[W: 37] BoJo tries to defend weak sanctions in Parliament

[Ginza]

Even the German media are well aware of their nations failure to do "the right thing" over the Ukraine invasion.

"The new (German) government is facing a barrage of international criticism with regard to its actions in the Ukraine standoff."

German government under fire over Russia policy – DW – 02/02/2022

Where exactly does Germany stand on Russia? The new government is facing a barrage of international criticism with regard to its actions in the Ukraine standoff.

www.dw.com

 

[Peter King]

Thank goodness most realize that Germany, the EU, the UK and the US are totally warranted to punish Putin and his idiot administration.

 

[PeteEU]

The UK government is a joke as are their actions against Russia.

The UK won't accept Ukrainian refugees.

 

[Chagos]

Apart from criticism by its fellow member states, by the US and by Ukraine, German government's previous stance on non-delivery of weapons into a conflict zone was under heavy pressure from within.

Not just by the pretty strong opposition party but also from inside the government coalition.

As to Germany being one of the world's biggest arms exporters, where true, that changed nothing in the past in its policy of not delivering into conflict zones that are prevalent within any given state (like civil war, for instance).

Not the case here, at least in Germany's assessment, since it is now not arming Ukraine against the Donbass secessionists but against a foreign aggressor.

Bit of a strange-way-round waltz, I'd agree, but there it is.

 

[Chagos]

The idea that someone like BoJo (especially) can exert any pressure on German policy is laughable.

For all its other faults Germany doesn't listen to impotent clowns, not those within the EU and even less to those without.

By everything I get to hear from German friends and what I get to see in the German media, they're all having a hard time to keep polite about him instead of outright calling him a bumbling fool and a pathological liar. There certainly appears to be no respect for him whatever, Brexit here or Brexit there.

 

[Chagos]

The UK government is a joke as are their actions against Russia.

The UK won't accept Ukrainian refugees.

Yeah, hypocrites as usual.

The Nasty Party lives on.

 

[Peter King]

The UK government is a joke as are their actions against Russia.

The UK won't accept Ukrainian refugees.

Of course not, they are not buying gold tickets to the UK like the Ruskies are doing.

 

[joluoto]

The EU being a joke when it comes to sanctions does not excuse UK also being a joke. London is the playground of the oligarchs, UK is in a unique position to hurt Russia more than other nations could. Few other nations are in that position (there is Swtitzerland and they are also dragging their feet).

 

[Infinite Chaos]

Poles are never happy...

They were right about the donation of 5000 helmets though.

What people dont understand about Swift, is that it is a private voluntary system

True but it will heavily affect payments across a huge chunk of Russian import and exports. What you are not admitting is that BoJo is the one who tried getting the G7 to impose the SWIFT ban on Russia in the first place.

He had earlier tried and failed to convince fellow G7 leaders to shut Russia out of the Swift global payments system, though his spokesperson said he would continue to press the issue in the coming days.

Boris Johnson announces ‘largest ever’ set of sanctions against Russia

British PM sets out wide-ranging new measures against Moscow in wake of invasion of Ukraine

www.theguardian.com

The UK government is a joke as are their actions against Russia.

The UK won't accept Ukrainian refugees.

Ukraine invasion: Boris Johnson vows UK will take in refugees as thousands flee Russian advance

The United Nations has said more than 120,000 Ukrainian refugees have left their homes, forecasting four million could be displaced in total. Boris Johnson said the UK has played a "historic and proud" role in taking in refugees from previous conflicts.

news.sky.com

Think you're wrong there too.

What is horribly appalling though is Kevin Foster MP suggesting Ukrainians can come and pick fruit on farms in order to get on the simple sanctuary route into the UK.

Tory minister says Ukrainian refugees can apply to pick fruit on British farms

THE Tory Minister for “Safe and Legal Migration” has come under intense fire after he said that Ukrainians fleeing the Russian invasion could…

www.thenational.scot

There is pressure across the spectrum to do more for Ukrainians - and not just to become fruit pickers as I hope we see this week.

 

[Chagos]

They were right about the donation of 5000 helmets though.

What has gotten lost in all this brouhaha is that Ukraine actually asked for them. Still, whole affair didn't paint a good picture at all.

True but it will heavily affect payments across a huge chunk of Russian import and exports. What you are not admitting is that BoJo is the one who tried getting the G7 to impose the SWIFT ban on Russia in the first place.

If that is actually the case, good (for once). Nevertheless, the UK being far less dependent on trade with Russia than practically most other EU countries (fuel's the word), a comfortable position to cry demands from, if the backlash hardly hits you.

Although it has me wondering why the heck anybody would now wish to trade with that bunch of bastards, no matter the costs of repercussion (of kicking Russia out of SWIFT).

Think you're wrong there too.

