[W:15]What Should We Do With Saudi Arabia?

[Checkerboard Strangler]

Just wondering what everyone thinks of the situation with Saudi Arabia.

Same as always, the sooner we disconnect from our need for their oil, the sooner we extricate ourselves from the geopolitical situation that leaves us dependent upon their position in the region, the better.

How doable is the former? Quite, just keep pushing efficiency and alternatives.
The latter? Extremely difficult as this is a bed largely of our making and the UK's making decades ago.

The problem is, KSA's position is not rock solid, not nearly as much as we thought it has been or think it is.
The West is reluctant to admit that the House of Saud could crumble in the blink of an eye, thanks either to a series of royal failures or rotten intrigues, or thanks to the shifting sands of monarchial politics vis a vis the Saudi people.

Kingdoms, even dynastic ones stretching back centuries, can disappear overnight with little outside warning.
Absolute power is susceptible to absolute destruction by both internal and external forces, and without the moderating effects of parliamentary and democratic processes, and the stability of a republican framework, one can wake up and find that a dynasty has succumbed to the sword in the twinkling of an eye.

American and British exceptionalism preached the gospel that both would eventually have a moderating and civilizing influence on the Kingdom. Well, women can drive now, but aside from that, much is as it was in the 11th century and will remain so.

The termites however, are in for the long game, and they are eating away at the foundations of the House of Saud.

 

[TheParser]

Re: What Should We Do With Saudi Arabia?

Re: the thread question


We should do nothing.



We should do something AFTER

we punish Russia for stealing Ukrainian territory.
we punish Central America for sending undocumented migrants to our borders.
we punish China for seizing parts of the ocean for its exclusive use.
we punish South Africa for taking farmland without compensation.
we punish Indonesia for its current anti-gay frenzy.


etc. etc. etc.


Let's NOT pick on Saudi Arabia just because it's easy to do so.

 

[Lovebug]

Re: What Should We Do With Saudi Arabia?

Stick to our values/tell them to shove it goes for all countries that don't share our values. If that were true, every administration before this would have stopped doing business with many countries. It is a give an take world. In order to accomplish, we need to give. When asking for a favor, we need to give.
SA and the killing of one person vs atrocities in other countries, heck, if we were really the champions of human rights, we'd close our borders completely and interact with only a few select nations.
The hypocrisy is thick.

 

[Oborosen]

Just wondering what everyone thinks of the situation with Saudi Arabia.

Apply pressure to help them conform to more agreeable standards of work, especially dealing with personal freedoms. At the very most they should do something to muzzle the royals power, or at least submit to some form of reliable checks and balances for it in the very least.

 

[justabubba]

Apply pressure to help them conform to more agreeable standards of work, especially dealing with personal freedoms. At the very most they should do something to muzzle the royals power, or at least submit to some form of reliable checks and balances for it in the very least.

like we did to the iranians in the early 50's ... that sure worked out well

 

[slick]

Just wondering what everyone thinks of the situation with Saudi Arabia.

Buy stuff from them & keep on being a good ally.

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

Well because they killed a critic of their awful repressive regime, and instead of criticizing them Trump praised them for keeping gas prices low.. Maybe Trump should ask them to kill more people, and maybe our gas will drop to .99 a gallon.

 

[Moderate Right]

Well because they killed a critic of their awful repressive regime, and instead of criticizing them Trump praised them for keeping gas prices low.. Maybe Trump should ask them to kill more people, and maybe our gas will drop to .99 a gallon.

Did you vote in the poll? Or, do you just want to criticize Trump for doing the very same thing that you would have done? If you don't vote then you can't criticize. I gave you option one. Are you going to take it?

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

Did you vote in the poll? Or, do you just want to criticize Trump for doing the very same thing that you would have done? If you don't vote then you can't criticize.

I would have done?/ lol...lol...lol...

