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[W:#23,579]Ukraine War Thread

And like any principled leftist, I have zero sympathy to the situation the Kiev regime put themselves in, and am strongly opposed to sending any military aid or support whatsoever to the former state of Ukraine.
FoxNews and KKK fans too root for Russian troops, you in the same boat.

Anyway your join date shows that you are on the wind up here.
 
No, Ukraine is spending far more ordnance on civilians Then Russian artillery.

[Citation needed]

Partially because they have zero capability to hit Russian artillery, because the Russians are able to set up fire break down and move before the Ukrainians can organize counter battery fire.

This is literally just some nonsense you made up, because there is plenty of visual evidence of Ukrainian artillery destroying Russsian batteries and guns.
 
I live in a country with 10 million people, less than in NY. Several Swedish journalists are in Ukraine reporting directly. Yet a small number compared to the US, UK, German, France and middle east journalists that are in place, reporting directly. I read some articles from Indian reporters that report directly as well. So no, not 2 sources, multiple sources. Any newsoutlet with some ambition has their own journalists in Ukraine. Some has been killed. (As far as I remember, among those, one journalist from Fox news),

Problem is that Russia has made it illegal and give 15 years in prison to report anything that does not correspond to their official picture. This does that al journalists are in Ukrainian controlled areas and can not work in the areas controlled by Russia. They are not even let in.
I agree with everything you said. The western journalists are seeing what the Ukrainian government wants them to see. I read article after article. What I see in all of them is: "according to a Ukrainian official....".
 
No, Ukraine is spending far more ordnance on civilians Then Russian artillery. Partially because they have zero capability to hit Russian artillery, because the Russians are able to set up fire break down and move before the Ukrainians can organize counter battery fire.

Given that all the embedded reporters, numerous videos, radio intercepts of Russians, and interviews I've examined show something quite different might I assume that your assertion is some kind of comforting rationalization?

Ukraine is well known for its extremely quick and accurate counter battery fire, which has been the highest priority given that they must strictly ration their non-NATO caliber munitions. (One of the more amusing videos out there is from a Russian TV reporter cheerleading a Russian artillery unit opening fire and after 30 seconds of narrative running for shelter as Ukrainian counter fire comes back).

Moreover, Ukrainians are not going to spend resources they don't have on leveling their own cities that they are trying to keep, that is a Russian tactic of "liberation" of a population (the one's that survive in the wreckage).

That isn't news, by the way. Take a look at the aftermath of Grozny and Aleppo...that's pure Russian carnage.
 
The Russians are not American enemies and thus I am free to pick sides ij a war not involving the US. The fact Hunter has a job with Burisma is not a valid US National interest

Your right. It's not in our national interest to make our foreign policy a servant of Trump's political obsession to locate a source of dirt on the Biden's, and hence to judge Ukraine as "unworthy" because it doesn't make Trump happy.
 
No, Ukraine is spending far more ordnance on civilians Then Russian artillery. Partially because they have zero capability to hit Russian artillery, because the Russians are able to set up fire break down and move before the Ukrainians can organize counter battery fire.

Time to first lie.

First sentence.

That isn't even good trolling.
 
FSB Official Takes Over Moscow-Occupied Kherson Region

Russian Forreign Ministry people in Kherson are too terrified of Ukrainian partisans to leave their headquarters in Kherson


Slovakia has sent 11 MiG-29s to Ukraine. Poland and the Czech Republic have sent an unspecified number of tanks to Ukraine.



Wagner is offering Russian prisoners amnesty for 6 months of military service in Ukraine and a death benefit (5 million rubles) in case they are killed. This is a verbal contract.
State shipyard and mine workers are being offered 5,300 rubles a month to fight in Ukraine. Recruitment has been miniscule.


Who are the Nordic 'terrorists' wanted by Turkey?

President Recep Tayyip Erdogan said Sweden had promised to would extradite 73 "terrorists" and had already sent three or four of them. Pro-government Turkish daily Hurriyet published a list of 45 people, including 33 sought from Sweden and 12 from Finland. Turkey is particularly keen on the handover of individuals it considers linked to the Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), considered a terror group by the EU, US and UK. It is also after followers of exiled Turkish cleric Fethullah Gulen. Gulenists are blamed by Turkey for a failed coup against President Erdogan in 2016. The BBC has spoken to three of the people sought by Turkey.....

A travesty. These 3 have had nothing to do with Turkey for 20 years. In most nations, extradition is a judicial ruling rather than a political decision.
 
The western press just parrots whatever "Ukrainian authorities" want them to. The latest Ukrainian propaganda is that THE UA lead an organized retreat out of Lysychansk. Sure they did and the Russians were not able to shell them in any sort of attempt.
 
The western press just parrots whatever "Ukrainian authorities" want them to. The latest Ukrainian propaganda is that THE UA lead an organized retreat out of Lysychansk. Sure they did and the Russians were not able to shell them in any sort of attempt.

