US Military Threats Toward Iran Do Not Work: By Mousavian and Shahidsaless[W:47]

[ilia786]

Summary :
Mousavian and ShahidSaless write that demonstrating good will, such as sanctions relief, would be the best option for a peaceful, diplomatic resolution to the nuclear negotiations with Iran.

Read more: US Military Threats Toward Iran Do Not Work - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East


hi every one,
I'm from Iran, interested in politics and i was wondering what's your comments and ideas about this issue, specially on this article.

 

[quantumechanic]

Summary :
Mousavian and ShahidSaless write that demonstrating good will, such as sanctions relief, would be the best option for a peaceful, diplomatic resolution to the nuclear negotiations with Iran.

Read more: US Military Threats Toward Iran Do Not Work - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East


hi every one,
I'm from Iran, interested in politics and i was wondering what's your comments and ideas about this issue, specially on this article.

The world objected to Iran's nuclear plan, Iran ignored the objection. The world continued to object and threatened sanctions, Iran ignored the threats. The world objected, threatened and gave an ultimatum, yet Iran ignored the ultimatum. The world started economic sanctions, Iran ignored them. The world continued the sanctions and threatened to worsen them, yet Iran kept going. The world worsened the sanctions and threatened with military action, yet Iran is still ignoring the threats.
"Showing benevolence" (as the article puts it) to Iran is about as stupid as ceding territory to Hitler was under the Munich Agreement.

 

[ilia786]

The world objected to Iran's nuclear plan, Iran ignored the objection. The world continued to object and threatened sanctions, Iran ignored the threats. The world objected, threatened and gave an ultimatum, yet Iran ignored the ultimatum. The world started economic sanctions, Iran ignored them. The world continued the sanctions and threatened to worsen them, yet Iran kept going. The world worsened the sanctions and threatened with military action, yet Iran is still ignoring the threats.
"Showing benevolence" (as the article puts it) to Iran is about as stupid as ceding territory to Hitler was under the Munich Agreement.

i don't know if you read the article or not, but i quote an important part of it:

In early April’s talks in Almaty, Iran rejected the P5+1 proposal. Iranians argued that Iran’s commitment to world powers’ demand for maximum level of transparency assuring no nuclear breakout capability should be rewarded by both respecting Iran’s fundamental Iran’s rights to peaceful enrichment under the NPT as well as a sanctions relief. Such rational argument should not be responded by threatening Iran with military attacks. While talks are heading toward a rational direction persistently threatening Iran with military attacks only helps to derail the current momentum, thus solidifying the impasse.

and after that, the article shows that this approach toward Iran never gonna work and furthermore it gives you some evidences and facts to support its arguments.
the main question of this article is if west is looking for a solution about this issue or wanted to attacked Iran. if west is looking for a peaceful solution the article shows that current behavior of west doesn't work.and if west is looking for war against Iran article suggest some reassessment of its results.

 

[ido_]

hi every one,
I'm from Iran, interested in politics and i was wondering what's your comments and ideas about this issue, specially on this article.

:wcm
Nice to have an Iranian on this board.

Summary :
Mousavian and ShahidSaless write that demonstrating good will, such as sanctions relief, would be the best option for a peaceful, diplomatic resolution to the nuclear negotiations with Iran.

Read more: US Military Threats Toward Iran Do Not Work - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East

Sound pretty much like the folks who said that if you'll give Hitler Czechoslovakia there will be peace for a hundred years :shrug:

 

[ilia786]

:wcm
Nice to have an Iranian on this board.



Sound pretty much like the folks who said that if you'll give Hitler Czechoslovakia there will be peace for a hundred years :shrug:

nice to meet an Israeli :2wave:
i was looking for a better argument, i pretty sure you haven't read the article. i don't see any similarities between these situations.

was Hitler looking to have Czechoslovakia under the NPT fundamental rights?