Way back a long time ago when I was a Republican I would have been THRILLED if we told SA to **** off. My criticism now has NOTHING to do with politics.. But Trump is an idiot for praising PoS regimes like SA by thanking them for lower gas prices after they just assassinated a reporter. . So don't tell me 'what I would do'.. You haven't a clue.

 

[ipsofacto]

More Republicans challenge Trump on defense of Saudi crown prince

Congressional Republicans continued to line up this weekend to criticize President Trump over his defense of Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, who the CIA believes ordered the killing of Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi.

“I disagree with the president’s assessment,” Sen. Mike Lee (R-Utah) said Sunday on NBC’s “Meet the Press.” “It’s inconsistent with the intelligence I’ve seen . . . . The intelligence I’ve seen suggests that this was ordered by the crown prince.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/powe...8604ed88993_story.html?utm_term=.dc9651b9f25d

 

[Rexedgar]

Well because they killed a critic of their awful repressive regime, and instead of criticizing them Trump praised them for keeping gas prices low.. Maybe Trump should ask them to kill more people, and maybe our gas will drop to .99 a gallon.

“........but think of the traffic jams!”

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

More Republicans challenge Trump on defense of Saudi crown prince

Congressional Republicans continued to line up this weekend to criticize President Trump over his defense of Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, who the CIA believes ordered the killing of Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi.

“I disagree with the president’s assessment,” Sen. Mike Lee (R-Utah) said Sunday on NBC’s “Meet the Press.” “It’s inconsistent with the intelligence I’ve seen . . . . The intelligence I’ve seen suggests that this was ordered by the crown prince.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/powe...8604ed88993_story.html?utm_term=.dc9651b9f25d

Trump don't care. He's done this a bunch of times with other repressive regimes and dictators.. No one holds him accountable. There are no consequences for his lies and praising countries like SA, Russia etc.. The Republican cowards in Congress just spew a few one-liners, but they won't do anything serious to hold him accountable.

 

[Moderate Right]

I would have done?/ lol...lol...lol...

Way back a long time ago when I was a Republican I would have been THRILLED if we told SA to **** off. My criticism now has NOTHING to do with politics.. But Trump is an idiot for praising PoS regimes like SA by thanking them for lower gas prices after they just assassinated a reporter. . So don't tell me 'what I would do'.. You haven't a clue.

Then why don't you tell us what you would do? I mean I had a poll choice saying stand up to our values and tell SA to **** off. You didn't take it. You can't criticize someone for what they did when you apparently have no opinion of what we should have done. All you want to do is criticize Trump when you won't even say what you would have done.

 

[Myview]

Re: What Should We Do With Saudi Arabia?

let me get some of this straight...a Saudi citizen gets murdered in a foreign country by a foreign national and somehow the US media is going ape over this? Explain? Why is this more a world event than when the Obama administration ordered, the military using a drone, to murder a US citizen in Yemen?

The man killed in Yemen was actively organizing attacks against the US. The AUMF act effectively cancelled his citizenship and allowed the US to kill him without due process. The whole sane world has condemned the killing of Khassoggi, not just the US media. There is something called values. Most people think the Trump administration is not following US values in its approach to Saudi Arabia and the Khassoggi killing. Most people applaud when a terrorist living any where who attacks the US is killed. I don't know if the AUMF act has been repealed.

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

Then why don't you tell us what you would do? I mean I had a poll choice saying stand up to our values and tell SA to **** off. You didn't take it. You can't criticize someone for what they did when you apparently have no opinion of what we should have done. All you want to do is criticize Trump when you won't even say what you would have done.

Because your reputation here proceeds you. In other words you're not fooling anyone.

Night

 

[jamesrage]

Just wondering what everyone thinks of the situation with Saudi Arabia.

I picked other. It should be the same thing we do anytime Saudi Arabia kills people for homosexuality, atheism, adultery, blasphemy and other **** that are not crimes in most countries. But I guess that would probably be do nothing. So I should have picked 'do nothing' instead of 'other'. We don't get outrage when Saudi Arabia kills those people so I don't think we should be up in arms over them killing a journalists. Journalists are no more important than those people.

