• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

We Should Fight Climate Change

Moderate Right

DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 21, 2015
Messages
53,813
Reaction score
10,864
Location
Kentucky
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Conservative
by using carbon capture technologies. And, we shouldn't bankrupt our country in doing it and we shouldn't regulate current businesses out of business. For the most part, 90% of our efforts should be in removing carbon from the atmosphere. Of course, we should phase in cleaner energy while letting dirty energy phase out on it's own without purposely pushing it over the cliff. You can't stop humans from being born or decreasing the actual population so if we realistically want to win the war we have to win it by figuring out how to remove carbon from the atmosphere. I'm tired of hearing Greta tell us that the world is coming to an end and that it is our fault and that we all have to make sacrifices. We don't.
 
Last edited:

joko104

Banned
Suspended
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 21, 2009
Messages
65,981
Reaction score
23,408
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Humans can not stop the climate from changing or the sea level rising. Humans are less than 1/3rd of 1% of green house gases. Kill all humans on earth and it would change nothing.

Rather than trying to stop the endless evolution and cycles of earth, the only rational approach is to address the inevitable. We have decades to centuries for the most part.

12,000 years ago the sea level was 200 feet lower. 2000 years ago it was about 5-6 feet lower. 1000 years ago about 3 feet lower. 10 years ago an around an inch to an inch and a half. It is going to continue to rise as the last ice age ice continues to melt.
 

longview

DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 25, 2012
Messages
39,589
Reaction score
13,575
Location
Texas
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
by using carbon capture technologies. And, we shouldn't bankrupt our country in doing it and we shouldn't regulate current businesses out of business. For the most part, 90% of our efforts should be in removing carbon from the atmosphere. Of course, we should phase in cleaner energy while letting dirty energy phase out on it's own without purposely pushing it over the cliff. You can't stop humans from being born or decreasing the actual population so if we realistically want to win the war we have to win it by figuring out how to remove carbon from the atmosphere. I'm tired of hearing Greta tell us that it is our fault.
The people who push for us to stop using fossil fuels, do not understand that a replacement is necessary, before that can happen.
If one considers the all variables, and the state of technology, the only viable path to reduce CO2 emissions on any real scale,
would be to encourage a system where surplus solar and wind power, is used to create carbon neutral transport fuels.
By making, Gasoline, diesel, and jet fuel from Electricity and atmospheric CO2, we would accomplish two big steps.
One is to provide a storage mechanism for the vast amount of surplus electricity that will be generated as solar expands,
and the second step is to allow our transport with existing vehicles, but with net zero CO2 emissions.
This alone would reduce US emissions by about 1/3 or more.
The limitation is that to be economically viable, oil would need to be about $90 a barrel, which will happen,
but not fast enough.
 

Irredentist

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 22, 2019
Messages
6,721
Reaction score
3,521
Gender
Male
by using carbon capture technologies. And, we shouldn't bankrupt our country in doing it and we shouldn't regulate current businesses out of business. For the most part, 90% of our efforts should be in removing carbon from the atmosphere. Of course, we should phase in cleaner energy while letting dirty energy phase out on it's own without purposely pushing it over the cliff. You can't stop humans from being born or decreasing the actual population so if we realistically want to win the war we have to win it by figuring out how to remove carbon from the atmosphere. I'm tired of hearing Greta tell us that the world is coming to an end and that it is our fault and that we all have to make sacrifices. We don't.

You're missing an important part of this equation, which is reducing the energy consumption of individual Americans, by making our homes and workplaces more energy efficient. One way of doing this is by installing new appliances which consume less energy, which not only means less fuel being burned, but lower electricity bills as well.

Another method is to improve the insulation of the many aging homes in America. Poor insulation means more fuel being burned to keep the house warm, or cool, depending on the location. In addition, new homes and workplaces should incorporate design features with an eye toward reduced energy consumption.
 

joko104

Banned
Suspended
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 21, 2009
Messages
65,981
Reaction score
23,408
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
The native Americans in this area (Florida central Gulf Coast) figured out what most people are too stupid and refusing to think - letting the super rich do their thinking for them on TV - all for the profits of the super rich - to recognize the obvious. I know it by the same way they did.