 

[ido_]

nice to meet an Israeli :2wave:
i was looking for a better argument, i pretty sure you haven't read the article. i don't see any similarities between these situations.

was Hitler looking to have Czechoslovakia under the NPT fundamental rights?

Iran has been violating the NPT at the past by hiding some of her installations and was caught lying by the west's intelligence services, all over the years she never showed good faith in regards of her nuclear program, why should she be trusted by the world?

And as an Israeli I might add that Iran has been the largest sponsor of terrorist activity in my country and Iranian leaders have been using militaristic rhetoric against my country for ages, why should we trust Iran's intentions when Iran is not showing any good faith in regards of her nuclear program?

 

[ilia786]

Iran has been violating the NPT at the past by hiding some of her installations and was caught lying by the west's intelligence services, all over the years she never showed good faith in regards of her nuclear program, why should she be trusted by the world?

She?!
OK, i agree with you in hiding, but has those installations any connection to military purposes? NO! gimme one official evidence about nuclear activity of Iran regarding to military purposes. CIA recently report: No proof' of Iran nuclear arms

And as an Israeli I might add that Iran has been the largest sponsor of terrorist activity in my country and Iranian leaders have been using militaristic rhetoric against my country for ages, why should we trust Iran's intentions when Iran is not showing any good faith in regards of her nuclear program?

i don't wanna change the topic, so i maybe talk about this issue later in another topic. but instead of "Iran support terrorists" you can read that "Iran supports Hamas and Hezbollah" both parties are legal, popular and self-defending in their country. see Assange interview with leader of Hezbollah Lebanon Seyd Hassan Nasrollah

The Hezbollah party is currently a member of the Lebanese government.

 

[American]

She?!
OK, i agree with you in hiding, but has those installations any connection to military purposes? NO! gimme one official evidence about nuclear activity of Iran regarding to military purposes. CIA recently report: No proof' of Iran nuclear arms



i don't wanna change the topic, so i maybe talk about this issue later in another topic. but instead of "Iran support terrorists" you can read that "Iran supports Hamas and Hezbollah" both parties are legal, popular and self-defending in their country. see Assange interview with leader of Hezbollah Lebanon Seyd Hassan Nasrollah

Assange, really? They've been firing rockets into Israel for a long time. What kind of Iranian defensive posture is this?

 

[ilia786]

Assange, really? They've been firing rockets into Israel for a long time. What kind of Iranian defensive posture is this?

as they have been attacked by Israel army, Apache helicopters, F18 & f32 fighter, M4 & M16 rifle and other super-modern weapons. so they answer them with hand-made rockets, do you think it is too much?!

 

[mbig]

Summary :
Mousavian and ShahidSaless write that demonstrating good will, such as sanctions relief, would be the best option for a peaceful, diplomatic resolution to the nuclear negotiations with Iran.

Read more: US Military Threats Toward Iran Do Not Work - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East

hi every one,
I'm from Iran, interested in politics and i was wondering what's your comments and ideas about this issue, specially on this article.

Welcome to DP.
But it seems you don't have much history working for you on this issue.

Iran has been Stonewalling and delaying the World, not just USA, on this issue.
Iran has been heading for Nuclear weapons capabilities, not just peaceful power for quite a while.

Parallel to the Nukes Program, and also telling, Iran has has been developing Long Range Missile program. Just coincidence I guess.
Not to mention sabre-rattling about the 'illegitimate Zionist entity' and getting rid of it.

Sanctions weren't implemented until after Many years of Insincere negotiating and delay by Iran.
ie, the EU Offered Iran FREE off-site enrichment for peaceful Nukes but Iran refused as this would not allow diversion to a Weapons program.
It's only after all manner of attempts were made that sanctions were put on by the UN.
Sanctions is all the world has short of military attack.

Iran, after all, has arguably, the largest Oil and Gas reserves on the planet and hardly needs Nuclear power.
In fact, Iran routinely runs short of Gasoline because while they have plenty of oil, they have few refineries!
Instead of building these relatively inexpensive and uncontroversial refineries, they spend Billions building Nuclear enrichment installations and thumb their nose at the planet saying they are going to dramatically increase enrichment and centrifuges to a capability Beyond power needs.

