"unpatriotic" Israelis could lose citizenship

[Red_Dave]

Israeli Knesset approves preliminary proposal to revoke citizenship of `unpatriotic` Israelis - IMEMC

 

[cherokee]

Israeli Knesset approves preliminary proposal to revoke citizenship of `unpatriotic` Israelis - IMEMC

Did you see the other story...................:roll:
Who runs this site?

The American proxy war in Gaza - IMEMC

The American proxy war in Gaza

In the fevered minds of Bush administration ideologues, Palestine has become another front in what they conceive of as a new Cold War against "Islamofascism." They see Iran as the central target and proxy battles are being waged against a phantom enemy from Afghanistan and Pakistan, through Iraq into Palestine, Lebanon, Somalia and ever onwards wherever Arabs and Muslims are to be found. In every case, local conflicts with specific histories are being escalated and marshalled into this grand narrative .

 

[Jenin]

They want to expel the remaining arabs from the 1948 nakbah.

 

[Makhno]

They're only in the OT for "self defence" . . . seeing that Israeli Arabs are peaceful I wonder what catagory they would come under? "freedom of speach threat", "being brown and/or Muslim" perhaps?:roll:

It's disgusting how these Arabs try to undermine the Middle East's only democracy.

 

[The face of Jacob]

What an excellent and wonderful news!

All the Israelis support this move, and not only that but most of the Israelis support the idea that the Israeli Arabs will leave Israel:

A total of 62 percent of Israelis want the government to encourage local Arabs to leave the country, according to the 2006 democracy index released Tuesday by the Israel Democracy Institute.

Only 14 percent of respondents said ties between Arabs and Jews are good, while 29 percent said a Jewish majority is required for decisions of crucial national significance. Full article inside

And the important thing that should be said here is that this poll was done amongst of Israeli citizens, and Jews in Israel are less than 80% so it goes that if this poll was done only amongst Jewish people that it would be greater than 62%

You Europeans don't undestand one important thing:

It's not that the Israeli Arabs are unpatriotic. It's that most of them are against the state. Did you hear that? Against the state! There's a big difference if you are unpatriotic and if you are against your state.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middle-east/17238-aspiration-arab-citizens-israel.html

Here is what a minister in the government had to say about it:

I'm not surprised by the Arab Knesset members' refusal to sign a letter by Knesset Speaker Dalia Itzik calling on parliament speakers across the world to do their utmost in an effort to elicit a sign of life from the kidnapped IDF soldiers.

This is a symptom of the helplessness displayed by the State of Israel, its legal system, and even its legislature in the face of an effort to undermine the foundations of the Jewish-democratic state, undertaken through the utilization of our liberal democracy and political culture.

The State of Israel is home to a significant population sector whose identity stems from an aspiration to bring about the State of Israel's destruction.

This group has succeeded in turning the values of democracy against itself, as a sort of self-destruct mechanism. This group's members accept Israeli citizenship but their loyalty lies with another people.

They support Hizbullah and Hamas, but are willing to receive medical treatment and social insurance payments from the State when they're hurt in attacks by the very same terror groups. They take part in elections but send to the Knesset members whose job is to undermine it. Full article inside

I would like to see that face of CC when he will read that most of the Israelis want that Israeli citizens from Arab origin (who define themselves as "Palestinians who are citizens of Israel", by the way...) to leave the country. I'm sure that he will say that they are all "extremists". No wonder why he will say that. He doesn't live with Arabs (and why would he anyway?), and let's see what he will say when he will live with them...

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

What an excellent and wonderful news!

All the Israelis support this move, and not only that but most of the Israelis support the idea that the Israeli Arabs will leave Israel:



And the important thing that should be said here is that this poll was done amongst of Israeli citizens, and Jews in Israel are less than 80% so it goes that if this poll was done only amongst Jewish people that it would be greater than 62%

You Europeans don't undestand one important thing:

It's not that the Israeli Arabs are unpatriotic. It's that most of them are against the state. Did you hear that? Against the state! There's a big difference if you are unpatriotic and if you are against your state.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middle-east/17238-aspiration-arab-citizens-israel.html

Here is what a minister in the government had to say about it:



I would like to see that face of CC when he will read that most of the Israelis want that Israeli citizens from Arab origin (who define themselves as "Palestinians who are citizens of Israel", by the way...) to leave the country. I'm sure that he will say that they are all "extremists". No wonder why he will say that. He doesn't live with Arabs (and why would he anyway?), and let's see what he will say when he will live with them...

