine gun laws.

 

[AlbqOwl]

He'd probably pop a gasket if he knew that in AZ the only requirement for carrying a firearm is having one. You need a minimal amount of training to get a CCW but there is no requirement to have one.

Same in New Mexico. Open carry is legal for anybody of age and requires no instruction or license of any kind. Concealed carry does require confirmation that the person has not been involved in a felony or gun related crime, a training course for most citizens. Law enforcement and military personnel who have been out of service for less than 20 years have to meet all other requirements but are exempted from the training course.

But the last time I was on a jury, probably 150 or so of us were in the holding room when the defense attorney and prosecutor came out and asked for a show of hands of those with CCW permits. I was surprised at how many raised their hands--maybe a fourth or more of those present. And for whatever reason, it was those people who were chosen to be on the next jury. Nevertheless the stats suggest that a fairly low percentage of permits have been issued per capita. But gun crimes among permit holders is virtually non existent.

About that 'middle-eastern looking good guy' with a hand gun being more likely to be shot, I don't know that is true. But if it is, it is because all normal citizens know that not all, but most domestic mass murder is perpetrated by followers of Islam, and most of those are going to be middle-eastern looking guys. Fair or unfair, that is the reality we live with.

 

[OpportunityCost]

The problem you have there is the attacker will have his gun out first and it is far more likely that this attacker will have one in the US

There have been numerous cases where this occurs and it does not matter.

This is the gun forum and as has been illustrated defensive gun use represents a tiny fraction of your gun deaths/injuries

Which avoids the overall crime question. As predicted.

It was the relative gun deaths statistic that was the one you chose to miss :roll:

The incarceration rate is due to drugs, not guns.

The gun death statistic is always inflated by your craptastic sources that don't source out suicides and defensive uses and justified use. Once your failbucket tactics are seen once, they are easy to see beyond the great wizard of oz curtain, its all a smoke screen.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Who needs assumptions ? Your own FBI says only one in every 32 fatal shootings is of a defensive nature so I guess I must be a bit better informed than you about the 'real world' :wink:

the majority of shootings period are non-fatal, and you've been provided the numbers of defensive gun uses many times, you just simply choose not to believe anything that runs counter to your world view.

 

[TurtleDude]

Well it does make the point that your average US gun owner is nowhere near competent enough to deal with the situations they think they could and are most likely a liability to both themselves and those around them . The real world just isn't like TV

that's just plain dishonest. Your average US gun owner goes through life never harming anyone with firearms. So stop the lying.

 

[blackjack50]

Just did some reading and watching about guns from the Philippines. One more reason to keep armed here in the United States. The gang bangers are actually buying guns off of gun "farmers." Guys making guns out of scrap metal and shipping them stateside. these guns never enter law abiding citizen hands. Tell me again how registration will work for them?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[TurtleDude]

Just did some reading and watching about guns from the Philippines. One more reason to keep armed here in the United States. The gang bangers are actually buying guns off of gun "farmers." Guys making guns out of scrap metal and shipping them stateside. these guns never enter law abiding citizen hands. Tell me again how registration will work for them?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

3D printing technology is going to play merry hell with the Bannerrhoid's mind sets

 

[flogger]

There have been numerous cases where this occurs and it does not matter.

Only if you weren't the armed victim I suspect

Which avoids the overall crime question. As predicted.

No it was a simple statement of fact

The gun death statistic is always inflated by your craptastic sources that don't source out suicides and defensive uses and justified use. Once your failbucket tactics are seen once, they are easy to see beyond the great wizard of oz curtain, its all a smoke screen.

I have used multiple sources including your own FBI to make my case. The plain fact is theres nothing you will accept on this issue from any source should it contradict your view

 

[flogger]

the majority of shootings period are non-fatal, and you've been provided the numbers of defensive gun uses many times, you just simply choose not to believe anything that runs counter to your world view.