You might want to look at my past string:
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middl...ans-tricked-and-misled-us.html#post1059856471

Again, welcome to DP, but this is the West and discussion is wide open here and oft those not use to startling but simple Facts quickly Vanish after being shocked by them after years of posting only on 'home' boards.
Response to my Many points welcome.

An aside but relevant, do you support the little fascist Ahmadinejad? The Mullahs/Supreme leader?

 

[quantumechanic]

Sound pretty much like the folks who said that if you'll give Hitler Czechoslovakia there will be peace for a hundred years :shrug:

That's kinda the point I was making in post #2.

 

[quantumechanic]

i don't know if you read the article or not, but i quote an important part of it:



and after that, the article shows that this approach toward Iran never gonna work and furthermore it gives you some evidences and facts to support its arguments.
the main question of this article is if west is looking for a solution about this issue or wanted to attacked Iran. if west is looking for a peaceful solution the article shows that current behavior of west doesn't work.and if west is looking for war against Iran article suggest some reassessment of its results.

When my wife asks me to do the washing I don't tell her to sod off, I invent a damn good reason as to why I can't.
Similarily, when Iran is asked, nay, compelled, to comply with western demands, they cook up a bs story as to why they shouldn't (and\or can't). This is not an indication of Iran's willingness to comply with western standards. This is an indication that, like me, Iran is intelligent enough to realize that telling people to sod off has repercussions (severe ones, in my case).
Incidentally, as per my previous "Munich Agreement" comparison, Hitler didn't come out and say he was going to torch europe, he said that if the west complied with his demands there'll be peace. That doesn't mean he actually meant what he said...

 

[ilia786]

Welcome to DP.
But it seems you don't have much history working for you on this issue.

Iran has been Stonewalling and delaying the World, not just USA, on this issue.
Iran has been heading for Nuclear weapons capabilities, not just peaceful power for quite a while.

stop right here, i ask before if anyone can show me one single official evidence that support that argument, the truth is there is non! and guess what CIA says that! but western repeat that claim again and again!

Parallel to the Nukes Program, and also telling, Iran has has been developing Long Range Missile program. Just coincidence I guess.

so you suggest Iran should stop all of its military activities during developing nuclear program?! (specially when this country is threatened all the time) sound a little weird to me!

Not to mention sabre-rattling about the 'illegitimate Zionist entity' and getting rid of it.
Sanctions weren't implemented until after Many years of Insincere negotiating and delay by Iran.
ie, the EU Offered Iran FREE off-site enrichment for peaceful Nukes but Iran refused as this would not allow diversion to a Weapons program.
It's only after all manner of attempts were made that sanctions were put on by the UN.
Sanctions is all the world has short of military attack.

Iran, after all, has arguably, the largest Oil and Gas reserves on the planet and hardly needs Nuclear power.
In fact, Iran routinely runs short of Gasoline because while they have plenty of oil, they have few refineries!
Instead of building these relatively inexpensive and uncontroversial refineries, they spend Billions building Nuclear enrichment installations and thumb their nose at the planet saying they are going to dramatically increase enrichment and centrifuges to a capability Beyond power needs.

this is my another favorite quote that westerns repeat: you have the largest oil and gas reserves so why r u looking for Nuclear program!!!
it's like i say: hey Obama, you have enough cars, stop making airplanes or other alternatives!

there is two problem with this arguments,
first i shouldn't think that i can tell Obama what he should do and shouldn't. second it's not just about electricity, it's a whole science that include a vast variety of objects.

You might want to look at my past string:
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middl...ans-tricked-and-misled-us.html#post1059856471

Again, welcome to DP, but this is the West and discussion is wide open here and oft those not use to startling but simple Facts quickly Vanish after being shocked by them after years of posting only on 'home' boards.
Response to my Many points welcome.

