Was Nazism a form of Socialism?

[apdst]

Right, if you define socialism loosely enough you can use it to include anyone you want! Even Hitler! Let's see ... Reagan was a socialist because he provided free emergency room care for the poor at government expense. He was also the president of a labor union. He also saved the ... SOCIAL Security system!

You're getting desperate, now. You must agree that Obama is a commie, since he attended a few meetings. Yes?

 

[AdamT]

American liberals still like to equate German conservatism with American conservatism, with the blanket, although misinformed attack that both are "right wing."

Except I don't see liberals trying to equate Nazism with the American conservative movement. I see conservatives trying to link Nazism to socialism.

 

[AdamT]

You're getting desperate, now. You must agree that Obama is a commie, since he attended a few meetings. Yes?

Sure, as long as you will admit that Ronald Reagan was a commie I'll cop to Obama being one.

 

[Harry Guerrilla]

Except I don't see liberals trying to equate Nazism with the American conservative movement. I see conservatives trying to link Nazism to socialism.

Then you haven't been looking very hard.
I can't help myself but remember the innumerable times of name calling of American conservatives as being "Reich wing."

 

[apdst]

Yes, their platform also called for religious freedom for all faiths. How did that work out in practice?

About like the other bogus claims in the Nazi propoganda platform.

You said earlier that everything the Nazis said was propaganda and therefore a pack of lies.

 

[Centinel]

Fair enough. I can appreciate a man who wants to cut through all the semantic bull**** and talk about the ideas.

Thanks. Sometimes terms like capitalism, socialism, etc. can actually obfuscate rather than shed light.

So, really, what you are saying is not at all that you are opposed to Fascism and Socialism because they are the same thing, but that you are opposed to them because they are both opposed to your thing.

Yes. Getting burned alive and getting decapitated are two very different things, but I would not like to be subjected to either one. Both socialism and fascism resulted in mountains of dead bodies.

That's all I want. I'm not trying to argue that I support much more than the barest semblance of capitalism, and I'm not trying to take a place among the champions of the free market. I'm just not willing to be lumped in with liberals and socialists when they are just as much my enemies as they are yours-- and however much distaste you may hold for me, you have so much more to fear from them.

I hold no distaste for you. I hope I didn't give that impression.

 

[apdst]

Except I don't see liberals trying to equate Nazism with the American conservative movement. I see conservatives trying to link Nazism to socialism.

What? :lamo

Man, that's rich!

 

[apdst]

Some of the Libbos need this.

A few butts are probably raw from all the spankings. :rofl

 

[AdamT]

You said earlier that everything the Nazis said was propaganda and therefore a pack of lies.

Uh yes, that was my point.

 

[Thunder]

..............................

well, your reply begs the question again:

when did the Nazis start cracking down on the Lutheran & Catholic Church in Germany? as this is what is traditionally done in Socialist states.

 

[Empirica]

Capitalism? socialism? Communism? . . . none of these things sum up Nazi-Germany. What does is "Fascist" "Totalitarian" or even "Elitist"

WHAT is everyone's obsession with 'socialism this - socialism that' :shrug:

Socialism is like a weed that will not be satisfied with one small corner of the garden and if not irradicated on sight, will spread and choke all other life from a once productive crop.

The sad truth is, socialism is a tried and failed system that has always been doomed to failure due to the unsustainable mechanics required to make it operate.

The path of socialism leads to communism leads to totalitarianism leads to fear, suffering and oppression.

socialism - definition of socialism by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

so·cial·ism (ssh-lzm)
n.
1. Any of various theories or systems of social organization in which the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy.
2. The stage in Marxist-Leninist theory intermediate between capitalism and communism, in which collective ownership of the economy under the dictatorship of the proletariat has not yet been successfully achieved.

And not once has the proletariat class ever been made the owners of their labor and the masters af their destiny as promised by the revolutionaries who made wonderful speeches and beautiful promises.

 

[apdst]

well, your reply begs the question again:

when did the Nazis start cracking down on the Lutheran & Catholic Church in Germany? as this is what is traditionally done in Socialist states.

Oh, about 1935, I reckon.

Sarasota Herald-Tribune - Google News Archive Search

 

[Thunder]

Oh, about 1935, I reckon.

Sarasota Herald-Tribune - Google News Archive Search

um, Socialist states don't have state-sanctioned and appointed religious leaders, as this article says Germany did indeed have.

 

[apdst]

um, Socialist states don't have state-sanctioned and appointed religious leaders, as this article says Germany did indeed have.