You know, Jacob, I welcomed you back, even though you promised to not return until I left (and I'm still here), I've been cordial to you, and supported and thanked a couple of your posts since your return. And now, you are calling me out, on a thread that I am not even involved in. I find that classless, demeaning, and insulting behavior. You have made this personal in the past, and now, unprovoked, are doing it again. I would request that, if you intend on continuing to place my name in threads that I am not part of, that, instead, you PM me.

As for the post, I will say this, and only this. I understand the feelings and behaviors of the Israel people, considering the violence against them and the security concerns in their own country. That doesn't justify, what seems to be laws intended to, potentially, oust all Israeli Arabs from Israel. This would go against one of the most important parts of the Israeli position of the UN Partition Plan of 1947. It is a key piece that separates the Israeli's from the Palestinians...the desire to live together peacably. I believe the numbers you quoted, Jacob...I researched them myself. I can understand why Israeli's feel that way. Doesn't mean that it doesn't seem to go against what Israel stands for.

And next time, PM me, instead.

 

[The face of Jacob]

You know, Jacob, I welcomed you back, even though you promised to not return until I left (and I'm still here), I've been cordial to you, and supported and thanked a couple of your posts since your return. And now, you are calling me out, on a thread that I am not even involved in. I find that classless, demeaning, and insulting behavior. You have made this personal in the past, and now, unprovoked, are doing it again. I would request that, if you intend on continuing to place my name in threads that I am not part of, that, instead, you PM me.

I don't know why you wrote this. It seems that you got offended while I don't see any reason you should. I guess it's o.k for you to call others in names like you did to me when you called me 'extremist' with no reason why you should do it (I think it was a very dumb thing to do) but you get offended when I ask your opinion to a post I make. I don't remember that I called you in names in my post. And I came back because I needed to send pm to someone and to correct Jenin when he said that there is no instigation to kill Jews in the Quran and in the Hadith. I corrected him and by the way did couple of posts.

As for the post, I will say this, and only this. I understand the feelings and behaviors of the Israel people, considering the violence against them and the security concerns in their own country. That doesn't justify, what seems to be laws intended to, potentially, oust all Israeli Arabs from Israel. This would go against one of the most important parts of the Israeli position of the UN Partition Plan of 1947. It is a key piece that separates the Israeli's from the Palestinians...the desire to live together peacably. I believe the numbers you quoted, Jacob...I researched them myself. I can understand why Israeli's feel that way. Doesn't mean that it doesn't seem to go against what Israel stands for.

And next time, PM me, instead.

The Israelis should be seperated from the Arabs who call themselves "Palestinians". They will never could be able to live together cause they can't live together. You can't live together with someone who don't recognise in your right to live. Even today the Israelis and the Palestinian citizens of Israel don't live together. They live in different cities and in different zones. 50 years from now the situation will be different when they will be more than they are now.

The Israelis should live alone. The Israelis should be seperated from the other nations cause if not then they will be no Israeli nation. Even in USA (ðéùåàéí îòåøáéí éåöøéí ùðé òîéí éäåãééí - ååàìä! çãùåú) there is an assimilation that 43% of the Jews in America marry non Jews.

"and have set you apart from the nations, that ye should be Mine."

"and ye shall be unto Me a kingdom of priests, and a holy nation."

And to I want to tell you things that you didn't know: The UN never decided to establish a Palestinian state. Never! He decided to give the west bank to Jordan and the Gaza strip to Egypt. Both these countries have lost these places and don't want them at all.

You are wrong in your opinions to connect the Israelis and the Palestinians, and these dreams have cost many murdered Israelis. I hope that instead of trying to change our enemies, you should change yourself and get back to your origins and to who you should be.

It's funny but I don't even know where you live. I think it's very odd that you are trying to preach us how to behave with our enemies let alone to give us advices.

In the upcoming weeks there will be many Palestinian supporters that will come to this forum. And they won't be alone. Even now there are lot's of Europeans in here who support them (and it won't be a mistake to say that they support them because they hate Israel and they hate Jews). I will be offline and will let you to debate with them. They will prove to you that as much as you will try to abandon your history and as much as you will continue to see in the UN the "savior" of Israel - then as much as they will be against you so in the end you will have to face with the truth and the truth of the Jews.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

I don't know why you wrote this. It seems that you got offended while I don't see any reason you should. I guess it's o.k for you to call others in names like you did to me when you called me 'extremist' with no reason why you should do it (I think it was a very dumb thing to do) but you get offended when I ask your opinion to a post I make. I don't remember that I called you in names in my post. And I came back because I needed to send pm to someone and to correct Jenin when he said that there is no instigation to kill Jews in the Quran and in the Hadith. I corrected him and by the way did couple of posts.

