[W:1][W:11][W:368] Russia invades Ukraine: Live Thread

[Schrott]

What are the odds that the Russians have maintained their nukes in the same manner that they seem to have handled their military vehicles?

Very high

 

[ChickenTendies]

AKA Putin wants to control sovereign nations and will invade them if they don't do what he wants. Absurd.
Maybe Putin wants to rule the Moon too, should we just give him what he wants because "what he want ts" makes it right? Gods man.


Backing them into a corner? You mean condemning his invasion/attack of a sovereign nation that was moving towards democracy/freedom?

After they chose freedom over Russia, yeah, we know.

You're obfuscating the "facts", and you know it.

1. Once again, all I literally said was that Putin wants buffer states (a fact) and you somehow turned that into a condescending retort.
2. You seem not to have read my post well since I did not discuss that. Expanding up to Russia's borders has put Putin into a corner. He does not have buffer states between Russia and the West nor a sphere of influence over Eastern European nations. I only mentioned this to point out Russia's predicament, yet you somehow interpreted this as something completely different.
3. You do realize the public opinion was split down the middle right? And choosing "freedom" led to little economic prosperity, oligarchs still had free rein, and the only thing that changed was the US funneling military aid.

I'm not sure how I'm "obfuscating" facts,

 

[prometeus]

I mean if reality is the closed bubble you live in then yeah. Since you seem incapable of responding with anything except one-liner insults, I wont put much stock into your opinion.

I really don't give a crap what you put into what and as for my responses, they are commensurate with the crap you post.
Go for something intelligent and realistic and I will do the same.

 

[Centrist]

 

[Schrott]

That is a T81

 

[ChickenTendies]

I really don't give a crap what you put into what and as for my responses, they are commensurate with the crap you post.
Go for something intelligent and realisting and I will do the same.

I have been posting genuine viewpoints, but you seem to get triggered whenever I do. Calm down, log off, and go outside. Fuming on a online forum isn't very healthy.

 

[JANFU]

Putin is withdrawing all conscripts from Ukraine
That should be fun to plan

 

[JANFU]

That is a T81

OK- At times a photo, and the assessment on the link can change.
Link has 2 others also stating it is a T80

 

[Mach]

1. Once again, all I literally said was that Putin wants buffer states (a fact) and you somehow turned that into a condescending retort.

It's because it's absurd the way you wrote that...he just wants some buffer states...lol. They are not his countries!
Putin wants other sovereign nations to do what he wants (if not, he'll invade and overthrow them). It's ridiculous.

2. You seem not to have read my post well since I did not discuss that. Expanding up to Russia's borders has put Putin into a corner. He does not have buffer states between Russia and the West nor a sphere of influence over Eastern European nations. I only mentioned this to point out Russia's predicament, yet you somehow interpreted this as something completely different.

NATO already has two countries that border Russia. Other countries joining NATO is good for the world. That Putin hates it, is hardly relevant.
It's Putin's choice, and he's in the wrong. That's why most countries voted to condemn his behavior, no surprise there.

3. You do realize the public opinion was split down the middle right? And choosing "freedom" led to little economic prosperity, oligarchs still had free rein, and the only thing that changed was the US funneling military aid.
I'm not sure how I'm "obfuscating" facts,

Change takes time. We're willing to invest in a democracy-seeking Ukraine. They may indeed lose everything to Putin, but that's their choice to make. I'm glad we're helping them.

 

[Centrist]

Putin is withdrawing all conscripts from Ukraine
That should be fun to plan

Russian Ministry of Defense said they have been already withdrawn.

Right, right....

 

[JANFU]

Cumulative not the number fired that day

 

[JANFU]

Russian Ministry of Defense said they have been already withdrawn.

Right, right....

Wonder the tally on Russian prisoners?

 

[RealityNow]

Russia increases censorship with new law: 15 years in jail for calling Ukraine invasion a 'war'​

quote
“War” and “invasion” are two words that can land someone in prison for up to 15 years under a new Russian law.

Those words are “fake news" in the eyes of Russian lawmakers and President Vladimir Putin, who last week passed a law criminalizing the intentional spread of information that goes against the government’s narrative about what the country prefers to call a “special military operation” in Ukraine.