We have huge amounts of land, which mostly is worthless for any development and we put deed restrictions on that land that it may NEVER be developed in exchange for tax exemption. It is mud flats, fields of saw grass, estuaries, some small shell islands (dumps of ancient native peoples) and woodland swamps. The difference from a swamp is the land it mostly a few inches to a foot or so above high tide. But tidal surges will take it a bit under water. Being drier, unlike swamps it has lots of plants, trees, palms etc - all nearly impassible.

On our land are hundreds, maybe thousands, of ancient native graves dating from 1000 to 2000 years old. They simply dug a hole, put the body in it, and they piled about 3 feet of rocks on it. No bodies remain due to the acidity of the ground (pine trees). These graves are all over the place. They go to the water's edge - but at low tide (about 2 1/2) they go further out, flooded by the rising water level of the Gulf.

Unlike most people today, they came to understand the level is going to continue to rise. So for later graves they not only moved further inland, but built up mounds - and then dug down from the top of the mound - making the graves more into mass graves and as much as 20 to 30 feet above sea level. They knew it was inevitable it would continue to rise generation to generation - something most people now are too stupid to understand because they are dedicated to not thinking. They let TV do their thinking. They let the owners of TV, super rich corporations and people - do their thinking and make their decisions for them like they are little children.

Those who claim humans can stop the last ice of the last ice age from melt are idiots.

Those who deny the sea level is going to rise also are idiots.

Both are completely non-thinking people. The watch their favorite propaganda outlets of the super rich that do their thinking for them. Those outlets pay so-called scientists to say whatever they are paid to say - or they can instead go try to get food stamps and welfare.

FACT: The sea levels will slowing continue to rise. If NATURE does not start a mini or full ice age (hope not for the latter), the remaining ice age ice in the Northern and Southern parts of the world ultimate will all melt - all of it. Sea levels could ultimately rise as much as 200 feet - over the next few thousands years. Can't stop it. All that can be done is dealing with it applicable to each area across the coming thousands of years - starting now for places at risk from a few inches rise:

Dikes?
More drainage - using the dug out land to make higher land (done all over Florida massively already)
Banning coastal construction and no-build zones
Ultimately abandoning and relocating cities and populations
Figure how to benefit from the pluses of rising seas and temperatures, not just the negatives.

Simply, do NOT listen to the mega billionaires and politicians demanding trillions and trillions of dollars from you -promising they can stop evolution and make it so the temperature and sea level will never, ever, ever change 1 degree or 1 inch again. They are relying upon you being non-thinking idiots having them do all your thinking for you - meaning having you exist to serve them.

Very primitive people of no technology and little understanding of any science thousands of years ago were vastly smarter than most of you even with college degrees - because they were thinking people and most of you are not. Talking head employees and whore-scientists do your thinking. Then, most of you come on this forum thinking you are enlightened by posting low quality recitals of what those who do your thinking for you said.
 

joko104

Banned
Suspended
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 21, 2009
Messages
65,981
Reaction score
23,408
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
You're missing an important part of this equation, which is reducing the energy consumption of individual Americans, by making our homes and workplaces more energy efficient. One way of doing this is by installing new appliances which consume less energy, which not only means less fuel being burned, but lower electricity bills as well.

Another method is to improve the insulation of the many aging homes in America. Poor insulation means more fuel being burned to keep the house warm, or cool, depending on the location. In addition, new homes and workplaces should incorporate design features with an eye toward reduced energy consumption.

That's what the rich propagandist employees of the super rich on TV tell you. They solution is to give them trillions in the religion of consumerism. That the solution is for each of you to give them tens of thousands of dollars - at least. Then they will do more strip mining, use massive amounts of energy and distribute that around the world (of course saying that does not consume any energy or any environmental harm), and put their non-white slave labor foreign factories to give you a 27% more efficient A/C-heating system.

That is the solution to everything on TV according to the super rich that own all info outlets. There is no problem that isn't solved by working more to give more and more and more money to the rich and the industrialist of the world. And most of you people believe that. The solution to covid-19 is more trillions to Amazon and WalMart. You can not be happy unless you give Apple another $1500 for the next generation smart phone. All solutions, all happiness, only comes by working to give more and more money, more consumerism - to the richest people on earth. They rule you. Totally.
 

joko104

Banned
Suspended
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 21, 2009
Messages
65,981
Reaction score
23,408
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Good thing the United States is on a different planet than the rest of the countries, isn't it? Otherwise we couldn't change the entire atmosphere and planet. They need to change the lying school books falsely claiming all countries are on this planet. Let China, India and the rest of the countries each worry about the atmosphere of each their own planets.
 