An aside but relevant, do you support the little fascist Ahmadinejad? The Mullahs/Supreme leader?

thanks for your warm welcome and i prefer not to answer that irrelevant question. let we discuss our point of view without any perception about each-other.

 

[ilia786]

When my wife asks me to do the washing I don't tell her to sod off, I invent a damn good reason as to why I can't.
Similarily, when Iran is asked, nay, compelled, to comply with western demands, they cook up a bs story as to why they shouldn't (and\or can't). This is not an indication of Iran's willingness to comply with western standards. This is an indication that, like me, Iran is intelligent enough to realize that telling people to sod off has repercussions (severe ones, in my case).
Incidentally, as per my previous "Munich Agreement" comparison, Hitler didn't come out and say he was going to torch europe, he said that if the west complied with his demands there'll be peace. That doesn't mean he actually meant what he said...

this is the point, Iran doesn't comes up with some "damn good reason". Iran argue with its fundamental legal rights under NPT laws recognized with UN.

 

[mbig]

stop right here, i ask before if anyone can show me one single official evidence that support that argument, the truth is there is non! and guess what CIA says that! but western repeat that claim again and again!

Your article was a absurdly Old/obsolete 2006.
Try 2010
CIA: Iran capable of producing nukes - Washington Times
Even worse/surer now. (Recent statement of USA and Israel agreeing)
Ooops!

so you suggest Iran should stop all of its military activities during developing nuclear program?! (specially when this country is threatened all the time) sound a little weird to me!

Not suggesting Iran do anything, just pointing out the development of Nukes AND Missiles is parallel and Ominous.
As well as your Not answering your govt's saber rattling about the Existence of the Zionist entity they wish to end.

this is my another favorite quote that westerns repeat: you have the largest oil and gas reserves so why r u looking for Nuclear program!!!
it's like i say: hey Obama, you have enough cars, stop making airplanes or other alternatives!
there is two problem with this arguments,
first i shouldn't think that i can tell Obama what he should do and shouldn't. second it's not just about electricity, it's a whole science that include a vast variety of objects.

Science?
As I said and You did not/Could not respond, Iran was offered Free enrichment by the EU in order to defuse this issue in accordance with the NPT; peaceful power. They Refused.
Only after years of stonewalling and delay were sanctions voted for by the UN. Even with cheap energy customers/bribees China and Russia on the UNSC.

You also couldn't comment on the Spiegel Interviw/IAEA string I linked to.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middl...ans-tricked-and-misled-us.html#post1059856471

thanks for your warm welcome and i prefer not to answer that irrelevant question. let we discuss our point of view without any perception about each-other.

The question was quite relevant, as those in opposition to a'jad, Mullahs etc, might very well be in opposition to Nukes but couldn't really post at all on Iran's Monitored internet without danger of arrest.
That's why you "choose" not to answer.
That's also a point I wished to demonstrate to the board.
You live in a backwards Fascist Theocratic Police state whose leader thinks the Mahdi is coming (or maybe himself) and these apocalyptic religious Neanderthals shouldn't have their finger on the button.

 

[quantumechanic]

this is the point, Iran doesn't comes up with some "damn good reason". Iran argue with its fundamental legal rights under NPT laws recognized with UN.

When Iran starts complying with the safeguards agreement which they signed (and which is, incidentally, designed to prevent countries from, say, developing nuclear weapons), then they can talk about their "fundamental legal rights under NPT laws".