It does appear that despite repeated claims of encirclements and pockets, the Russians were unable to actually encircle any large body of Ukrainian troops.
 


He said morale is falling and the loss of Luhansk Oblast has been demoralizing. His company has been at the frontline in the Donbas since well before Feb. 24 and not had a break. Only the wounded get a break, he said.

Wait till you lose the Donbas.
 
It does appear that despite repeated claims of encirclements and pockets, the Russians were unable to actually encircle any large body of Ukrainian troops.
It appears that Ukraine can say whatever they want and it gets repeated a hundred times in the media. There was not complete encirclement but there was a very long causeway where the Russians had complete control of fire along it. Where is the western reporting about this hellish retreat? Nothing. Just successful organized retreat. It is totally and utterly Ukrainian propaganda.
 
It appears that Ukraine can say whatever they want and it gets repeated a hundred times in the media. There was not complete encirclement but there was a very long causeway where the Russians had complete control of fire along it.

But I thought the Russians were netting 2500 with each pocket?
 
No kidding!
Some people think that Ukraine should be countering with an offensive
That said, many are Putin collaborators
 
So where are all the videos and images of these surely thousands of prisoners?
They are not supposed to use images of POWs. You know that.
At the end of June, Russia claimed to have over 6,000 Ukrainian prisoners. Many of those fleeing Lysychansk would have been killed in the corridor.
 
It appears that Ukraine can say whatever they want and it gets repeated a hundred times in the media. There was not complete encirclement but there was a very long causeway where the Russians had complete control of fire along it. Where is the western reporting about this hellish retreat? Nothing. Just successful organized retreat. It is totally and utterly Ukrainian propaganda.

If Ukrainians were actually caught in the Russian envelopment the Russian propaganda outlets would have already published it, and all the Putin bootlickers posters contributing to this thread would have already been gleefully cheering about it.
 
NATO on Tuesday officially began the ratification process to add of Finland and Sweden to the Western military alliance, a move that is expected to garner swift support from the alliance's members although the threat of a last-minute veto from Turkey remains.

 
Criticism okay. Contrary opinions are okay. Being skeptical of U.S. or Ukrainian information is okay. But I think part of the problem is that you guys favor the Russian government sources over American government sources. You favor Russian military sources over American military sources. You favor Russian civilian sources of information over American, NATO, and allied civilian sources of information. And you want Russia to win, but Russia is, if not an enemy, an adversary and acts against our interests. It's one thing to just not agree with American foreign policy decisions because you want the U.S. to pursue some other course of action because you think it will benefit the U.S., it's another to sort of actively choose Russia's side and actively encourage an outcome that is contrary to U.S. national interests. The Russians are not our friends. The Ukrainians are our friends.
I mean Russian government sources are the only ones actually reporting on Russias reasons for starting this war and what the average Russian troop thinks its all about. Theyre putting out some pretty silly wartime propaganda but if you want to actually understand why this conflict is happening it is impossibe to do that without going to Russian sources because Western sources just refuse to cover any of this stuff. There are still people on this forum for example who will tell you that the Azov Battalion isnt associated with the Ukranian Military when it was incorporated into the National Guard after the first war. Most peope just scratch their heads at Putin describing this as "De-Nazification" because they dont know about the pre-Zelenski govt putting out eternal flame memorials

Again, I was told around 2016, by people roughly on the same side of the pol spectrum as current Zelenski fans that swastikas in public, literal ACTUAL Nazis was the absolute moral line. You dont support those people, or people who affiliate with them, in any way. They all need to be crushed and destroyed. Ukranians largely fit this bill and pre-Zelensky the govt pushed an openly Nazi Sympathetic history of WW2.

Sure Putin isnt a great guy, but neither was Stalin, and we were able to put our differences aside to team up with him to crush fascism last time why not this time? I personally have no horse in this race because I knew Russian victory was as inevitable as us leaving Ukranians out to dry, but I just cant help but notice how many "AntiFascists" are making excuses for Nazis these days.
 
The western press just parrots whatever "Ukrainian authorities" want them to. The latest Ukrainian propaganda is that THE UA lead an organized retreat out of Lysychansk. Sure they did and the Russians were not able to shell them in any sort of attempt.

Western press gets it's new from a wide range of sources.

While the Russian press is muzzled by their government and in many cases are the propaganda organ of the Russian government.
 
FoxNews and KKK fans too root for Russian troops, you in the same boat.

Anyway your join date shows that you are on the wind up here.
You see this is whats so wild about this conflict, domestically in the US everyone is flipped.

Youd think Dems ect would love Putin fighting a war against Fascists. And more importnatly, a war against borders. Borders are just imaginary lines on a map, no Russian Troop is Illegal. Putin isnt fighting a war against Ukranians, hes fighting against Ukranian Supremacy, or Ukranian-ness, a false socially constructed identity based on exclusion of Donbass and Crimean Folx. Youd think the American left would love him.
 
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