As Russia grows increasingly isolated from the Western world as a result of sanctions and bans, the Kremlin has, in some ways, embraced the isolation by pushing out non-Russian speech and press.

The bill was quickly passed through both houses of the Kremlin-controlled parliament and signed by Putin on March 4.

Experts told USA TODAY that Russia has been clamping down on free speech and independent press for years – even decades – without such momentous reaction. The country has even passed a number of similar laws in the past.

This time, the implications could be much more dangerous.
end quote


It's time for Russian people to FIND the means to "Take Putin Out" !!! It does not matter if it means jailing him for life, of finding means to end his life, they need to "act" and remove this menace to the world and this tyranically Hitler mentality Savage from society, and all those who have enabled him in the higher circles of decision making. It's not likely he sleeps in a gas mask, and he has to eat and drink.... so there are ways that can be engaged to "make him go away". He has been killing people for Decades and now he is mass murdering people with no sense of conscience about doing so. He is treating the Russian people as if they are his personal property with his draconian savage madness.

I would think that before the end of the month they will devise a means to "get rid themselves of him and those who enable him". No man should have the means to do what Putin has done. Absolutely "NO Man" !!!!!

The People of Russian has to devise a "transistion plan" to ensure they can transistion with someone who is civil and civically responsible and is not driven by inhumane madness and old Soviet containment of people, while at the same time, making sure they have protections for the Nuclear Weapons.

If the people want to get away from this savage and start a New Government, then NATO and the UN can help them. The UN, can appoint someone to oversee the transition who can assure Russian people their rights as person is restored, their basica human freedoms are restored to them, but at the same time, someone who can bring in UN teams to "clamp down on corruptions, so the Oligarch's can't take more of what should belong to public entities and state ownership. This also means, ensuring that various public services that Oligarch's have dominated are returned to the State.

It's would be similar to a New Marshal Plan, to help them re-establish themselves away from Soviet and Tyranical Madness. Sure not all Russian will like it, but that is not the concern that should matter, its about the mass general population, the neighboring countries, Ukraines and a system that build better relations with the West and the rest of the world of Nations.

We can be assured between European countries and the various UN and NATO "think tanks", they certainly have the data to know how to support and promote a Marshal Plan that can help Russia transistion away from the system and madness that Putin has created and caused over the past 20+ yrs.

It's a big task, but the world of many nations, are there to assist in this transistion. China may balk and talk crap, but China will be first in line to want to be the main supplier both for a Restablished Russia, and they will be first in line to want to supply materials and products for the Rebuilding of Ukraine.
The global nations will be ready to invest in Rebuilding Ukraine, and in doing so, it can set a "model" that can be beneficial to other countries that want to make changes to become non-adversarial.

People like Putin, needs to be dispensed with, and it needs to be done by the Russian People.

 

[Schrott]

One thing about the T81 is odd, its turrent points backwards as it looks, or it has mine rollers at the front. Normally the Russians mount a lot of stuff in the rear. But one can make out the wedge shape front of the turrend, which speaks for a 80 or 81

 

[bave]

Why, when we have such luminaries and military experts as you?

Look, I am interested in other opinions. I have read a lot on the topic from a lot of wide ranging sources and I have yet to hear an expert actually deny any sort of western provocation.

Why imagine such stupid scenario? What was illegal about the election in Ukraine?

The deposition of a new government without due process and installation of a new one without elections. The incoming government even acknowledged that it was unconstitutional but that it was necessary due to timeliness.

What foreign troops were allowed in the Ukraine?

American off the top of my head.

Right you are just making stupid excuses based on stupid premises.

Actually you have no clue.

Right. I have no clue and you didn't know the answer to the basic questions above.

 

[MaryP]

Putin is withdrawing all conscripts from Ukraine
That should be fun to plan

Don't they train their conscripts, or what? When we drafted soldiers, we still trained them. This must be a different system than I've ever heard of.

 

[Juin]

What happens if Russia manages to kill or capture the president of Ukraine? Do the Ukrainians lose their will for the resistance or do they keep fighting?