Oh? :lamo Does England have a state religion? Greece? I don't think you really want to go there.

But, hey, you asked when the nazis cracked down in the church; well, there you go.

 

[AdamT]

Oh? :lamo Does England have a state religion? Greece? I don't think you really want to go there.

But, hey, you asked when the nazis cracked down in the church; well, there you go.

Is England a socialist country? Does the government own the means of production? What about Greece?

There are no purely socialist countries in this world.

 

[apdst]

Is England a socialist country? Does the government own the means of production? What about Greece?

There are no purely socialist countries in this world.

It's almost as if you're raising the bar so high, as to suggest that socialism doesn't even exist. Brand new way to move the goal post. Good for you!!

 

[Thunder]

Oh? :lamo Does England have a state religion?....

yes, they officially do. That's part of why BRITAIN is not a Socialist country.

 

[AdamT]

It's almost as if you're raising the bar so high, as to suggest that socialism doesn't even exist. Brand new way to move the goal post. Good for you!!

The fact is there are no purely socialist countries. Every country -- even Cuba -- has elements of capitalism and socialism.

 

[Centinel]

The fact is there are no purely socialist countries. Every country -- even Cuba -- has elements of capitalism and socialism.

What you say is true. It's not black and white. Some governments implement more socialist policies, while other implement fewer.

Since I regard state socialism as a great evil, I tend to look more favorably on government that implement fewer socialist policies.

 

[apdst]

yes, they officially do. That's part of why BRITAIN is not a Socialist country.

Right! Ok!

 

[Empirica]

Baloney. People were legally bought and sold into slavery because money could be made off them. That is capitalistic to the core. I read your stuff and I wonder if you advised Bill Clinton on the meaning of the word IS?

Under a marxist/communist system the entire proletariat class are slaves of a police state whose very worth and existance is at the descretion of the party hierarchy.

Slavery has been practiced on every continent by every race of people yet strangely only white america and the United States are held to a different set of standards and rules and hated and ridiculed and even though every race of people on earth have been enslaved at one time or other only the black race is recognized as victims.

Don't you think this poor dead horse has been beaten enough? Don't you believe it's time that we all move on and stop worrying about whose ancesters owned slaves and whose ancesters were the slaves? 146 years and several generations have passed. That was then and this is now. Get over it!

 

[NGNM85]

Under a marxist/communist system the entire proletariat class are slaves of a police state whose very worth and existance is at the descretion of the party hierarchy.

Marxism is an ideology, and an analytical system, not a political system.

'Communism' can refer to;
A; The final phase in Marxist eschatology, a classless, stateless, egalitarian society.
B; Any ideology that seeks to establish society, including both Marxist, and non-Marxist ideologies, ranging from Maoism, or Marxist-Leninism on the right, to Libertarian ideologies like Council Communism, or Anarchism.
C; The Soviet Union, PRC, and all of their satellites and affiliates. Usually designated by a capital 'C.'

 

[Z3n]

Marxism is an ideology, and an analytical system, not a political system. 'Communism' can refer to;A; The final phase in Marxist eschatology, a classless, stateless, egalitarian society.B; Any ideology that seeks to establish society, including both Marxist, and non-Marxist ideologies, ranging from Maoism, or Marxist-Leninism on the right, to Libertarian ideologies like Council Communism, or Anarchism.C; The Soviet Union, PRC, and all of their satellites and affiliates. Usually designated by a capital 'C.'

Oh man its another relic of the cesspool of neo-revolutionaries from RevLeft. Oh my god.

 

[poweRob]

Capitalism? socialism? Communism? . . . none of these things sum up Nazi-Germany. What does is "Fascist" "Totalitarian" or even "Elitist"

WHAT is everyone's obsession with 'socialism this - socialism that' :shrug:

Because people are hung up on words rather than their meaning and use "socialism" as the big red scare so labeling something "socialist" is merely the poison pill that people use to try and kill what they don't want to talk about.

 

[cpwill]

Yes, their platform also called for religious freedom for all faiths. How did that work out in practice?

no, it didn't. it called for all religious faiths to have freedom so long as they were subordinated to greater Germany.

About like the other bogus claims in the Nazi propoganda platform.

so, let me see if I have your arguments thus far straight:

1. The National Socialists just said they were socialists, they didn't actually support socialist ideas
2. The fact that they claimed they supported socialist ideas is meaningless because they never said they were socialists, or, if they did, Hitler later said that it would have been more convenient to alter their terminology.


Just saying, if something looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, waddles like a duck, has the genetic code of a duck.... chances are... not a chicken.