Utopia not imagined

[Gordy327]

Just gotta get Kirk to stop banging green and purple women with horns.

Are you kidding? Kirk is a space gigolo. And green chicks are hot. So are the ones with spots.

 

[The Mark]

Do you think there's any merit in thinking Utopia possible if the humans who create it in the future have advanced and evolved to hold a philosophical/moral outlook on society that we can not conceive of yet?

I'm not sure humans capable of that would still be human.

 

[ataraxia]

We grow through conflict. A utopian society would by definition be a static society. There is no change so there is no growth. In other words a utopian society is a dead society.

Some conflict is constructive, some destructive. For example, some conflict and difference of opinion on a scientific topic is great. Violence and killing each other over it is not. Maybe we can aim towards more of one and less of the other.

 

[Gordy327]

You just laid out perfectly how to start striving for Utopia! With the conclusion sounding a lot like a Utopia.

One difficulty towards achieving utopia is people's short attention span. Many want instant gratification. But working towards utopia will likely take many generations.

 

[ataraxia]

Are you kidding? Kirk is a space gigolo. And green chicks are hot. So are the ones with spots.

I know- especially green chicks with 60s hairdos!

 

[ttwtt78640]

You just laid out perfectly how to start striving for Utopia! With the conclusion sounding a lot like a Utopia.

My signature does so as well.

 

[Gordy327]

I know- especially green chicks with 60s hairdos!

Short skirts or a scant wardrobe is a plus too (thank you William Theiss)

 

[soylentgreen]

Why don't we try it for a while.

Try what? Utopia is nothing more than a slur thrown at socialists by idiots.

 

[soylentgreen]

This is the best counter point here. I absolutely agree that it would cause stagnation. Or maybe it would be a drastically reduced rate of advancement then we are accustomed to now. Is this a reason for people not to live in harmony with each other? I don't think so. But it's still a valid issue.

Even when living in harmony with people we still need some conflict to grow. New ideas come from a problem that needs a solution. But utopia is a place where there are no problems so no new ideas.

 

[soylentgreen]

Some conflict is constructive, some destructive. For example, some conflict and difference of opinion on a scientific topic is great. Violence and killing each other over it is not. Maybe we can aim towards more of one and less of the other.

While we should seek peaceful solutions we do need problems in our lives so as to be able to think of solutions for those problems which create new ideas and better ways of doing things. When I say conflict that does not mean war or fighting. It means we need problems to think about otherwise we stop thinking.

 

[code1211]

I agree. But I think God has higher hopes for us than what we have. I also believe what we have in America now is in itself an amazing accomplishment for mankind. All these different people with different viewpoints and different passions but really in the end making it all work.

In some ways, I agree.

In others, not so much.

The system seems to be a good one. The people working the system seem to of the worst sort.

Our representatives that we elect and the appointees that they appoint seem to be, in the vast majority, lying thieves.

I was impressed that the amount of money stolen from Covid Relief in 2021 is thought to be about a half a TRILLION dollars.

That works out to about $1,500 STOLEN from each and every individual American.

This has just GOT to impress anyone!

 

[code1211]

What heaven, what god, you mean the one in the clouds.

Ask the Ukrainians about some bullshit utopia.

You seem outraged. Why?

 

[PoS]

Yes! What a great observation. Look how many technologies that were in Star Trek that have come to be reality. Why couldn't we do that? If you take the people on Earth right now living 2022 you could not form a Utopia with the human race as it is. But what if people started working for changes now. Maybe in after 3 or 4 generations of working for these changes a Star Trek like Civilization might come to form.

LOL Star Trek is pure fantasy. Not a good example to aspire to.

 

[gboisjo]

gboisjo said:
What heaven, what god, you mean the one in the clouds.

Ask the Ukrainians about some bullshit utopia.

You seem outraged. Why?

Have you been watching the assault on Ukraine, the innocent children being killed and traumatized.

And we're talking utopias, forget that shit, pray that Russia's war doesn't go nuclear.

 

[Daisy]

Have you been watching the assault on Ukraine, the innocent children being killed and traumatized.

And we're talking utopias, forget that shit, pray that Russia's war doesn't go nuclear.

That's what happens when humans get what they wish for...independence from Jehovah...

 

[code1211]

Have you been watching the assault on Ukraine, the innocent children being killed and traumatized.

And we're talking utopias, forget that shit, pray that Russia's war doesn't go nuclear.

Again: You seem outraged.

I suppose I need to clarify my question.

Your outrage seems to be aimed at a deficiency that you attribute to God.

Is that correct?

 

[gboisjo]

Your outrage seems to be aimed at a deficiency that you attribute to God.

What god?

 

[code1211]

What god?

Why did you amputate a shred of a thought and present it as if it was a whole thought?

 

[gboisjo]

Again: You seem outraged.

I suppose I need to clarify my question.

Your outrage seems to be aimed at a deficiency that you attribute to God.

Is that correct?

No.

 

[code1211]

No.

What is the cause of your outrage?

 

[gboisjo]

What is the cause of your outrage?

Why are you obsessed with me.

I mean move on or do you want my phone number.

 

[code1211]

Why are you obsessed with me.

I mean move on or do you want my phone number.

This is a public forum. You post here and i read you post.

If you didn't want me and others to read your post, why did you post it where the public can read it?

 

[HK.227]

Do you think there's any merit in thinking Utopia possible if the humans who create it in the future have advanced and evolved to hold a philosophical/moral outlook on society that we can not conceive of yet?

The problem is choice.

 

[code1211]

The problem is choice.

Choices made by humans always seem to involve self interest. Even in things that appear to be charitable. I volunteer my time to help "the needy". But it makes me feel good to do so.

Choices made in any Utopian Society must necessarily be selfless and altruistic BY ALL MEMBERS IN THE UTOPIA.

If people are the people who are in the Utopia, it won't work.

 

[HK.227]

Choices made by humans always seem to involve self interest. Even in things that appear to be charitable. I volunteer my time to help "the needy". But it makes me feel good to do so.

Choices made in any Utopian Society must necessarily be selfless and altruistic BY ALL MEMBERS IN THE UTOPIA.

If people are the people who are in the Utopia, it won't work.

Well, the first thing Alduous Huxley did when he wrote his dystopian Utopia novel "Brave New World" was to remove choice and replace it with illusion of choice.
Echoed in the Matrix movies in a frequently misunderstood scene as: "The problem is choice".

Pop-culture references aside, there is a nice little book written by a guy named Noah Harari titled "Sapiens".
It describes how a certain group of primates seems to have become dominant on the planet in large part by being weak but fairly smart, and therefore prone to a species-based type of anxiety that spurs constant innovation. If that hypothesis is accurate, it would also imply (among a great many other things) that if we were ever to achieve Utopia, we would immedately start evolving our way out of it; a conclusion that resonates fairly well with my own preconceptions.