 

[ido_]

She?!
OK, i agree with you in hiding, but has those installations any connection to military purposes? NO! gimme one official evidence about nuclear activity of Iran regarding to military purposes. CIA recently report: No proof' of Iran nuclear arms

So you agree Iran was violating the NPT, thus the world needed to react with sanctions. Iran has any right to nuclear energy as long as she abides the treaty she signed on, if she violates the treaty, the world has every right to sanction her. Iran's intentions on nuclear weapons is irrelevant here, if Iran hides an enrichment facility from the world, Iran is not to be trusted period, you had your chances to convince the world about your peaceful intentions, you chose deception instead, now pay the consequences, you want to get a second chance? Start playing according to the world's rules rather than expecting it to play according to yours.

i don't wanna change the topic, so i maybe talk about this issue later in another topic. but instead of "Iran support terrorists" you can read that "Iran supports Hamas and Hezbollah" both parties are legal, popular and self-defending in their country. see Assange interview with leader of Hezbollah Lebanon Seyd Hassan Nasrollah

I'm sorry, deliberately targeting mass civilian population is terrorism plain and simple. Hamas is a recognized terrorist organization by both the US and Europe, Hezbollah is a terrorist organization recognized by the US which have been behind the latest attack on Bulgaria, unless you are suggesting that blowing up tourist buses is in anyway "defensive" or that launching an anti tank missile on a school bus is a legitimate "defensive" action those two organizations are terrorist organizations and your country supplies them with arms and funds.

Moreover, the Palestinian organizations your country funds in Gaza breach one cease fire agreement after the other and you claim that Israel is the aggressor?

 

[ilia786]

Your article was a absurdly Old/obsolete 2006.
Try 2010
CIA: Iran capable of producing nukes - Washington Times
Even worse/surer now. (Recent statement of USA and Israel agreeing)
Ooops!

ok, what about this one, 2012: U.S. Agencies See No Move by Iran to Build a Bomb

what do you say about it?

Not suggesting Iran do anything, just pointing out the development of Nukes AND Missiles is parallel and Ominous.

show me ONE SINGLE evidence that Iran is trying to develop nuclear weapon, then tell me that i shouldn't go to gym and study parallel!

As well as your Not answering your govt's saber rattling about the Existence of the Zionist entity they wish to end.

i wish go to moon! so what?! perhaps Christian Ronald wish to end Leonel messi!!!

Science?
As I said and You did not/Could not respond, Iran was offered Free enrichment by the EU in order to defuse this issue in accordance with the NPT; peaceful power. They Refused.
Only after years of stonewalling and delay were sanctions voted for by the UN. Even with cheap energy customers/bribees China and Russia on the UNSC.

You also couldn't comment on the Spiegel Interviw/IAEA string I linked to.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middl...ans-tricked-and-misled-us.html#post1059856471

maybe i do, after i finish this topic, one by one

The question was quite relevant, as those in opposition to a'jad, Mullahs etc, might very well be in opposition to Nukes but couldn't really post at all on Iran's Monitored internet without danger of arrest.
That's why you "choose" not to answer.
That's also a point I wished to demonstrate to the board.
You live in a backwards Fascist Theocratic Police state whose leader thinks the Mahdi is coming (or maybe himself) and these apocalyptic religious Neanderthals shouldn't have their finger on the button.

i don't know if this forum rules let you labeled my country anything as you want, or not. just to know, in past one hundred years Iran never attacked any country, so lets take a look over Israel history and i don't want to start with USA

The Israeli-Palestinian conflict

 

[ilia786]

When Iran starts complying with the safeguards agreement which they signed (and which is, incidentally, designed to prevent countries from, say, developing nuclear weapons), then they can talk about their "fundamental legal rights under NPT laws".

so that's what Iranian say and do, under NPT they can continue they peaceful programs, so they do? have any western find something against that?! guess what? NO
again CIA: U.S. Agencies See No Move by Iran to Build a Bomb

you have some information that CIA have not! that's something els.