I wrote this because your post was an obvious attempt to try to taunt me for no apparent reason. I was not involved in the thread, and therefore there was no need to call me into it. You are obviously still harboring issues around our past discussions. As I said, if you want to address this, PM me.

The Israelis should be seperated from the Arabs who call themselves "Palestinians". They will never could be able to live together cause they can't live together. You can't live together with someone who don't recognise in your right to live. Even today the Israelis and the Palestinian citizens of Israel don't live together. They live in different cities and in different zones. 50 years from now the situation will be different when they will be more than they are now.

I agree, two groups cannot live together if one's intent is to destroy the other. If you'd pay attention to my posts, I've been saying this as a refutation for the 'right of return' argument. If Palestinians cannot 'live in peace with their neighbors', right of return does not need to be granted. I've been saying this for a while, now.

The Israelis should live alone. The Israelis should be seperated from the other nations cause if not then they will be no Israeli nation. Even in USA (ðéùåàéí îòåøáéí éåöøéí ùðé òîéí éäåãééí - ååàìä! çãùåú) there is an assimilation that 43% of the Jews in America marry non Jews.

This is a point where you and I disagree. I see this kind of isolationism as, potentially, leading to xenophobia and extremism. I understand the desire for protection. I just see this as leading to the same exclusionary situation that some Arabs/Muslims want.

And to I want to tell you things that you didn't know: The UN never decided to establish a Palestinian state. Never! He decided to give the west bank to Jordan and the Gaza strip to Egypt. Both these countries have lost these places and don't want them at all.

You are totally wrong on this. Read up on the UN Partition Plan and it's ratification.

Here's a good starting link: A/364 of 3 September 1947

You are wrong in your opinions to connect the Israelis and the Palestinians, and these dreams have cost many murdered Israelis. I hope that instead of trying to change our enemies, you should change yourself and get back to your origins and to who you should be.

Don't agree. I believe that, if desired, people can live together. I would agree that the desire seems absent. My desire to connect these two people in peace is not wrong.

It's funny but I don't even know where you live. I think it's very odd that you are trying to preach us how to behave with our enemies let alone to give us advices.

Where I live is irrelevant, but you know I live in the US and not in Israel...I've stated that much, before. I have not preached. I am expressing opinions and viewpoints. You don't agree with them.

In the upcoming weeks there will be many Palestinian supporters that will come to this forum. And they won't be alone. Even now there are lot's of Europeans in here who support them (and it won't be a mistake to say that they support them because they hate Israel and they hate Jews). I will be offline and will let you to debate with them. They will prove to you that as much as you will try to abandon your history and as much as you will continue to see in the UN the "savior" of Israel - then as much as they will be against you so in the end you will have to face with the truth and the truth of the Jews.

I again ask you to pay attention to my posts. I think anyone who has posted with/against me at DP knows that I am decidedly pro-Israel. I have engaged Palestinian and European posters who, unfairly and ridiculously, claim that Israel is soley to blame for the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. That does not mean I am anti-Palestinian; I am pro-Israel. Yet what I bolded above speaks volumes. You, again, convertly insult my religious/ethnic background. This anger towards me, based, IMO, predominantly on the fact that I, as a Jew, do not dogmatically agree with everything you say, no matter what, has blinded you to that fact that you and I agree, probably, 90% of the time.

Instead of doing what you are doing, I, again, encourage you to PM me with your issues.

 

[Doremus Jessup]

And to I want to tell you things that you didn't know: The UN never decided to establish a Palestinian state. Never! He decided to give the west bank to Jordan and the Gaza strip to Egypt. Both these countries have lost these places and don't want them at all.

Damn, your schools must be just as bad as those in the States. :lol:

 

[The face of Jacob]

Damn, your schools must be just as bad as those in the States. :lol:

Next you will be telling me that the UN, in the times that it was managered by former Nazi Kourt Valdhaim, never declared that Zionism is racism...

Piss off, young man! You can't teach us anything!

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Next you will be telling me that the UN, in the times that it was managered by former Nazi Kourt Valdhaim, never declared that Zionism is racism...

Piss off, young man! You can't teach us anything!

