What does it mean to make a choice?

Continuing my theory that socialism is based on people misconceiving of making a choice in terms of figuring out the best option.

Conservatives generally believe in God the holy spirit, or at least the human spirit, making choices. So for conservatives the focus in a choice is on the subjective spirit that makes the choice. Any goodness is then in the person that makes the choice.

Socialists on the other hand, believe making a choice is about figuring out the best option. So then the focus is on the result of the choice, and not on who it is that makes the choice. The goodness is then in the best chosen option, and not in the person who makes the choice.

What?

Socialism is about the collective, the group.

Libertarianism is about the individual. Libertarians hate free health care, free education, public roads and fire stations. All the things that socialists love.

Capitalism is a fundamental force that is spontaneously created whenever two or more people want to barter.

One of the most capitalistic systems that ever existed was the black market in the Soviet Union.


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Syamsu said:

Continuing my theory that socialism is based on people misconceiving of making a choice in terms of figuring out the best option.

Conservatives generally believe in God the holy spirit, or at least the human spirit, making choices. So for conservatives the focus in a choice is on the subjective spirit that makes the choice. Any goodness is then in the person that makes the choice.

Socialists on the other hand, believe making a choice is about figuring out the best option. So then the focus is on the result of the choice, and not on who it is that makes the choice. The goodness is then in the best chosen option, and not in the person who makes the choice.

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As SW mentions, Collectivism and Conservatism are not opposites. The opposite of Collectivism is Individualism.
Conservatism can be both collectivist and individualistic, depending on circumstance. Sometimes it will sacrifice the rights of the individual for the good of the collective, and sometimes the rights of the collective for the good of the individual.

Syamsu said:

Continuing my theory that socialism is based on people misconceiving of making a choice in terms of figuring out the best option.

Conservatives generally believe in God the holy spirit, or at least the human spirit, making choices. So for conservatives the focus in a choice is on the subjective spirit that makes the choice. Any goodness is then in the person that makes the choice.

Socialists on the other hand, believe making a choice is about figuring out the best option. So then the focus is on the result of the choice, and not on who it is that makes the choice. The goodness is then in the best chosen option, and not in the person who makes the choice.

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Most interesting old 'chestnut' .

Belief based on God and/or Spirit is in itself not proof of "rightness".

Other than to the faithful .

Because however well intentioned and 'nice ' the faithful might be , that sort of reasoning is not logical / scientific , or , as the Logical Positivists pointed out , even meaningful --- there are no ways to verify such statements .

Monica33 said:

Because however well intentioned and 'nice ' the faithful might be , that sort of reasoning is not logical / scientific , or , as the Logical Positivists pointed out , even meaningful --- there are no ways to verify such statements .

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You're surely aware that Logical Positivism crashed and burned, no? Turns out, they were just wrong (as several prominent positivists themselves admitted toward the ends of their lives). One of the reasons they were wrong is that meaning doesn't really have much to do with verifiability. A statement like "exactly four inches of rain fell on Mount Evans on June 12th, 1788, between 11:03 am and 4:17 pm local time" can't be verified, but are still meaningful. On the other hand, if you take verifiability to just be "in principle," seems awfully...prejudiced to claim that religious language could not possibly be verified--there are obviously possible worlds in which religious claims could be verified.

That's not the only reason they failed--not by a mile. We still have to teach them as an important bit of philosophical/linguistic history, but no one takes positivist claims seriously these days. Positivism probably holds the record for the largest number of fatal problems inherent in its core concepts of any philosophical position.

Syamsu said:

Continuing my theory that socialism is based on people misconceiving of making a choice in terms of figuring out the best option.

Conservatives generally believe in God the holy spirit, or at least the human spirit, making choices. So for conservatives the focus in a choice is on the subjective spirit that makes the choice. Any goodness is then in the person that makes the choice.

Socialists on the other hand, believe making a choice is about figuring out the best option. So then the focus is on the result of the choice, and not on who it is that makes the choice. The goodness is then in the best chosen option, and not in the person who makes the choice.

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I'm struggling to understand why these two options are supposed to be mutually exclusive or opposites in any way. Look: suppose there is some kind of spirit inside us that makes a choice. OK--doesn't that spirit usually make its choice by figuring out the best option? Conversely, if someone is focused on choices as figuring out the best options, there doesn't seem to be any problem for such a person to also believe there is such a thing as a spirit making those choices.

Hard to see what the problem is supposed to be here.

Syamsu said:

Continuing my theory that socialism is based on people misconceiving of making a choice in terms of figuring out the best option.

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You don't seem to be making your (any) case though.

Syamsu said:

Conservatives generally believe in God the holy spirit, or at least the human spirit, making choices. So for conservatives the focus in a choice is on the subjective spirit that makes the choice. Any goodness is then in the person that makes the choice.

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Read: Rugged individualism hoisted by the collective ideals of religion/God.

Syamsu said:

Socialists on the other hand, believe making a choice is about figuring out the best option. So then the focus is on the result of the choice, and not on who it is that makes the choice. The goodness is then in the best chosen option, and not in the person who makes the choice.

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Read: Utilitarianism and Collectivism; hoisted by the ideals of Secular Humanism.

Okay....make your case.

Syamsu said:

Continuing my theory that socialism is based on people misconceiving of making a choice in terms of figuring out the best option.

Conservatives generally believe in God the holy spirit, or at least the human spirit, making choices. So for conservatives the focus in a choice is on the subjective spirit that makes the choice. Any goodness is then in the person that makes the choice.

Socialists on the other hand, believe making a choice is about figuring out the best option. So then the focus is on the result of the choice, and not on who it is that makes the choice. The goodness is then in the best chosen option, and not in the person who makes the choice.

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Making a choice = a discontinuity or non-linear response between inputs and outputs resulting in a catastrophic (see: catastrophe theory in applied mathematics) state change in the neural network that is the human brain.