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Two concealed carry permit holders shoot and kill each other in Michigan

TurtleDude said:
and you get upset when those of us who are pro rights advocates note you are an anti gun contrarian. Its the moronic confusing a car with a constitutional right that is proof
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You cite the constitution like it's a guarantee. Like you've had the hand of blessing on your forehead and none can dispute it. It's as fragile as an interpretation and vulnerable, like everything else you've been taught to call 'rights', to legislation.
You have the same rights as everyone else in the world- the right to do anything the government allows you to do.


TurtleDude said:
the fact is-people like HOJ are anti gun for reasons that have nothing to do with lack of training or even improper shootings. Its all about the politics and life choices of those of us who don't outsource self preservation to the government that bugs those who worship being a sheep dependent on the farmer to tae ke care of them

You aren't in any position to tell anyone else what they need

indeed that sort of attitude is a good reason why people NEED guns
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'outsource self preservation'. Seriously? You need a gun to protect yourself? I don't think so. I haven't been in the USA since they decided I needed a passport for their homeland security, but I used to travel a lot in the west of the US and never felt like I needed to be armed. I think you just like the feel, the heft, of a handgun when you walk around.
 
Grand Mal said:
He's on about an armed society, and I agree with him. My rifles are for hunting and coon control and are simply tools of rural living. Most people in the city or suburbs don't need firearms and thanks to runaway gun advocacy there can't be a provision for requiring training and demonstrated competence. You have to demonstrate competence before you're allowed to drive a car but all you need to carry a concealed handgun is the declared desire to do so. If you guys (handgun advocates) don't start advocating licensing based on training and qualification, you're gonna lose support from the mainstream- those millions who don't want to carry but still (for now) support your right to do so.
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Except the same anti gun rights folks would claim you have no need for those dangerous weapons you own.....Tell me, what additional qualifications do you have short of an 8 hour hunters safety course that would exceed the 8-16 hour course of instruction many states require for CCW?

One last thing, why don't "most people" in those areas "need" firearms. I mean, I live in a rural area but I do not need to hunt and traps work fine for raccoons. Why in the world own a firearm which could potentially cause the death of another hunter or child? That is pretty damned inconsiderate.
 
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Grand Mal said:
You cite the constitution like it's a guarantee. Like you've had the hand of blessing on your forehead and none can dispute it. It's as fragile as an interpretation and vulnerable, like everything else you've been taught to call 'rights', to legislation.
You have the same rights as everyone else in the world- the right to do anything the government allows you to do.




'outsource self preservation'. Seriously? You need a gun to protect yourself? I don't think so. I haven't been in the USA since they decided I needed a passport for their homeland security, but I used to travel a lot in the west of the US and never felt like I needed to be armed. I think you just like the feel, the heft, of a handgun when you walk around.
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I think you are just another bitter liberal who hates people who don't buy into your big government world view and you pretend you know more about guns and the reasons people have them than those who actually do

I think your rants are just pathetic attempts to bash conservatives. How long do you think you'd last against anyone who has a semblance of training if you dont have a gun?

not more than a couple seconds
 
Grand Mal said:
You have the same rights as everyone else in the world- the right to do anything the government allows you to.
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:shock: Seriously?? That is a truly scary statement........

That statement is a true classic and worthy of a signature.
 
BretJ said:
:shock: Seriously?? That is a truly scary statement........

That statement is a true classic and worthy of a signature.
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its typical from a far left statist. It is scary That sort of thinking is why all free men should be well armed
 
BretJ said:
Except the same anti gun rights folks would claim you have no need for those dangerous weapons you own.....Tell me, what additional qualifications do you have short of an 8 hour hunters safety course that would exceed the 8-16 hour course of instruction many states require for CCW?

One last thing, why don't "most people" in those areas "need" firearms. I mean, I live in a rural area but I do not need to hunt and traps work fine for raccoons. Why in the world own a firearm which could potentially cause the death of another hunter or child? That is pretty damned inconsiderate.
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I don't need to hunt either but it's easy meat here and the deer are such a nuisance it's nearly a civic duty. And traps are too indiscriminate for me.
And all I know about requirements or concealed-carry permits, I picked up here, where I've been told the state has to grant it if you ask and don't have a history of violent crime.
 
TurtleDude said:
I think you are just another bitter liberal who hates people who don't buy into your big government world view and you pretend you know more about guns and the reasons people have them than those who actually do

I think your rants are just pathetic attempts to bash conservatives.
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What you know about my world-view wouldn't squash a bug but I agree with Voltaire about your mistakes.