Not two days ago.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/ukraine-war-refugees-uk-visas-b2022567.html

nor two weeks ago.
https://www.politico.eu/article/uk-foreign-secretary-britain-not-commit-ukraine-refugees/

But then if we forgive Germany over dragging its feet, we can do the same here. Fact remains that Britian, thruout modern history, hasn't left asylum seekers in the lurch all that much.

What is horribly appalling though is Kevin Foster MP suggesting Ukrainians can come and pick fruit on farms in order to get on the simple sanctuary route into the UK.

simple, pimple---------------no such sanctuare route currently exists (see above).

There is pressure across the spectrum to do more for Ukrainians - and not just to become fruit pickers as I hope we see this week.

Yes, dumb shits should not be allowed to be seen as speaking for overall government policy.

 

[joluoto]

They were right about the donation of 5000 helmets though.



True but it will heavily affect payments across a huge chunk of Russian import and exports. What you are not admitting is that BoJo is the one who tried getting the G7 to impose the SWIFT ban on Russia in the first place.

Boris Johnson announces ‘largest ever’ set of sanctions against Russia

British PM sets out wide-ranging new measures against Moscow in wake of invasion of Ukraine

www.theguardian.com

Ukraine invasion: Boris Johnson vows UK will take in refugees as thousands flee Russian advance

The United Nations has said more than 120,000 Ukrainian refugees have left their homes, forecasting four million could be displaced in total. Boris Johnson said the UK has played a "historic and proud" role in taking in refugees from previous conflicts.

news.sky.com

Think you're wrong there too.

What is horribly appalling though is Kevin Foster MP suggesting Ukrainians can come and pick fruit on farms in order to get on the simple sanctuary route into the UK.

Tory minister says Ukrainian refugees can apply to pick fruit on British farms

THE Tory Minister for “Safe and Legal Migration” has come under intense fire after he said that Ukrainians fleeing the Russian invasion could…

www.thenational.scot

There is pressure across the spectrum to do more for Ukrainians - and not just to become fruit pickers as I hope we see this week.

Priti Patel clashes with Labour over visas for people fleeing Ukraine​

While other countries were waiving Visa requirement for Ukrainian refugess Britain is still not doing it. But, it's probably Priti Patel who is the problem here. Her "no foreigners, no exceptions" attitude isn't exactly new, and she has even tried to fight the rest of the government when they have wanted to ease things in the past.

 

[PeteEU]

They were right about the donation of 5000 helmets though.

Context matters. Germany has had a 60+ year rule of not contributing weapons to active war zones. So no they were not correct, but freaking hypocrites as the rule that Germany was following, was due to Germany invading freaking Poland in 1939.

True but it will heavily affect payments across a huge chunk of Russian import and exports. What you are not admitting is that BoJo is the one who tried getting the G7 to impose the SWIFT ban on Russia in the first place.

Because he knew at the time, that Germany and France and others were against it. Now he is pretty silent that it is actually happening.

Ukraine invasion: Boris Johnson vows UK will take in refugees as thousands flee Russian advance

The United Nations has said more than 120,000 Ukrainian refugees have left their homes, forecasting four million could be displaced in total. Boris Johnson said the UK has played a "historic and proud" role in taking in refugees from previous conflicts.

news.sky.com

Think you're wrong there too.

No I am not. It has been all over the news. Vowing to take refugees in means nothing. The UK has vowed to take refugees in before and not done so. An actual plan and ruleset is a commitment... something the present UK government has a serious issue doing.

What is horribly appalling though is Kevin Foster MP suggesting Ukrainians can come and pick fruit on farms in order to get on the simple sanctuary route into the UK.

Tory minister says Ukrainian refugees can apply to pick fruit on British farms

THE Tory Minister for “Safe and Legal Migration” has come under intense fire after he said that Ukrainians fleeing the Russian invasion could…

www.thenational.scot

There is pressure across the spectrum to do more for Ukrainians - and not just to become fruit pickers as I hope we see this week.

He only said that because of Patel and Truss pushing similar bullshit.

 

[PeteEU]

Case in point.. the EU has said that Ukrainians can stay 3 years in the EU and don't need to apply for asylum. All countries have approved it... Yea even Hungary.

What are the UK rules... Anyone know, since the Patel and Truss won't say..

 

[Rich2018]

The UK government is a joke as are their actions against Russia.

The UK won't accept Ukrainian refugees.

Excuse me, this is the country that stood ALONE against Hitler
It is the country that accepted thousands of Poles after WWII who couldn't return to Poland

A joke ?

What did Spain do in WWII ?
Send men to fight for Hitler, that's what.

You have a weird sense of humor, no country on Earth did more to oppose totalitarian ism in the 20th century than Britain
Think why the people of Gibraltar vote overwhelmingly to be British and not Spanish.

Why your country has done 1/1000th of the effort to oppose tyranny that Britain has done, then you can talk.

