What global warming?

[theangryamerican]

Actually, I am going to add another point.

Technology-wise, we are so far behind, that it's impossible to live "normally" without having to use oil. It's part of our everyday life and unavoidable. We can take measures to cut down, and that is pretty much Al's message from what I gather. So until we as a society develop methods to live without oil (and oil derived products), the carbon credits are the best way to "nullify" usage. So basically, it's the best solution for our times. I certainly hope we can come up with better ways soon.

I made an effort to debunk this already, when Deuce was crying about us having to buy foreign alternative energy when our oil depletes.

The best ranked solar panels on the market today are American made.
SunPower Tops List of Best Solar Panel Manufacturers · Environmental Leader · Green Business, Sustainable Business, and Green Strategy News for Corporate Sustainability Executives

There's already more than 16000 manufacturers of industrial wind turbines in the United States.
Large Wind Turbine Manufacturers in the United States

The 2010 Ford Fusion Hybrid is the 2010 North American Car of the Year.
Best Hybrid Cars - Best Cars & Trucks - U.S. News Rankings and Reviews

Free market is doing just fine without cap and trade, contrary to what the government wants you to believe.

 

[Deuce]

I made an effort to debunk this already, when Deuce was crying about us having to buy foreign alternative energy when our oil depletes.

Anecdotes are fun.
Toyota sells several times as many hybrids as Ford.
Germany produces triple the wind power that we do (as percentage of total power generation)
China produces nearly half of the world's solar panels and exports 99% of what they build.

Europe/China/India/Japan/Australia all have a stronger financial incentive towards renewables and fundamental change in energy production than we do. I don't think whatever edge we currently have is going to hold out for very long.

 

[theangryamerican]

Anecdotes are fun.
Toyota sells several times as many hybrids as Ford.
Germany produces triple the wind power that we do (as percentage of total power generation)
China produces nearly half of the world's solar panels and exports 99% of what they build.

Europe/China/India/Japan/Australia all have a stronger financial incentive towards renewables and fundamental change in energy production than we do. I don't think whatever edge we currently have is going to hold out for very long.

Do you see the irony of accusing me of anecdotes and then failing to cite any sources for your rhetoric. Why would we stop using an already cheap energy source while it still exists?

Toyota sells more cars because American auto makers are still new to the game.

If Germany has a larger percentage of power generated by wind, it's because America is obviously not enthralled with the idea yet. The fact remains that we have plenty of companies able to meet that need should it arise in the future.

The same goes for China's manufacturing of solar panels. We also have a better, more efficient product. The export figure is a red herring because China is primarily an export economy. Name something they DON'T export.

 

[USA_1]

Anecdotes are fun.
Toyota sells several times as many hybrids as Ford.
.

Do you have the numbers to back that up? I really don't know and would like to see how they compare..

 

[Deuce]

Do you have the numbers to back that up? I really don't know and would like to see how they compare..

Ford Hybrid Sales Up 147% Over 2008 - Automoblog.net

Hybrid sales totaled 33,502 in 2009, which was a new record

Toyota Prius - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Toyota sold ten times that, actually, and that's just the Prius.

Bigger gap than I thought. That dang Prius! :2mad: