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UAW shoots itself and it's workers in the head

ludin

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This is now getting more news, however this is a direct result of union greed.
in the last contract the union demanded huge raises and profit sharing.

they ignored warnings from the company that if they did that then they would lose out on more jobs and other future
productions.

well the chickens have come home to roost.

Ford is now going to build a 1.2 billion dollar factory in mexico that will add 2,500 jobs to the area.
these jobs could have gone to the US but given the huge demands by the union they pretty
forced Ford to move the plant elsewhere.

this plant will make small car engine and transmissions.

putting the cart before the horse and the union shoots itself and their workers in the head.
 

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This is now getting more news, however this is a direct result of union greed.
in the last contract the union demanded huge raises and profit sharing.

they ignored warnings from the company that if they did that then they would lose out on more jobs and other future
productions.

well the chickens have come home to roost.

Ford is now going to build a 1.2 billion dollar factory in mexico that will add 2,500 jobs to the area.
these jobs could have gone to the US but given the huge demands by the union they pretty
forced Ford to move the plant elsewhere.

this plant will make small car engine and transmissions.

putting the cart before the horse and the union shoots itself and their workers in the head.

That is, what any economist would expect. When in seldom cases it does not appear to follow this mold, it is worth studying what the special circumstances are that make the case different.
 

ludin

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That is, what any economist would expect. When in seldom cases it does not appear to follow this mold, it is worth studying what the special circumstances are that make the case different.

ford probably couldn't justify the cost of keeping the plant here at the current rate.
if they would have tried putting the plant elsewhere in the US like in the south or something
the UAW would be quick to try and unionize that plant and cause a bunch of trouble.

they also could have sued ford like the machinist union did to boeing when they built that plant in
SC.

the cost was just too much.

so they skipped all the legal nonsense that would have cost them even more money and built the plant in mexico.
people in MI just better hope that SUV and truck sells continue to do well.
 

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The days are numbered for the UAW, as there is too much happening that will force it to eventually slide into obscurity.

NAFTA, and like thinking agreements, have paved a way for US corporations to avoid what little is left of US domestic manufacturing and production labor. Being straight with everyone, that thinking that has accelerated an existing move towards an almost completely services and consumer debt economic model means that unionization of those jobs is becoming extinct.

The UAW is clinging to an outdated method of operation and a horrible idea that it can control the big 3 (well, big 2... one is owned by Fiat now.) It may take several more generations to complete but eventually there will be little to no transportation manufacturing in this nation in comparison to world manufacturing.
 

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The days are numbered for the UAW, as there is too much happening that will force it to eventually slide into obscurity.

NAFTA, and like thinking agreements, have paved a way for US corporations to avoid what little is left of US domestic manufacturing and production labor. Being straight with everyone, that thinking that has accelerated an existing move towards an almost completely services and consumer debt economic model means that unionization of those jobs is becoming extinct.

The UAW is clinging to an outdated method of operation and a horrible idea that it can control the big 3 (well, big 2... one is owned by Fiat now.) It may take several more generations to complete but eventually there will be little to no transportation manufacturing in this nation in comparison to world manufacturing.

I can't see how this is not accurate. My only guess is that thugs will be thugs and they WILL find another way to inflict their damages on society and ruin another segment of American life.

Also, this is yet another crystal clear way Socialists will completely ruin America and refuse to see what they're doing.
At this rate, The USA is on a direct path to 3rd world-dom. Congratulations to all on the left. Mission accomplished.
 

OrphanSlug

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I can't see how this is not accurate. My only guess is that thugs will be thugs and they WILL find another way to inflict their damages on society and ruin another segment of American life.

Also, this is yet another crystal clear way Socialists will completely ruin America and refuse to see what they're doing.
At this rate, The USA is on a direct path to 3rd world-dom. Congratulations to all on the left. Mission accomplished.

Close, but not really where I was going with this. Unionization will continue to exist in this nation for the services industry and of course government jobs. That ship has sailed, unionization in this nation is one of many factors that allowed for a Middle Class in the first place.

However, the UAW is dealing with a dead union model. Because there will not be much auto manufacturing in this nation going forward (perhaps made even worse if TPP passes) there will be little reason for a union of "united auto workers" in this nation. Foreign manufactures that have or will set up shops here will eventually close them as more trade agreement allows for more international labor competition.

Our issue is what happens to those liabilities that the UAW leaves behind in promises to their retirees. And on the way down, the more the UAW tries to negotiate for the more the more they will push what little is left in this nation right to Mexico (and elsewhere.)
 

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Close, but not really where I was going with this. Unionization will continue to exist in this nation for the services industry and of course government jobs. That ship has sailed, unionization in this nation is one of many factors that allowed for a Middle Class in the first place.

However, the UAW is dealing with a dead union model. Because there will not be much auto manufacturing in this nation going forward (perhaps made even worse if TPP passes) there will be little reason for a union of "united auto workers" in this nation. Foreign manufactures that have or will set up shops here will eventually close them as more trade agreement allows for more international labor competition.

Our issue is what happens to those liabilities that the UAW leaves behind in promises to their retirees. And on the way down, the more the UAW tries to negotiate for the more the more they will push what little is left in this nation right to Mexico (and elsewhere.)

Yes, we agree on this....no need to try and sugar coat it.
Unions can and do wreak economic havoc. They are not needed. The free market is a FAR better mediator of economic resources....every time.
If all we have left is a services industry, we are all screwed anyway. ;)
 

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Everyone cheered Ford as Obama gave some bailout money to the other 2...all 3 are UAW companies.
I bet that now, most of those who are with Trump and are against outsourcing, have nothing good to say about Ford.
UAW?
 