 

[Rogue Valley]

The Trump administration sanctioned 17 Saudi individuals involved in the Jamal Khashoggi assassination, but refuses to sanction the 18th individual. Mohammad bin Salman.

Why? The why will hopefully be unraveled after January 3rd.

 

[Moderate Right]

Because your reputation here proceeds you. In other words you're not fooling anyone.

Night

Your reputation preceeds you. You are a lefty liberal, no moderate. You take this thread opportunity to bash Trump but you refuse to say what you would do.

 

[Moderate Right]

I picked other. It should be the same thing we do anytime Saudi Arabia kills people for homosexuality, atheism, adultery, blasphemy and other **** that are not crimes in most countries. But I guess that would probably be do nothing. So I should have picked 'do nothing' instead of 'other'. We don't get outrage when Saudi Arabia kills those people so I don't think we should be up in arms over them killing a journalists. Journalists are no more important than those people.

Exactly. The left didn't want to attack SA for all of that other stuff but now that Trump is president, they want to criticize Trump for doing the very same thing that every other president, including Obama, have done in similar circumstances.

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

Your reputation preceeds you. You are a lefty liberal, no moderate. You take this thread opportunity to bash Trump but you refuse to say what you would do.

You're a moderate Republican? LOL LOL LOL. Pot meet kettle

 

[The Mark]

Other: Completely eliminate oil as a resource we use in any form, except minimal for small things.

Then tell them to go **** themselves.

 

[CLAX1911]

Just wondering what everyone thinks of the situation with Saudi Arabia.

I picked do nothing we are not the world's police.

 

[FirstTracksGirl]

Our government won't turn its back on Saudi Arabia because our government wants to protect "our" interests which in this case are oil and military bases. Considering Saudi Arabia's history, human rights violations, views towards women, and views towards most freedoms really we should have nothing to do with them, but showing the world and Saudi Arabia that we value morality and goodness over oil prices and military might just isn't in our interests or our priority. I don't know if it ever will be unfortunately. If we would continue to really focus on energy independence and increasing alternative energy sources at home then we wouldnt need to buddy up to very bad people. And if we would stop with the military bases all over the world, stop dealing arms, and stop propping up dictators then we wouldnt find ourselves in the situation of having to choose between our morals and values and things like oil, accessibility, and weapons in my opinion. We put ourselves in a damned if we do, damned if we don't situation and its all our own doing.

 

[justabubba]

Our government won't turn its back on Saudi Arabia because our government wants to protect "our" interests which in this case are oil and military bases. Considering Saudi Arabia's history, human rights violations, views towards women, and views towards most freedoms really we should have nothing to do with them, but showing the world and Saudi Arabia that we value morality and goodness over oil prices and military might just isn't in our interests or our priority. I don't know if it ever will be unfortunately. If we would continue to really focus on energy independence and increasing alternative energy sources at home then we wouldnt need to buddy up to very bad people. And if we would stop with the military bases all over the world, stop dealing arms, and stop propping up dictators then we wouldnt find ourselves in the situation of having to choose between our morals and values and things like oil, accessibility, and weapons in my opinion. We put ourselves in a damned if we do, damned if we don't situation and its all our own doing.

[emphasis added by bubba]

i could be mistaken, but my understanding was saudi arabia was directed by osama bin laden to have American bases vacated in that country immediately after 9/11. and that was done by the ****scared saudi royals

 

[Cordelier]

I look at Saudi Arabia and all I see is a country destined to go the same way as Iran. Back in the 70's we knew the Shah was a SOB, but we stuck by him because he was our SOB. Look how well that turned out. I think we ought to learn our lesson from that and cut them loose. All of the Gulf Monarchies are living on borrowed time - the sooner we realize that, the better shape we'll be in when history turns the same corner that it did in 1979.