The UN decided to devide "Palestine" to two parts:
1. A Jewish state.
2. To give the West Bank to Jordan and to give Gaza to Egypt.

Moderator's Warning:

In bold. Please don't do that Jacob.

Respectfully, you're wrong, as I posted, previously. The UN decided to divide 'Palestine' into two parts:
1. A Jewish State.
2. An Arab State.

Jordan and Egypt had already been established. Jordan had been formed out of the Transjordan territory of the Brittish Mandate in 1946 and Egypt had gained independance from Great Birtain in 1922. The West Bank was always to be part of the Arab State, as was Gaza.

Links for this post:

Egypt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jordan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
1947 UN Partition Plan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
A/364 of 3 September 1947

 

[The face of Jacob]

Moderator's Warning:

In bold. Please don't do that Jacob.

Respectfully, you're wrong, as I posted, previously. The UN decided to divide 'Palestine' into two parts:
1. A Jewish State.
2. An Arab State.

Jordan and Egypt had already been established. Jordan had been formed out of the Transjordan territory of the Brittish Mandate in 1946 and Egypt had gained independance from Great Birtain in 1922. The West Bank was always to be part of the Arab State, as was Gaza.

Links for this post:

Egypt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jordan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
1947 UN Partition Plan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
A/364 of 3 September 1947

The best answer will be the one of Ben Gurion: "Um shmum"

To quote another historical leader: "um shmum." "Um" represents the acronym in Hebrew for United Nations and "shmum" is a dismissive retort.

Occupation schmoccupation

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

The best answer will be the one of Ben Gurion: "Um shmum"

Occupation schmoccupation

Read the article. I agree with it. Doesn't have anything to do with my previous post, though.

 

[Red_Dave]

What an excellent and wonderful news!

All the Israelis support this move, and not only that but most of the Israelis support the idea that the Israeli Arabs will leave Israel:



And the important thing that should be said here is that this poll was done amongst of Israeli citizens, and Jews in Israel are less than 80% so it goes that if this poll was done only amongst Jewish people that it would be greater than 62%

You Europeans don't undestand one important thing:

It's not that the Israeli Arabs are unpatriotic. It's that most of them are against the state. Did you hear that? Against the state! There's a big difference if you are unpatriotic and if you are against your state.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/middle-east/17238-aspiration-arab-citizens-israel.html

Here is what a minister in the government had to say about it:



I would like to see that face of CC when he will read that most of the Israelis want that Israeli citizens from Arab origin (who define themselves as "Palestinians who are citizens of Israel", by the way...) to leave the country. I'm sure that he will say that they are all "extremists". No wonder why he will say that. He doesn't live with Arabs (and why would he anyway?), and let's see what he will say when he will live with them...

What you,ve heard in this post is the blatent and vocal support of the Isreali right for what is effectively an ethnic cleansing campain. If you removed the terms "isreali arab" and inserted "kosovar albanian". You would end up with arguments similar to those used by slobodan milosevic.This begs the question of why the isreali right are not being dealt with in a similar fashion to others of there ilk.

 

[Volker]

What you,ve heard in this post is the blatent and vocal support of the Isreali right for what is effectively an ethnic cleansing campain. If you removed the terms "isreali arab" and inserted "kosovar albanian". You would end up with arguments similar to those used by slobodan milosevic.This begs the question of why the isreali right are not being dealt with in a similar fashion to others of there ilk.

Now here we have more of this The Hague show trial nonsense about so-called ethnical cleansings in the Kosovo.

 

[Red_Dave]

Now here we have more of this The Hague show trial nonsense.

Well if you applied any ethnic cleansing campain you deam to be genuine to FOJs post the same principle would apply.

 

[Volker]

Well if you applied any ethnic cleansing campain you deam to be genuine to FOJs post the same principle would apply.

I did see him showing a poll about encouraging Arab Israelis to leave the country. These are 62%, with 20% being Arab Israelis the share is probably higher. I did not know these numbers, but it's interesting and it is not far away from what I would have estimated.

 

[Volker]

The share among the Israelis who are not Arab Israelis is probably higher, this is what I wanted to say

 

[Doremus Jessup]

Next you will be telling me that the UN, in the times that it was managered by former Nazi Kourt Valdhaim, never declared that Zionism is racism...

Piss off, young man! You can't teach us anything!