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Everyone cheered Ford as Obama gave some bailout money to the other 2...all 3 are UAW companies.
I bet that now, most of those who are with Trump and are against outsourcing, have nothing good to say about Ford.
UAW?

I have nothing good so say about the way liberal / Progressive / Socialist policies have FORCED honest business off of our shores.
 

NoLeftNoRight

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It is only a matter of time now...

View attachment 67199891

Now post the same graphical representation of China's services vs manufacturing sectors......which star is rising and which is falling?
Also, you need to post sources....otherwise such graphs could be "home grown"

Without a solid manufacturing base, the USA will not continue to thrive.


The High Price of Losing Manufacturing Jobs

Study: Overseas manufacturing hits U.S. regions hard, leaving workers unemployed for years and local economies struggling.

The High Price of Losing Manufacturing Jobs | The Fiscal Times
 
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Carjosse

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Now post the same graphical representation of China's services vs manufacturing sectors......which star is rising and which is falling?
Also, you need to post sources....otherwise such graphs could be "home grown"

Without a solid manufacturing base, the USA will not continue to thrive.


The High Price of Losing Manufacturing Jobs

Study: Overseas manufacturing hits U.S. regions hard, leaving workers unemployed for years and local economies struggling.

The High Price of Losing Manufacturing Jobs | The Fiscal Times

The US is also a developed economy, China is still developing and their economy is a disaster at the moment and are dealing with massive unemployment for a while now.
 

ludin

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Now post the same graphical representation of China's services vs manufacturing sectors......which star is rising and which is falling?
Also, you need to post sources....otherwise such graphs could be "home grown"

Without a solid manufacturing base, the USA will not continue to thrive.


The High Price of Losing Manufacturing Jobs

Study: Overseas manufacturing hits U.S. regions hard, leaving workers unemployed for years and local economies struggling.

The High Price of Losing Manufacturing Jobs | The Fiscal Times

United States Manufacturing Sector Will Be More Competitive Than China - Fortune

most manufacturing has been automated now. you don't need a row of 100 guys to put bolts in things.
you need 5 guys to do it.
 

ludin

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Everyone cheered Ford as Obama gave some bailout money to the other 2...all 3 are UAW companies.
I bet that now, most of those who are with Trump and are against outsourcing, have nothing good to say about Ford.
UAW?

Ford has been doing a lot of things right.

this factory move was brought on by a business decision that the UAW caused.
they demanded huge pay raises and profit sharing in return they gave up 2500 jobs to another country.

pretty stupid if you asked me.
 

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It is only a matter of time now...

View attachment 67199891

Misleading perhaps? The chart shows how many people are employed in those sectors, yet the productivity from those sectors continue to increase, i.e. there are fewer people farming now yet bringing ever larger crops to market.

This continued productivity growth fueling and supporting the service sector perhaps?
 

OrphanSlug

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Misleading perhaps? The chart shows how many people are employed in those sectors, yet the productivity from those sectors continue to increase, i.e. there are fewer people farming now yet bringing ever larger crops to market.

This continued productivity growth fueling and supporting the service sector perhaps?

There are plenty of things fueling the move of our economic model to be service dominated from an employment standpoint. Trade agreements as it relates to foreign labor markets is one of those things, and we are talking about it because it directly impacts the future of the UAW.

Our existing agreements (NAFTA, other trade agreements with various nations like China and Japan as examples) and proposed agreements (like TPP) are going to put downward pressure on labor costs for automotive manufacturing in this nation (the subject of this thread) at the very time that the UAW is trying to push it the other way.

It is a no win scenario for the UAW in the long term.
 

eohrnberger

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There are plenty of things fueling the move of our economic model to be service dominated from an employment standpoint. Trade agreements as it relates to foreign labor markets is one of those things, and we are talking about it because it directly impacts the future of the UAW.

Our existing agreements (NAFTA, other trade agreements with various nations like China and Japan as examples) and proposed agreements (like TPP) are going to put downward pressure on labor costs for automotive manufacturing in this nation (the subject of this thread) at the very time that the UAW is trying to push it the other way.

It is a no win scenario for the UAW in the long term.

I'd have to agree. I'd further state that unions were most certainly necessary back in the days of the robber-barons, back in the days of endless hours of toil, no worker safety precautions, and many other abuses. IMHO, this isn't the present set of conditions, and perhaps unions have outlived their usefulness? Especially so for public sector unions.

Should the unions really be interested in the welfare of the world's workers, they should be starting up in the low wage countries, which are often reported on for the aforementioned worker abuses. But I think they just want to stay with the money, for their own benefits (ignoring their member's benefits - although that might be a bit harsh).
 

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Ford has been doing a lot of things right.

this factory move was brought on by a business decision that the UAW caused.
they demanded huge pay raises and profit sharing in return they gave up 2500 jobs to another country.

pretty stupid if you asked me.

Yeah, having little Mexicans work for cheap and selling cars at the same high dollar to people who are out of work here in the U.S, that is a great business decision.
Ask yourself who is getting rich in this. It is not the UAW.
 

ludin

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Yeah, having little Mexicans work for cheap and selling cars at the same high dollar to people who are out of work here in the U.S, that is a great business decision.
Ask yourself who is getting rich in this. It is not the UAW.

the UAW took their huge pay increase during the last contract.
in that included profit sharing cut which saw ford workers get about 9,300 dollars.

they gave up the ability to make these small cars for the big pay day.
 
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