 

[Ginza]

Excuse me, this is the country that stood ALONE against Hitler
It is the country that accepted thousands of Poles after WWII who couldn't return to Poland

A joke ?

What did Spain do in WWII ?
Send men to fight for Hitler, that's what.

You have a weird sense of humor, no country on Earth did more to oppose totalitarian ism in the 20th century than Britain
Think why the people of Gibraltar vote overwhelmingly to be British and not Spanish.

Why your country has done 1/1000th of the effort to oppose tyranny that Britain has done, then you can talk.

Great post.

Unfortunately, some EU residents are still bitter and angry over Brexit and, because of this, make some incredibly silly, untrue and inaccurate posts regarding the UK.

Hopefully, they will get over their disappointment eventually.

 

[Ginza]

Thankfully it seems that now that the Germans have been shamed by Biden, Johnson etc and even the Ukrainians themselves.....they are promising more support :

"Ukraine Ridicules Germany's offer to send helmets over weapons"

Ukraine ridicules Germany's offer to send helmets over weapons

After refusing to provide Ukraine with weapons as it faces the prospect of a Russian invasion, Germany offered on Wednesday to send 5,000 helmets to the...

www.dailysabah.com

It was moronic Germans who massacred many thousands of innocent Ukrainians during WW2. Germany has a greater responsibility to assist Ukraine than anyone else.

"more than 5,265,000 civilians and prisoners of war were killed during the occupation of Ukraine."

Nazi war crimes in Ukraine

www.encyclopediaofukraine.com

The EU had little interest in supporting the 67% of Ukrainians who wanted to join the EU....prior to the Russian invasion.

 

[Ginza]

What did Spain do in WWII ?
Send men to fight for Hitler, that's what.

Not only Spain, but the Netherlands also. They put together a whole division of SS troops.

 

[Ginza]

While other countries were waiving Visa requirement for Ukrainian refugess Britain is still not doing it.

Neither are the vast majority of the worlds nations....at least until they have protocols in place.

The EU has little choice anyway as Ukrainian refugees are pouring over the Polish border in their hundreds of thousands.

The EU has stood back and done nothing to help its neighbour, Ukraine, prior to the Russian invasion.

Selfishness and cheap natural gas has meant more to the EU than helping the Ukrainian people.

 

[PeteEU]

Excuse me, this is the country that stood ALONE against Hitler
It is the country that accepted thousands of Poles after WWII who couldn't return to Poland

A joke ?

What did Spain do in WWII ?
Send men to fight for Hitler, that's what.

You have a weird sense of humor, no country on Earth did more to oppose totalitarian ism in the 20th century than Britain
Think why the people of Gibraltar vote overwhelmingly to be British and not Spanish.

Why your country has done 1/1000th of the effort to oppose tyranny that Britain has done, then you can talk.

What the **** does WW2 have to do with today? And why bring Spain into this?

Fact is, at the moment the UK will only allow in Ukrainians if they have family in the UK....

 

[Ginza]

What the **** does WW2 have to do with today?

Er, perhaps you have forgotten this post of yours just a few posts upthread :

as the rule that Germany was following, was due to Germany invading freaking Poland in 1939.

 

[Ginza]

Trump must be laughing now that Germany has announced it is to increase its defence spending.

It's obviously too little too late to help Ukraine.

Trump was pissing off EU nation who were members of NATO by telling them nearly four years ago to increase their defence spending.

Instead Germany chose to increase its dependence on Russia for energy.

"Trump’s NATO criticism is ‘valid,’ Europe isn’t spending enough on defense"​

"only the U.S., U.K., Greece, Poland and Estonia reached the 2 percent target." (spend on defence budget"

Trump’s NATO criticism is ‘valid,’ Europe isn’t spending enough on defense, UK ex-minister says

President Donald Trump is pushing other countries within the NATO military alliance to contribute more to their defense spending — and the U.K.’s former defense minister has told CNBC that he agrees.

www.cnbc.com

 

[PeteEU]

Er, perhaps you have forgotten this post of yours just a few posts upthread :

So that comment means everything else is ignored? Pathetic.

 

[joluoto]

When is UK going to cancel the Golden Visas and apply the sanctions in overseas territories (especially British Virgin Islands)? Also waive VISA requirement for refugees already, if Ireland and Portugal can do it, so can UK.

 

[Peter King]

Not only Spain, but the Netherlands also. They put together a whole division of SS troops.

There it is mr. Whataboutism of 70 years ago.

You do know the subject is the Ukraine crisis? Not your hangups about people who dared to speak out against the biggest clown of the last 100 years or so to live in Number 10?

 

[Chagos]

post #68 smacks of the usual ignorance in that Ukrainians can travel to the EU without any Visa and have been able to do that for quite some time (since 2017, ferchrissake).

For a (max.) 90 day stay, admittedly, but nobody is going to send any Ukrainian back on the 91st day.