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Unintended consequences of attacking PP. [W:800, 1034]

Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

JayDubya said:
Agreed. And if a man or a woman decides to do terrible things that harm others, they should pay the consequences for their deliberate action.
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Thank you for your opinion... :shrug:

To refresh your memory, the pro life males in this thread are telling women when to have sex, when to not have sex, when to birth a child and not. That goes beyond the abortion is murder slogan.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

mac said:
I haven't missed anything, it's simply failed logic.
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Only because you refuse to accept responsibility for your actions.

If you don't want to be solely responsible for a 6 month old baby then keep your penis in your pants.
 
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Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

mac said:
You can make human males gestate?
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We can stop a woman's body from accepting attachment, or rejecting attachment after the fact.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

SheWolf said:
To refresh your memory, the pro life males in this thread are telling women when to have sex, when to not have sex, when to birth a child and not.
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All I've seen us say that you shouldn't have sex if you can't deal with the consequences responsibly. Have all the sex you want, just don't kill an innocent because you can't deal.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

choiceone said:
Women do not reach their sexual peak until past 35. They don't have the same issues as men. So if all the women in the US decide it's a good idea to abstain, they will not suffer. Too bad for the guys.
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That's a funny point.

But in reality, if all women abstained for sex the occurrence of rape and rape rates would go sky high... Also, men would act like they do in prison, and they would start having sex with each other.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

SheWolf said:
That's a funny point.

But in reality, if all women abstained for sex the occurrence of rape and rape rates would go sky high... Also, men would act like they do in prison, and they would start having sex with each other.
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Hey, I wouldn't! That's what Internet p0rn is for!

But there are plenty of idiots with no self-control that would go ape-****, you're right about that.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

MoSurveyor said:
Hey, I wouldn't! That's what Internet p0rn is for!

But there are plenty of idiots with no self-control that would go ape-****, you're right about that.
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I wasn't saying all men would do that, but it would be more common and more acceptable for certain men...
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

The only time in history where I remember women practicing abstinence and chastity on a large scale was when they were religious leaders in Goddess cults, in ancient Rome and Greece. At that time, male bisexuality and homosexuality was very common in the military, government, and throughout society. In fact, military men looked at their wives as if they were only meant to have sex with for reproduction only. They spent more time bonding and having sex the men fighting in the military.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

JayDubya said:
Agreed. And if a man or a woman decides to do terrible things that harm others, they should pay the consequences for their deliberate action.
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I agree. Anyone trying to stop a woman from aborting should be dealt with severely.
 
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Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

Scrabaholic said:
Anyone trying to stop a woman from aborting should be deat with severely.
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Well, no, see, that doesn't represent doing anything terrible nor does it do any harm to anyone.

Whereas abortion is undeniably aggressive homicide; its victim innocent, and the harm lethal.


If you think trying to stop someone from a terrible mistake and a moral lapse of the worst kind warrants punishment, then you're kind of warped.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.


Abortion not homicide since the fetus is not a viable human being or a legal person in the eyes of the law. This has been discussed repeatedly and nothing has changed the fact that abortion is legal. Your continued use of the term homicide in regards to abortion is nothing more than flame baiting and against the forum rules.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

Like I said, undeniably.

The killing of any human is a "homicide," as the roots of the word should suggest. "Human being" has no special meaning independent of being a member of Homo sapiens. "Person" means nothing but what the law currently says. Words mean things.



If you want to report my statement of objective fact, by all means, give the moderators a laugh at your expense.
 
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Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

Yes, words mean things and your use of the word homicide is meant to inflame the other posters here. Neither the law or the Bible says abortion is homicide, so I'm asking you real nice to stop it and show the same respect to others opinions as they have more than patiently shown to yours. If not, then I guess we'll see who has the last laugh.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

Moot said:
Yes, words mean things and your use of the word homicide is meant to inflame the other posters here.
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If you choose to get angry at reality, I suggest you choose something more humorous for others, like yelling at clouds.

I think nothing of stating objective fact; you are welcome to your own opinions, but not your own facts. If facts anger you, then that is your problem.

Neither the law or the Bible says abortion is homicide, so I'm asking you real nice to stop it and show the same respect to others opinions as they have more than patiently shown to yours.
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a) The Bible doesn't use the word homicide at all; and this is a secular society with religious freedom anyway, so who cares what the Bible says in terms of this discussion?

b) The law differs widely from place to place, but it defines criminal homicides. Not every homicide is prosecuted. Abortion stands alone as the only aggressive homicide that is not prosecuted. It can not be considered justifiable in the manner that self-defense killing is.

c) No, I won't stop stating the objective fact in question. It isn't out of disrespect - and to be clear, I certainly don't think you deserve much of that - but because objective fact is neutral, the baseline for discussion. You can't even participate in the debate if you're not even oriented to reality and don't understand the terminology and facts under discussion. Earlier you denied that every sexually reproducing organism has a lifespan that begins at fertilization, so you're hardly even deluded on only one objective fact. You just seem to be arguing from your own little alternative dimension and we shouldn't be asserting facts at you lest you take offense. No thanks - that would be doing a disservice to the seriousness of the topic, as well as to you.
 