 

[ilia786]

So you agree Iran was violating the NPT, thus the world needed to react with sanctions. Iran has any right to nuclear energy as long as she abides the treaty she signed on, if she violates the treaty, the world has every right to sanction her. Iran's intentions on nuclear weapons is irrelevant here, if Iran hides an enrichment facility from the world, Iran is not to be trusted period, you had your chances to convince the world about your peaceful intentions, you chose deception instead, now pay the consequences, you want to get a second chance? Start playing according to the world's rules rather than expecting it to play according to yours.

no i don't agree, Iran signed NPT after the country revealed its nuclear installations. so Iran has right to continue its ordinary nuclear program. and after that, just in case you are from Israel, your country signed "Non-Proliferation Treaty" NPT? i guess not, your country is trying to make nuclear bomb? i guess not because she has already enough.

so let me see this clear, a country that doesn't signed NPT and has many nuclear bombs and refuses to open its facilities to international inspection SAYS that another country that signed NPT and all its facilities are under IAEA's cameras, and yet there is no one single evidence of deviance SHOULD NOT HAVE ORDINARY NUCLEAR PROGRAM?!

what is it, a comedy?

I'm sorry, deliberately targeting mass civilian population is terrorism plain and simple. Hamas is a recognized terrorist organization by both the US and Europe, Hezbollah is a terrorist organization recognized by the US which have been behind the latest attack on Bulgaria, unless you are suggesting that blowing up tourist buses is in anyway "defensive" or that launching an anti tank missile on a school bus is a legitimate "defensive" action those two organizations are terrorist organizations and your country supplies them with arms and funds.

Moreover, the Palestinian organizations your country funds in Gaza breach one cease fire agreement after the other and you claim that Israel is the aggressor?

lets stay in our discussion title, just check this link and judge yourself.
The Israeli-Palestinian conflict

 

[mbig]

ok, what about this one, 2012: U.S. Agencies See No Move by Iran to Build a Bomb
what do you say about it?

Let's read it!

"....In Senate testimony on Jan. 31, James R. Clapper Jr., the director of national intelligence, stated explicitly that American officials believe that Iran is preserving its options for a nuclear weapon, but said there was no evidence that it had made a decision on making a concerted push to build a weapon."...

“They are certainly moving on that path, but we don’t believe they have actually made the decision to go ahead with a nuclear weapon,” Mr. Clapper told the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence.

Critics of the American assessment in Jerusalem and some European capitals point out that Iran has made great strides in the most difficult step toward building a nuclear weapon, enriching uranium. That has also been the conclusion of a series of reports by the International Atomic Energy Agency’s inspectors, who on Friday presented new evidence that the Iranians have begun enriching uranium in an underground facility.

Once Iran takes further steps to actually enrich weapons grade fuel — a feat that the United States does not believe Iran has yet accomplished — the critics believe that it would be relatively easy for Iran to engineer a warhead and then have a bomb in short order. They also criticize the C.I.A. for being overly cautious in its assessments of Iran, suggesting that it is perhaps overcompensating for its faulty intelligence assessments in 2002 about Iraq’s purported weapons programs, which turned out not to exist."..."

So Iran continues "along the path" .. to weapons.
More below.

show me ONE SINGLE evidence that Iran is trying to develop nuclear weapon, then tell me that i shouldn't go to gym and study parallel!

There's Every evidence that Iran is proceeding toward Nuclear Weapon Capability.
Iran has been hiding it's facilities from the world and IAEA inspectors.
Iran refused Free Enrichment from the EU because it would not allow them to Divert fissionable material. (You have yet to answer TWO Postings of this Fact)
Can we see into facilities 100 feet underground to see IF they are producing an actual weapon? No. That's a strawman argument.
What we do know is they continue in That direction/"path"/capability

i wish go to moon! so what?! perhaps Christian Ronald wish to end Leonel messi!!!

It all has to be looked at IN CONTEXT.
Not separated into nonsensical un-whole thoughts by you.
That context is:
Nuclear Capability, Missile/deliver capability, Intent/Israel elimination statements. Together.

You also couldn't comment on the Spiegel Interviw/IAEA string I linked to.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middl...ans-tricked-and-misled-us.html#post1059856471

maybe i do, after i finish this topic, one by one

Let me help as you it is Very relevant to our discussion. Or perhaps you did read and it cant respond.