I will say what we have here in the Black Sea is a complex situation. Various levels. And conflicting interests. At the highest level there is the big power rivalry between Nato on one hand, and Russia on the other; with Ukraine as a pawn.

Ukrainians, by all indications, will object to Russian domination for the near or distant future. Even if they lose in the short run, and I am not saying that they will; they may overpower the Russians, I dont know. But even if they dont all indications are that Russia will be unable to develop that healthy relations with Ukrainians that can build a long term harmonious relationship. In a way it is almost like the Czech and Slovak relationship, in time Russia and Ukraine* will part ways.

*When I say Ukraine I mean the Ukrainian nationals. Not the geographic Ukraine. The portion of Ukraine that is heavily ethnic Russian, like Donbass and Crimea, may have been lost to Ukraine for good.

 

[RealityNow]

They will change their tune.... because the U.S. won't be blackmailed by S.A. ... the same as it has resisted being sucked in to the War that Russia's Putin has been trying to do.

Saudi, loves the high prices of Oil... they made a fortune for 20 yrs of the War in Iraq and Afghanistan, so they are thinking in "greed terms" to want help drag out the war, because they only see "Profit by High Prices BBL for Oil".

Their decision will backfire..

If they have not taken a stand to try and get Putin to stop the savagery, then they will make themselves complicit in the continuing savagery, and the World of Nations won't forget that!!!!

 

[bave]

One thing about the T81 is odd, its turrent points backwards as it looks, or it has mine rollers at the front. Normally the Russians mount a lot of stuff in the rear. But one can make out the wedge shape front of the turrend, which speaks for a 80 or 81

Wtf is a T81?

 

[Mach]

That is an option. The other is to beat the sh*t out of a neighbour who invites a distant, hostile military alliance into the neighbourhood.

Like Roadvirus pointed out, NATO is not hostile, it doesn't invade countries.
Russia's economy and reputation is also getting beat to shit. Their military isn't doing great from what I understand, even if they far outgun Ukraine they seem to be taking loses of their own and not making rapid progress.

Up to Ukraine if they want to stand up to the bully or not. Ukraine has known for a long time that conflict with Russia was gonna happen, they have been expecting this. Maybe they lose and become another Putin puppet state, I don't know.

 

[prometeus]

I have been posting genuine viewpoints

No, you have been posting stupid viewpoints, totally inconsistent with a modern civilized world.
By your logic, or rather the absence of it, any nation that does not have sphere of influence should be able and be justified in invading a neighbor. Has it ever occured to you the Russia has nothing to offer and that is why it has no sphere of influence among the civilized nations of the world and considering its past behavior smaller nations are seeking the protection of the EU and NATO because they do not threaten them?

but you seem to get triggered whenever I do.

Not at all. All I did was point out that you posted crap.

Calm down, log off, and go outside.

I do not have to, but you should could use some education. Why not inform yourself a but more before making more stupid comments?

 

[Juin]

Lethal NATO alliance? Plus, there is ZERO chance NATO would invade Russia. If they were as blood thirsty for war as Russia they would be using the invasion of Ukraine as an excuse to declare war on Russia. Instead they have displayed they very much do NOT want to start a war with Russia.

The assessment from the Russian side has to be wether Nato can invade Russia, not whether Nato will invade Russia. If Nato can invade Russia, and is capable of overcoming Russia, then it is the duty of any Russian government to move to address that potential threat. A Russian government has to prepare for case where the friendly Nato of today ceases to be friendly and turns hostile.

 

[Schrott]

Wtf is a T81?

That is a main battle Tank developed out of the T70, into the T80 and then into the 81, a further evolution of the 70.

 

[JANFU]

Don't they train their conscripts, or what? When we drafted soldiers, we still trained them. This must be a different system than I've ever heard of.

Quite different & brutal

 

[Mach]

The assessment from the Russian side has to be wether Nato can invade Russia, not whether Nato will invade Russia. If Nato can invade Russia, and is capable of overcoming Russia, then it is the duty of any Russian government to move to address that potential threat. A Russian government has to prepare for case where the friendly Nato of today ceases to be friendly and turns hostile.

B.S. The U.S and it's allies can beat Russia there and back again in a conventional war.
MAD keeps war at bay.
Your post is absurd.