Drawdown

DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 8, 2019
Messages
11,528
Reaction score
3,032
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
We should work to conserve native habitat and species, reduce our pollution, and curb our population growth. We should live more simply. If the Sky is Falling Psychos help with that even if for the completely wrong reasons, then I am fine with it.
 

longview

DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 25, 2012
Messages
39,589
Reaction score
13,575
Location
Texas
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
For those who wish to draw a correlation between CO2 levels and the sea level rise,
perhaps they should look at the data!
A few years ago, I downloaded the sea level data from battery park, and compared it to the CO2 level over the same time window.
CO2_to_NY_Sea_level_2.png
While the sea level rise has been very steady, the CO2 level has not!
For over 70 years, the CO2 level has been rapidly increasing, while the sea level rise, has been steady.
 

Novichok

Banned
Joined
Sep 8, 2020
Messages
719
Reaction score
153
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Conservative
You're missing an important part of this equation, which is reducing the energy consumption of individual Americans, by making our homes and workplaces more energy efficient. One way of doing this is by installing new appliances which consume less energy, which not only means less fuel being burned, but lower electricity bills as well.

Another method is to improve the insulation of the many aging homes in America. Poor insulation means more fuel being burned to keep the house warm, or cool, depending on the location. In addition, new homes and workplaces should incorporate design features with an eye toward reduced energy consumption.

You can do all of that, but it will not move the needle with China, India, and the underdeveloped countries exempted.

Trump saw through the scam and said nyet to the American taxpayers' money being given away.
 

Novichok

Banned
Joined
Sep 8, 2020
Messages
719
Reaction score
153
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Conservative
Global warming is just another tool in the globalists' toolbox. Scaring the crap out of the gullible - just as they are doing it now with the chinesevirus - they are getting the obedient sheep to be even more willing to comply and obey. That is why - as with gays - their main targets are the kids.

If they were really serious about global warming, they would oppose the millions migrating from the low energy consumption ****holes like Guatemala to the high consumption countries like the US.

Instead, they push for just the opposite - open borders and the hordes to come here for that American dream - four cars and a big house with a swimming pool - and, of course, Joe's free med care. Brilliant.
 

Moderate Right

DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 21, 2015
Messages
53,813
Reaction score
10,864
Location
Kentucky
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Conservative
You're missing an important part of this equation, which is reducing the energy consumption of individual Americans, by making our homes and workplaces more energy efficient. One way of doing this is by installing new appliances which consume less energy, which not only means less fuel being burned, but lower electricity bills as well.

Another method is to improve the insulation of the many aging homes in America. Poor insulation means more fuel being burned to keep the house warm, or cool, depending on the location. In addition, new homes and workplaces should incorporate design features with an eye toward reduced energy consumption.

That's what I meant by phasing in green energy while PHASING out dirty energy, instead of pushing it off the cliff.
 

Moderate Right

DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 21, 2015
Messages
53,813
Reaction score
10,864
Location
Kentucky
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Conservative
You can do all of that, but it will not move the needle with China, India, and the underdeveloped countries exempted.

Trump saw through the scam and said nyet to the American taxpayers' money being given away.

Exactly. The leftists feel that the US should pay the expenses for the third world countries and that we should suffer more ourselves to make up for countries such as China and India. I think Greta should go to China and bad mouth them and see where it gets her.
 

Lord of Planar

Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Monthly Donator
Joined
Dec 22, 2012
Messages
57,962
Reaction score
19,149
Location
Portlandia
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Humans can not stop the climate from changing or the sea level rising. Humans are less than 1/3rd of 1% of green house gases. Kill all humans on earth and it would change nothing.

Rather than trying to stop the endless evolution and cycles of earth, the only rational approach is to address the inevitable. We have decades to centuries for the most part.

12,000 years ago the sea level was 200 feet lower. 2000 years ago it was about 5-6 feet lower. 1000 years ago about 3 feet lower. 10 years ago an around an inch to an inch and a half. It is going to continue to rise as the last ice age ice continues to melt.

I don't know the correct values, but your 5-6 ft. lower 2,000 years ago is absolutely incorrect.
 
Top Bottom