[......]
SPIEGEL: You sound worried. Is Tehran really on a direct path to becoming a nuclear state?
Heinonen: It's undeniable that Iran's nuclear program is far more advanced than it was in 2003, when the discovery of the Natanz facility brought it to the IAEA's attention. At the time, uranium enrichment tests were being carried out in secret on a small scale. But at the end of 2003, the Iranians admitted they were also planning to set up a heavy-water reactor in Arak to generate Plutonium.

SPIEGEL: In other words, the other ingredient you need to create either nuclear power or an atom bomb.
Heinonen: Iran always told us it was only interested in the civilian uses of atomic energy. I've always had my doubts about that, more so now than ever.

SPIEGEL: Why don't you say what your former boss, Mohamed ElBaradei, said: That you haven't found the so-called "smoking gun" -- i.e. clear proof that Iran is developing nuclear weapons?
Heinonen: Before opponents of the Iranian regime exposed the existence of Natanz, those in power in Tehran had kept parts of their nuclear program secret for two decades.
Today the facts are as follows: The conversion plant in Isfahan has produced 371 tons of uranium hexafluoride. Some 8,000 centrifuges in Natanz are being used to enrich this raw material. In February 2010, Iran began increasing enrichment to 20%. That's a significant step closer to making an atomic bomb because it takes only a few months to turn that into weapons-grade material. And at the beginning of this year, Fereydoun Abbasi was appointed the head of the atomic energy organization in Tehran ...

SPIEGEL: ... a scientist who has been on a UN list of suspected bombmakers since 2007, whom a UN Security Council resolution forbids from traveling abroad, and who just barely survived an assassination attempt in Tehran 10 months ago suspected to have been carried out by the Israeli secret service.
Heinonen: In early June, Abbasi announced that Iran was moving the 20% enrichment of uranium from Natanz to Fordow, where they are Tripling production. Incidentally, the construction of the Fordow plant near Qom was so shrouded in secrecy that the Iranian authorities first admitted it existed less than two years ago.

SPIEGEL: And none of this makes sense for a civilian nuclear program?
Heinonen: You don't need 20% enriched uranium to generate electricity for light bulbs.".."
[......]

i don't know if this forum rules let you labeled my country anything as you want, or not. just to know, in past one hundred years Iran never attacked any country, so lets take a look over Israel history and i don't want to start with USA

I can say ANYTHING I like about your leaders or country. We are free to speak here. In fact, People of this country do it here even to their own leaders and country. I cannot insult you personally.
I have posted on 'Shiachat' with several IDs, where insulting mad dog ahmadinJihad will get you chucked.

And of course, that doesn't address the truth of the matter at all. Like most of your avoidances/deflections.
You avoid the Fact (couldn't reply) your Wack Job/Mahdi President and Mullah/Supreme leader.
Your country IS a theocracy with religious police and a 'Supreme' Leader' who is a Mullah.
Your country monitors internet use/users which is why anyone who wasn't in 100% agreement would "choose" not to comment. I understand.

[URL="http://www.ifamericansknew.org/" he Israeli-Palestinian conflict[/URL]

This is complete Bullcrap propagabda from an anti-Israel website and an utterly OFF TOPIC Juvenile reply, striking out at a perceived enemy.
Derailing your own string, no less, with any anti-Israel spaghetti. How sad but predictable and telling for everyone else here.
Should you wish to discuss that conflict there are plenty of extant strings or feel free to start another.

 

[quantumechanic]

so that's what Iranian say and do, under NPT they can continue they peaceful programs, so they do? have any western find something against that?! guess what? NO
again CIA: U.S. Agencies See No Move by Iran to Build a Bomb

you have some information that CIA have not! that's something els.

How is anything you said (albeit incoherently) even remotely relevant to the fact that Iran is in violation of its safeguards agreement?

 

[ilia786]

Let's read it!
So Iran continues "along the path" .. to weapons.
More below.

what's that mean? you are on the path?! you are trying to make nuclear weapon or you not! there is no evidence related to military activities BUT they are on the path?! surely?! sorry, i learned in school to believe statements that are supported by the facts not imaginary prediction!