TurtleDude said:
How long do you think you'd last against anyone who has a semblance of training if you dont have a gun?

not more than a couple seconds
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This is your night to flex those amphibious forelegs, innit?
What's it gonna take to get it through your skull that no-one, trained or not, is going to come at me with a gun? Not gonna happen. I'll get struck by lightning first. I don't live in Somalia.
 
Grand Mal said:
I don't need to hunt either but it's easy meat here and the deer are such a nuisance it's nearly a civic duty. And traps are too indiscriminate for me.
And all I know about requirements or concealed-carry permits, I picked up here, where I've been told the state has to grant it if you ask and don't have a history of violent crime.
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so you have less training than most states require for CCW........
 
head of joaquin said:
What's failed? I posted something that actually happened and asked if that was part of the vision gun lovers like you have for the future.

You can just say no if you think otherwise. But I suspect that you don't really think it's a problem: if gun owners shoot it out over parking disputes that's just the price we pay for your 2nd Amendment rights, correct? It rather predictable that the more people carry concealed weapons the more outcomes like this will happen.

It's your vision, not mine: tell us what it is.
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I've already told you, you just aren't listening.

The vast majority of states have easy-issue CCW. Several million Americans carry daily. Yet so far the statistics on CCWers committing mayhem is far smaller than the rate of mayhem for the general population.

So, your point is pointless.
 
What have we learned from this whole post? People are f***ing stupid. They will find ways to impose their stupid on you. And sadly stupid is a contagious and deadly disease.
 
From the article it sounds like the one driver was tailgating the other driver. The lead car pulls into a car wash followed by the tailgater. It was the tailgater who opened fire first and the lead car's driver fired back.

Why the first driver pulled into a car wash is uncertain. This almost sounds like a car version of the Martin-Zimmerman fiasco where one is following the other and the followed one stops to confront.
 
Crosscheck said:
From the article it sounds like the one driver was tailgating the other driver. The lead car pulls into a car wash followed by the tailgater. It was the tailgater who opened fire first and the lead car's driver fired back.

Why the first driver pulled into a car wash is uncertain. This almost sounds like a car version of the Martin-Zimmerman fiasco where one is following the other and the followed one stops to confront.
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If the tailgater pulled first the guy being followed had a right to pull a gun.
 
Black Manta said:
And realistically how often does this happen? We have had conceal carry for years now, and still the streets are not running with blood because of CCW. Nice hyperbole though.
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That's what you call HYPER-MEME. :lamo
 
Grand Mal said:
You cite the constitution like it's a guarantee. Like you've had the hand of blessing on your forehead and none can dispute it. It's as fragile as an interpretation and vulnerable, like everything else you've been taught to call 'rights', to legislation.
You have the same rights as everyone else in the world- the right to do anything the government allows you to do.




'outsource self preservation'. Seriously? You need a gun to protect yourself? I don't think so. I haven't been in the USA since they decided I needed a passport for their homeland security, but I used to travel a lot in the west of the US and never felt like I needed to be armed. I think you just like the feel, the heft, of a handgun when you walk around.
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You goddam right it's a guarantee, and anyone that touches it needs to be smashed into the ground and destroyed. Got it now?
 
head of joaquin said:
Translated: armed men shooting each other is part of your vision for America's future.

Yep, that's what I said.
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Armed people kill other people in every country in the world every day.
That's how human beings operate. It can't be stopped.
It's better to have a weapon and not need it than to need one and not have it.
 
American said:
You goddam right it's a guarantee, and anyone that touches it needs to be smashed into the ground and destroyed. Got it now?
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Oooohh! I love it when you get all butch like that!
 
head of joaquin said:
This is the gun advocates' vision of America's future. Helluvavision.

Road rage shootout leaves two drivers dead | wzzm13.com

Daily Kos: Two concealed carry permit holders shoot and kill each other in Michigan

Relatives of James Pullum, one of two dead in road rage shootout, witnessed shootings | MLive.com
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(without reading any posts yet...) This OP is not surprising. One finds a very rare occurrence to point out and ignores the daily carnage of places like Chicago, etc. BTW, what they did was illegal whether they carry CCDW or not.
 
head of joaquin said:
The point is, given the worldview of the gun advocates, and their desire to arm society, it would happen all the time if they had their way.

Helluvavision.
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WRONG it is to be equally equipt as murderous thug trash.
 
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