No I simply base my view on facts and basic arithmetic

 

[Goshin]

No I simply base my view on facts and basic arithmetic

You base your views on stats which support those views while ignoring contradictory evidence.... as most anti-gunners go.


Even a recent Obama-commissioned CDC study admitted there were more DGU's than criminal uses.

 

[TurtleDude]

Only if you weren't the armed victim I suspect



No it was a simple statement of fact



I have used multiple sources including your own FBI to make my case. The plain fact is theres nothing you will accept on this issue from any source should it contradict your view

you seem to not understand the argument. You pretend that the only thing that matters is "gun deaths" and other concepts including the rights of millions matters not

here's the deal you have been unable to fathom the four years you have been on this board whining about our rights

That being-THERE IS ONLY ONE quasi-legitimate argument for gun bans or gun restrictions.


ONLY ONE-that being such schemes substantively reduce gun violence

and there is NO PROOF OF THAT

there is no other possible argument to support your desired laws

WE on the other hand (we being pro freedom anti statists) have MANY arguments on our side that are NOT defeated even if you were to rationally prove your schemes would decrease crime

those include

Constitutional arguments

Philosophical arguments concerning freedom, rights and preventing the government from having a monopoly on legal firepower

So until you can present clear and convincing arguments based on the AMERICAN (not panty wetting effete euro socialist mindsets) experience, that your desired laws actually would do good here, you have NO ARGUMENT

 

[flogger]

you seem to not understand the argument. You pretend that the only thing that matters is "gun deaths" and other concepts including the rights of millions matters not

here's the deal you have been unable to fathom the four years you have been on this board whining about our rights

That being-THERE IS ONLY ONE quasi-legitimate argument for gun bans or gun restrictions.


ONLY ONE-that being such schemes substantively reduce gun violence

and there is NO PROOF OF THAT

there is no other possible argument to support your desired laws

WE on the other hand (we being pro freedom anti statists) have MANY arguments on our side that are NOT defeated even if you were to rationally prove your schemes would decrease crime

those include

Constitutional arguments

Philosophical arguments concerning freedom, rights and preventing the government from having a monopoly on legal firepower

So until you can present clear and convincing arguments based on the AMERICAN (not panty wetting effete euro socialist mindsets) experience, that your desired laws actually would do good here, you have NO ARGUMENT

This from the guy who publicly stated here he didn't care if 10 psychos had guns as long as one citzen was not disarmed and that having guns made you more heroic . I think that pretty much deals with that rant :roll:

 

[flogger]

You base your views on stats which support those views while ignoring contradictory evidence.... as most anti-gunners go.

They are not stats they are facts. If they are not then feel free to illustrate any falsehoods

 

[OpportunityCost]

Only if you weren't the armed victim I suspect

There have been numerous incidents in which the victim accesses their weapon in which the criminals cannot get away fast enough.

No it was a simple statement of fact

Still avoiding the question.

I have used multiple sources including your own FBI to make my case. The plain fact is theres nothing you will accept on this issue from any source should it contradict your view

Sure but you lump them all together as gun violence without examining them on a case by case basis. You have been caught doing this enough times that you don't have credibility in your presentation of sources or facts. You could change my mind if you gave truthful presentations.

 

[Goshin]

They are not stats they are facts. If they are not then feel free to illustrate any falsehoods

Many studies have been posted indicating that your views on DGU's are likely very wrong. You have ignored those studies in favor of those that support your views. I see no reason to do it all over again.

 

[blackjack50]

3D printing technology is going to play merry hell with the Bannerrhoid's mind sets

Very true. Not like it is that hard to make a zip gun or a popper. 3D printing pretty much the same thing. Hell... Destructive devices and general or not that complicated to make. All it requires is a depraved mind which obviously we don't have a lot of. We just have enough to make it a problem

 

[blackjack50]

They are not stats they are facts. If they are not then feel free to illustrate any falsehoods

Statistics are facts. Improperly applying statistics to an opinion does not make that opinion a fact.