There's Every evidence that Iran is proceeding toward Nuclear Weapon Capability.
Iran has been hiding it's facilities from the world and IAEA inspectors.

ok, show me one of them. hiding which facilities?! facilities related to military fields or peaceful ones?! sure peaceful ones!!! this is your strong fact?!

Iran refused Free Enrichment from the EU because it would not allow them to Divert fissionable material. (You have yet to answer TWO Postings of this Fact)

under NPT rules Iran has rights of Enrichment. so what's the problem? is it strange for a country to use its international legal rights recognizes with UN?!

Can we see into facilities 100 feet underground to see IF they are producing an actual weapon? No. That's a strawman argument.
What we do know is they continue in That direction/"path"/capability

so you have not even one single evidence related to military purposes. what's that mean we do know path, direction and ect! so i see American path to eat the earth?! what is that even mean? do u have any facts for that claim?! none again!

It all has to be looked at IN CONTEXT.
Not separated into nonsensical un-whole thoughts by you.
That context is:
Nuclear Capability, Missile/deliver capability, Intent/Israel elimination statements. Together.

as i argue before, see in context, a guy who go to gym and eat maybe wants to be strong enough to do some actions in some devil Intent you are aware of!!!
so you suggest this guy should chose between going to gym or eating?!

Let me help as you it is Very relevant to our discussion. Or perhaps you did read and it cant respond.

no i don't, we start that one as soon as we finished this.

I can say ANYTHING I like about your leaders or country. We are free to speak here. In fact, People of this country do it here even to their own leaders and country. I cannot insult you personally.

insulting a country is the same as insulting its people. a grownup talks is where people argue with facts and evidence not with slander and labeling others.

I have posted on 'Shiachat' with several IDs, where insulting mad dog ahmadinJihad will get you chucked.

And of course, that doesn't address the truth of the matter at all. Like most of your avoidances/deflections.
You avoid the Fact (couldn't reply) your Wack Job/Mahdi President and Mullah/Supreme leader.
Your country IS a theocracy with religious police and a 'Supreme' Leader' who is a Mullah.
Your country monitors internet use/users which is why anyone who wasn't in 100% agreement would "choose" not to comment. I understand.

you watch FOX NEWS a lot!

This is complete Bullcrap propagabda from an anti-Israel website and an utterly OFF TOPIC Juvenile reply, striking out at a perceived enemy.
Derailing your own string, no less, with any anti-Israel spaghetti. How sad but predictable and telling for everyone else here.
Should you wish to discuss that conflict there are plenty of extant strings or feel free to start another.

if click on any of those numbers, it gives you the sources. anyway you think in The Israeli-Palestinian conflict more Israelis died?! have any sources?

i suggest again, if you are looking for a conclusion from this discussion and not just proving your various points that hardly are connected to each other, lets talk about the article i posted in topic and its statements. we can talk about other issues you interested in, in new topics.

 

[Fallenangel]

if click on any of those numbers, it gives you the sources. anyway you think in The Israeli-Palestinian conflict more Israelis died?! have any sources?

i suggest again, if you are looking for a conclusion from this discussion and not just proving your various points that hardly are connected to each other, lets talk about the article i posted in topic and its statements. we can talk about other issues you interested in, in new topics.

Hey,
I think you should look at a thread i started about the "facts" on that site, if you would look closely at the sources and the information it is not as "one sided" as you may think it is.
Plus, it is always better to actually provide references from the actual original sources and not from sites that cite these sources to create their own information and statistics.

Cheers,
Fallen.

 

[ilia786]

How is anything you said (albeit incoherently) even remotely relevant to the fact that Iran is in violation of its safeguards agreement?

CIA official report that note there is no evidence in Iran nuclear program connected with military issues is remotely relevant to your claim as "developing nuclear weapons"!!! what are you looking for so?!