Whoa buddy, this: :lol:, showed that I was joking. It is understandable that you're jealous that my country was able to put its brown-skinned natives on lockdown. Too bad you guys don't have firewater as an option, but there are always those smallpox blankets. Don't be discouraged though, my tax $$ will still go to your state, and our military will still do your guys' dirty work. :2wave::2razz: :lol:

 

[The face of Jacob]

This group of people should be kicked out of Israel as soon as possible:

'28% of Israel's Arabs deny Holocaust'

More than a quarter of Israel's Arab citizens believe the Holocaust never happened, and nearly two thirds of Israeli Jews avoid entering Arab towns, a poll by an Israeli university showed Sunday, demonstrating the poor state of relations between the two communities.

The poll, conducted by Sami Smoocha, a prominent sociologist at the University of Haifa, showed a wide gap of mistrust, anger and fear between Israel's Jewish and Arab citizens.

In its most dramatic finding, the poll showed that 28 percent of Israeli Arabs did not believe the Holocaust happened, and that among high school and college graduates the figure was even higher - 33 percent.

According to Smoocha's analysis, radicals in the Arab world believe the Holocaust to be a political event, and many feel that by denying it they are expressing opposition to Israel. Full article inside

Half of Israeli Arabs justify Hizbullah kidnapping

Prof Sammy Smooha from Haifa University finds surprising support for Shiite organization among Israeli Arabs. 'The Katyusha rockets endangered them too,' he says

Almost 50 percent of Israeli Arabs justify Hizbullah's kidnapping of soldiers Ehud Goldwasser and Eldad Regev, and 90 percent regard the IDF bombings in Lebanon during the last war as war crimes.

Moreover, the vast majority of Israeli Arabs continues to express anti-Israeli views, showed a survey conducted by Haifa University's Dean of Social Studies Sammy Smooha: Some 48 percent justify the launching of rockets at Israel by Hizbullah during the last war. Only 44 percent thought it was a war crime. Full article inside

 

[Red_Dave]

This group of people should be kicked out of Israel as soon as possible:

And yet you acuse others of racism?:doh

 

[The face of Jacob]

And yet you acuse others of racism?:doh

I'm not a racist nor have I expressed racist comments. You didn't relate to the group of traitors that were described in the 2 quotes that I brought and you didn't condemn them therefore you are a Hizbullah supporter and a holocaust denier.

But what can be the easiest reply of anti-semites like you? The accusations of others in the blood libels of yours and to drag the debate to other places in order to avoid dealing with the main point of posts that you can't compete with.

Well done, dude!

Maybe if you will see the quotes again you will reply to them (I'm doubted)

'28% of Israel's Arabs deny Holocaust'

More than a quarter of Israel's Arab citizens believe the Holocaust never happened, and nearly two thirds of Israeli Jews avoid entering Arab towns, a poll by an Israeli university showed Sunday, demonstrating the poor state of relations between the two communities.

The poll, conducted by Sami Smoocha, a prominent sociologist at the University of Haifa, showed a wide gap of mistrust, anger and fear between Israel's Jewish and Arab citizens.

In its most dramatic finding, the poll showed that 28 percent of Israeli Arabs did not believe the Holocaust happened, and that among high school and college graduates the figure was even higher - 33 percent.

According to Smoocha's analysis, radicals in the Arab world believe the Holocaust to be a political event, and many feel that by denying it they are expressing opposition to Israel. Full article inside

Half of Israeli Arabs justify Hizbullah kidnapping

Prof Sammy Smooha from Haifa University finds surprising support for Shiite organization among Israeli Arabs. 'The Katyusha rockets endangered them too,' he says

Almost 50 percent of Israeli Arabs justify Hizbullah's kidnapping of soldiers Ehud Goldwasser and Eldad Regev, and 90 percent regard the IDF bombings in Lebanon during the last war as war crimes.

Moreover, the vast majority of Israeli Arabs continues to express anti-Israeli views, showed a survey conducted by Haifa University's Dean of Social Studies Sammy Smooha: Some 48 percent justify the launching of rockets at Israel by Hizbullah during the last war. Only 44 percent thought it was a war crime. Full article inside

 

[Tashah]

Al tirah avdi Yaakov.

 

[The face of Jacob]

Al tirah avdi Yaakov.

 

[GarzaUK]

If this is true, this is scary. Forcably moving a population from their homes outside acorss borders according to their ethnicity. It smacks of the Balkans. In fact didn't the Nazis try and to that to you guys before the mass slaughter of the camps. Sweet Jesus Man. The white people in South Africa, or the British in Northern Ireland didn't try that kind of c**p.