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Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

JayDubya said:
Well, no, see, that doesn't represent doing anything terrible nor does it do any harm to anyone.
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Au contraire - it represents something quite atrocious.



Whereas abortion is undeniably aggressive homicide; its victim innocent, and the harm lethal.
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Abortion is not homicide, I've proven that. Nobody has been able to prove that something that has never had awareness is harmed in a first trimester abortion.


If you think trying to stop someone from a terrible mistake and a moral lapse of the worst kind warrants punishment, then you're kind of warped.
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Why are you resorting to insults? Are you frustrated at me being right and proving you wrong? I understand, but do try to act like a mature adult, k?
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

Scrabaholic said:
Abortion is not homicide
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Abortion is objectively (1) the initiation of lethal force against (2) a living Homo sapiens, aka a human, aka a human being. The initiation of force - aggression... LETHAL force, aka, killing... the killing of a Homo sapiens, a human...

Homicide: Homo (human) -cide (derivative of CAEDERE, to kill); to kill a human.

Words mean things. Sorry. Your lack of understanding the distinction between murder - a criminal charge for an illegal killing - and a homicide is your own failing.
 
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Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.


Abortions are preformed to remove an embryo or fetus/foetus from the womb. Abortion isn't always nor is it necessarily preformed on living embryo or foeti. If a woman cannot naturally expel a dead fetus or embryo from her body, it's aborted. The medical professional doesn't call it something else, it's still called an abortion. Anembryonic and moral pregnancies are often aborted.

You're simply using your own definition of abortion.
 
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Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.


I agree with your language. I see a fetus as a human being and I see killing it as a form of homicide. However, that doesn't change how I view abortion one way or the other. Abortion is detestable but it is a reality and at times even a necessity. As much as I would like to live in a world where everything is black and white, that is not reality, and that is not a healthy morality.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

JayDubya said:
If you choose to get angry at reality, I suggest you choose something more humorous for others, like yelling at clouds.
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You use rhetorical hyperbole and demagoguery to inflame and incite anger. I never said I was angry so why would you assume I was unless that was your intention?

I think nothing of stating objective fact; you are welcome to your own opinions, but not your own facts. If facts anger you, then that is your problem.
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Lets make one thing clear, there is nothing objective about your opinion. It is pure subjective unsubstantiated hyperbole based on myth, misinformation and a heavy dose of misogyny.

a) The Bible doesn't use the word homicide at all; and this is a secular society with religious freedom anyway, so who cares what the Bible says in terms of this discussion?
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Good and since you agree that neither the Bible or the government recognize abortion as homicide or murder then stop making false accusations against those you disagree with.

The laws and beliefs of when life begins differ everywhere and you would do well to remember that when expressing your own beliefs in public instead of trying to beat people over the head with them.

If you believe your own words then stop using the term homicide to describe abortion since it has no bearing in fact or reality. Especially, reality.


Earlier you denied that every sexually reproducing organism has a lifespan that begins at fertilization, so you're hardly even deluded on only one objective fact.
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My belief on the subject isn't written in stone and when a logical theory is presented that disproves the one I have with facts and evidence then I am more likely to change my opinion than not. Your kind of debate usually has the opposite effect of solidifying my opinion rather than sway it to your side. In other words, you have repulsed me.

You just seem to be arguing from your own little alternative dimension and we shouldn't be asserting facts at you lest you take offense. No thanks - that would be doing a disservice to the seriousness of the topic, as well as to you.
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Yes, it is a serious topic, especially for women, and your misogynistic patronizing attitude and undermining their concerns is a bigger disservice than you seem willing to comprehend.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.


He's using the typical definition. You're not. A fetus who has died in utero is not typical. As you and I both know, the typical abortion is performed on a living fetus who is "problematic"-- not because of threats to the health of the mother or for any other reason that its being "problematic."
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

Moot said:
Kinda like what the definition says, ability to speak and walk upright. Don't know of many fetuses that can do that, do you?
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I don't know any infants that can either. How now, brown cow?

Sure they are, just like an egg is a chicken.
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Unless you're talking about an ostrich egg....
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

SheWolf said:
Men can have opinions, but men shouldn't make decisions for women. Women should have the right to make their own decisions.
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You're absolutely right, right up to the point where their decisions harm another. That's a human issue, not a gender issue.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

Moot said:
Only if you're trying bait and inflame people.
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Not in the least...it's used so in all manners of subjects not even related to this argument.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

minnie616 said:
Therefore , I also conclude that a fetus does not have it's own independent biological life until it reaches viability.
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This just doesn't make logical sense. It is no more independent at the point of viability than it is before that point.
 
Re: Unintended consequences of attacking PP.

Scrabaholic said:
I agree. Anyone trying to stop a woman from aborting should be dealt with severely.
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as severely as an aborted fetus?
 
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