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War on oil? Here's the math.

G-Man said:
If you can provide a link showing no Iraqi oil has came to the US in the last 2.5 years then I will believe you
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I can see you don't know much about debate. Let me give you some advice. If you make the claim, then it is your burden to prove. It is not acceptable to counter by asking your opponent to prove something didn't happen.

G-Man said:
I don't have a link to prove this, unfortunately, but I reckon...
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Nuff said. You just reckon till your heart's content.

G-Man said:
I guess the facts that Bush and his friends are all major players in the oil industry and that Iraqi has the worlds 2nd largest oil supplies just make him an easy target...
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Two questions:

1) Why do you disrespect the Bush family for being successful in the oil industry?

2) Do you know the percentage of oil we get from Iraq?
 
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G-Man said:
well thats set by OPEC
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Well, no. The price is set by the market. OPEC can influence the price by adjusting production volumes up or down, or even withholding their crude from the market in total, as they did in the '70s. Today, though, the cartel is much less cohesive than it was in the '70s. Cheating on quotas is much more likely.

Keep in mind that all OPEC countries have massive, massive appetites for dollars, for huge, huge social programs, exorbitant lifestyles and big, big military budgets. Consequently, it is in their best interests to keep the price as high as they can without causing economic dislocation or recession in the consuming countries.
 
Well, I do not have any links, but i work for the Military group responsible for Iraq right now. ihave briefed the Commander in charge there since before the war began. (Yeah, this is the internet...believe it or not, I don't care), and I know for a fact that the oil is being pumped from Iraq north through Turkey then sold on open market - the profit is going to the Iraqis to rebuild. The U.S,has also made a point NOT to purchase any of the Iraqi oil on the market just so they could refute the type of claims you are making. So, to combat political attacks like you are making, we are not buying any iraq oil, which would help us, and we are not using any of the profits to off-set the cost of the war, which would lower our mounting costs! We are hurting ourselve, basically, JUST so we won't be guiltyof doing what the Dems are claiming!

Again, believe it or not - don't care!
 
easyt65 said:
Well, I do not have any links, but i work for the Military group responsible for Iraq right now. ihave briefed the Commander in charge there since before the war began. (Yeah, this is the internet...believe it or not, I don't care), and I know for a fact that the oil is being pumped from Iraq north through Turkey then sold on open market - the profit is going to the Iraqis to rebuild. The U.S,has also made a point NOT to purchase any of the Iraqi oil on the market just so they could refute the type of claims you are making. So, to combat political attacks like you are making, we are not buying any iraq oil, which would help us, and we are not using any of the profits to off-set the cost of the war, which would lower our mounting costs! We are hurting ourselve, basically, JUST so we won't be guiltyof doing what the Dems are claiming!

Again, believe it or not - don't care!
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Thanks. It's good to hear it from someone who knows. I have a brother that works for Chevron. He says the same thing as you.
 
I can see you don't know much about debate. Let me give you some advice. If you make the claim, then it is your burden to prove. It is not acceptable to counter by asking your opponent to prove something didn't happen.
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If what someone is claiming has been a widely reported fact that many are aware of...except the person you are talking to....just because they are ignorant and too lazy to take 5 seconds to go on Google and do a little research themselves, why do I have to do it for them?!

I have talked to several self-proclaimed Dems on this bioard who make all kinds of outlandish claims. When I challenge them on it, they tell me to look it up...and I do, without whining. But when I post something or counter their outlandish claims with fact, they demand that I provide proof or a link! They add that if i do not provide such then it must be a lie. To be quite honest, I am kinda tired of being challenged to do research for lazy people who don't want to face the truth to begin with!
 
easyt65 said:
If what someone is claiming has been a widely reported fact that many are aware of...except the person you are talking to....just because they are ignorant and too lazy to take 5 seconds to go on Google and do a little research themselves, why do I have to do it for them?!
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You mean that it would only have taken you 5 seconds to prove your claim when you posted and you decided against it? Okay, I understand. ;)

Come on, lets see you substantiate that "widely reported fact." I dare ya.

Oh, and there are still some unanswered questions in post #26 that you avoided. I'll wait.

Stand by, folks. easyt is about to show us why the US threw out Saddam for the sole purpose to steal his oil.
 
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KCConservative said:
I can see you don't know much about debate. Let me give you some advice. If you make the claim, then it is your burden to prove. It is not acceptable to counter by asking your opponent to prove something didn't happen.

Two questions:

1) Why do you disrespect the Bush family for being successful in the oil industry?

2) Do you know the percentage of oil we get from Iraq?
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Well I can't seriously believe that you think no Iraqi oil makes its way to the US but to cover that scenario here you go :-

www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/cabs/iraq.html

In late 2004 they estimated 30% of Iraqi oil exports were going to North America. I guess the only surprise is the figure is so low.

Re: the points above -

1) I have no problem with people being successfull..its a goal we should all aim for. However, if your friends in the oil industry pay for you to run as president and then when you are elected you award big tax cuts to them I feel that is slightly suspect. Futhermore, if you then appoint one of the leading figures in the oil industry as your vice-chairman and then award his old company billion dollar contracts in Iraq (contracts where they were the only allowed bidder) I again feel you leave yourself open to criticism.

2) Not at present no..although if you look at the link above you may finally have to concede that some of the black 'gold' is finding its way back to the US. Hardly a surprise.
 
easyt65 said:
Well, I do not have any links, but i work for the Military group responsible for Iraq right now. ihave briefed the Commander in charge there since before the war began. (Yeah, this is the internet...believe it or not, I don't care), and I know for a fact that the oil is being pumped from Iraq north through Turkey then sold on open market - the profit is going to the Iraqis to rebuild. The U.S,has also made a point NOT to purchase any of the Iraqi oil on the market just so they could refute the type of claims you are making. So, to combat political attacks like you are making, we are not buying any iraq oil, which would help us, and we are not using any of the profits to off-set the cost of the war, which would lower our mounting costs! We are hurting ourselve, basically, JUST so we won't be guiltyof doing what the Dems are claiming!

Again, believe it or not - don't care!
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Well easyt, open the link in the above post which estimates 30% of Iraqi oil exports end up in the US. You may be correct in that we ain't paying for it but it is DEFINATELY ending up over here.

As regards using the oil/profits to pay for the war I suggest a look at :-

washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20040701-024236-4063r.htm

the following exert is a good one

Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld told a Senate hearing last March : "When it comes to reconstruction, before we turn to the American taxpayer, we will turn first to the resources of the Iraqi government and the international community."

We had and still have every intention of making the Iraqis pay for the war and resultant costs. Of course the infracture is shot up and the insurgents keep attacking the oil pipe's so its taking longer than expected...but we'll get there.

N.B I ain't arguing the Iraqi's shouldn't pay for this...I actually believe they should be paying for some of the reconstruction. Only mentioning this because you seem to believe Uncle Sam is some sort of white knight and is picking up the tab for the entire adventure. That quite frankly is a lie.
 
easyt65 said:
Iraq was a 'Democracy', too - they could all vote for anyone they wanted to....they just all voted for Saddam Hussein!
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It's plausible that the oil theory is partly or wholly correct, but no one has ever claimed that Iraq under Saddam was more desirable than Iraq after Saddam.

Who ran against Saddam?

easyt65 said:
If what someone is claiming has been a widely reported fact that many are aware of...except the person you are talking to....just because they are ignorant and too lazy to take 5 seconds to go on Google and do a little research themselves, why do I have to do it for them?!
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Fine, just don't expect anyone to take you seriously.
 
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