then your sig would have to be "i hate democracy", as you are opposed to the outcome of democratic elections
oh no, I am totally cool with the Palestinians' democratic choice and their ability to choose whoever they want to lead them.
What I am not cool with is the perverse notion that I am to be
indifferent of who they choose to lead them, and should not alter my behaviour towards them or my attitudes regarding what their intentions are based on who they elect.
Cause I have a right, indeed a duty, to exercise my own judgment and my own free will in dealing with others. And it makes absolutely no sense to me to pretend that a genocidal terrorist organization is, in fact, a start-up company looking to produce rainbows and sunshine out of human tears and MSG, or to provide billions of dollars in funding to a government run by a genocidal terrorist organization (<ahem>, sorry, run by a rainbow/sunshine producing start-up), or, frankly, to back independence for a people who elected a genocidal terrorist organization to advance their interests and be their face to the world.
Not sure why that is so hard to understand.
about the only folks i know who are opposed to peace are those reich wingers who embrace any act of perpetual war; which only serves to fill the coffers of the military industrial complex while draining our nation's wealth, and most importantly, deprives our young soldiers of their lives
well that's not true. The genocidal terrorists who have gone on the record before exploding themselves as undertaking their actions to "liberate historic Palestine" were certainly not interested in advancing the interests of the US military-industrial complex. But I guess you've just never really paid attention?
it appears that you have never entertained the prospect that some of us value democracy - and that we recognize democratic outcomes as the will of the people being governed
like I said, I'm perfectly happy to recognize it. And to behave accoridngly. You want the former, but not the latter. But I guess you have never entertained the notion that some of us value not being symapthizers or lending support to terrorist monsters and those who choose terrorist monsters to be their democratically elected leaders.
tell us why those who engage in democracy are not entitled to self determination
you would have us believe that the price of democracy is the loss of statehood
you have an array of very queer notions
yuo just don't understand them. The Palestinians are entitled to self-determination. However, the Israelis are entitled to security and not to be the target of Palestinian destructionist activities. Like all rights, these competing rights must be balanced. And if the Palestinians are prepared to behave themselves, then I see no reason why they should be denied that self determination, in a portion of Palestine that they can negotiate for, having regard only to the need to have a viable sovereign territory and reaching a realistic diplomatic solutuion. However, to the extent that the Palestinians say "hey, let's elect a bunch of terrorists running on aplatform of "liberating" Tel Aviv from the Zionists and aligning with Iran to amas weapons targeting Israeli civilians", then it becomes clear that they intend to use their "rights" to do something patently illegal and harmful to others.
which makes me re-evaluate both their readiness for independence, the propbability that any independence will result in any real success for Palestinians, and whether, in all honesty, I really give a **** about them at all, rather than, say, the hundreds of millions of people who are far worse off them them, equally denied rights, and get a fraction of the money and none of the concern afforded to them by those trying to help the Palestinians.
The price of democracy is not the loss of statehood. The price of choosing as elected leaders a genocidal terrorist organization that teaches children that they should dream of dying "liberating" Tel Aviv, continually engages in war crimes and crimes against humanity by targeting Israeli civilians for murder and dismemberment, and which has no real respect for the rule of law, on the other hand, IS the loss of statehood.
Or at least postponement until the society recognizes that there are negative consequences to being complete pricks.
and who would be the parents to the Palestinian children with the broken toys?
again, you make no sense
Make perfect sense. The parents are theo oens who give them their allowance and keep offering them a state on a shiny platter, only to watch them spend all them money on explosives and melt down the platter to make knives.