Trump told Turkey's Erdogan in Dec. 14 call about Syria, 'it's all yours. We are done'

[Tigerace117]

The implication of comparing Lindbergh's arguments with Trump's is that modern day Russia is Nazi Germany. That's crazy. Btw, if it weren't for all the sacrifices Russians made in the war, the Germans might not have been defeated, and we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Pointing out the stupidity of "isolationists" and the fact that such an ideology has numerous flaws and problems....as shown historically..... is not "crazy" no matter how much you wish it was.

And I hate to break it to you but had Stalin not actively collaborated with Hitler for years.....and shot himself in both feet by murdering much of the Red Army's competent commanders..... the Germans would not have gotten as far as they did and there would have been far less Russian suffering.

 

[sanman]

Pointing out the stupidity of "isolationists" and the fact that such an ideology has numerous flaws and problems....as shown historically..... is not "crazy" no matter how much you wish it was.

And I hate to break it to you but had Stalin not actively collaborated with Hitler for years.....and shot himself in both feet by murdering much of the Red Army's competent commanders..... the Germans would not have gotten as far as they did and there would have been far less Russian suffering.

"Isolationists" - and so in your Euro-centric view, you feel that Europe is the fundamental litmus test for isolationism? You're saying something about yourself. What's your background again? You seem to have avoided mentioning it.

At any rate, all those Left-wing protesters demanding withdrawal from Iraq -- and there were piles of them btw, I remember them blocking traffic -- seemed to feel that foreign engagements in the Middle East were worth withdrawing from.

 

[Atomic Kid]

The implication of comparing Lindbergh's arguments with Trump's is that modern day Russia is Nazi Germany. That's crazy. Btw, if it weren't for all the sacrifices Russians made in the war, the Germans might not have been defeated, and we wouldn't be having this conversation.

That's the Russians own damn fault for initially siding with Hitler and Germany to start WWII. Apparently Stalin never bothered to read Mein Kamph.

 

[sanman]

That's the Russians own damn fault for initially siding with Hitler and Germany to start WWII. Apparently Stalin never bothered to read Mein Kamph.

Maybe you're not aware of fundamental facts, like that Stalin want a Russian but a Georgian. Joseph Stalin was born Djugashvili, a Georgian, and only adopted the name Stalin for himself. As a minority grappling with much larger ethnic groups whom he did not identify with, he sought to build up a large and powerful state apparatus as his instrument to bring their larger masses to heel. Millions died under Stalin's brutal reorganization of society.

Fortunately he didn't have Eric Holder by his side, or things would have turned out even worse. But he was smart enough to create a forerunner of CNN, called Pravda.

 

[Oborosen]

Trump told Turkey's Erdogan in Dec. 14 call about Syria, 'it's all yours. We are done'

By Jeremy Diamond and Elise Labott, CNN

Updated 3:50 AM ET, Mon December 24, 2018





Wow, great job... idiot...

Just calling him an idiot, like it actually proves something.

Pretty much puts on display, just how vacant of substance your OP is in the first place.

You know that right?

 

[Abbazorkzog]

Just calling him an idiot, like it actually proves something.

Pretty much puts on display, just how vacant of substance your OP is in the first place.

You know that right?

Anything you post is automatically indicted and invalidated based on your ridiculous avatar.

 

[Atomic Kid]

Maybe you're not aware of fundamental facts, like that Stalin want a Russian but a Georgian. Joseph Stalin was born Djugashvili, a Georgian, and only adopted the name Stalin for himself. As a minority grappling with much larger ethnic groups whom he did not identify with, he sought to build up a large and powerful state apparatus as his instrument to bring their larger masses to heel. Millions died under Stalin's brutal reorganization of society.

Fortunately he didn't have Eric Holder by his side, or things would have turned out even worse. But he was smart enough to create a forerunner of CNN, called Pravda.

What the **** does any of that have to do with the fact of you are completely missing the point that Stalin had originally sided with Hitler?

 

[sanman]

What the **** does any of that have to do with the fact of you are completely missing the point that Stalin had originally sided with Hitler?

I'm saying don't blame Russians for what Stalin did -- he wasn't even one of them. Otherwise, in that case, next time we debate about what the Ukrainian govt is currently doing, then I'll be sure to bring up Stalin's record to pin it on them. To be reminded of how nutty Stalin was, all you have to do is look at today's Georgia -- now that's a country run by immature nuts -- a nutty little 'Mouse-That-Roared' fiefdom.

See, that's why it's very easy to see the mentality of Obama or Eric Holder when they want to build up a very large and intrusive state to impose their agenda on the wider population, whom they don't identify with and see as adversaries. These are the same feelings that Stalin felt towards the Russians, whom he didn't identify with.

And since we were talking about Lindbergh and WW2, then recognize that the groundwork for WW2 was laid by that idiot Woodrow Wilson, who got America involved in WW1 and imposed humiliating Victor's Justice on the Germans, setting the state for Hitler to come to power.

Wilson himself abused power at home, crushing political opposition in what's now acknowledged as a violation of their fundamental rights, just so he could ram his policies through. And yet some fools laud Wilsonianism as if he was some genius or saint - there are even policy centers named after the man. Pathetic.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

They've been doing that since November.

If the US government wants that protection to continue then it had best drag out the delivery of the military equipment that it is selling the Sauds (that is NOT a misspelling) as long as possible.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Just because people have no idea why Trump is doing things, doesn't mean Trump has no idea why he's doing things.

True.

On the other hand, just because Mr. Trump knows why He is doing things that doesn't mean that those reasons would make any sense to an intelligent, informed, and rational person either.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

So he wasn’t really an isolationist like you claimed then. What is your point?

Col Lindberg was "isolationist" until a bunch of "Yellow" people had the temerity to attack "White" folks. He didn't give a damn about what Japan was doing as long as Japan was simply killing other "Yellow" people. His reaction to the Nazi murder machine was that he was "disappointed".

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

I will put it this way, the abrahms holds the record for worst performing tank since ww2, 99% of that record is from saudi arabia in they war against yemen and iraq against isis, hinting that there was nothing wrong with the carburator but something very wrong with the operator.

Most people aren't aware of this but the US military was seriously considering scrapping the Abrams due to its known record for unreliability.

What changed the US military's mind?

Gulf War I did.

Why?

Because the troops started actually doing the required/recommended daily/weekly/monthly maintenance rather than simply wiping parts of the tank with an oily rag and then signing off that the maintenance had been done.

What your post is telling me is that the Saudis are treating their Abrams as if they were disposable and new ones could always be obtained (and with the amount of money that the Sauds [not a spelling mistake] have, that's not out of the question).

If my memory serves, it appears that "Arab armies" have generally had a p*** poor record as far as maintenance of anything beside personal weapons that the soldier actually owns personally is concerned - but I'm more than happy to be corrected (with links).

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Germany’s ally, Japan.

Please don't forget that America's ally (the KMT) was doing so as well.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Yeah, given that Nazi Germany was a deeply evil regime.....that’s not a good excuse bud.

Some people might find "The Lindberghs and the Jews" (it doesn't have any pictures, but it IS short) interesting

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Hopefully, Turkey's intervention in Syria will eventually result in President Erdogan's "retirement" from politics so that Turkey can finally return to democracy.

I wouldn't say that the word "return" is quite appropriate when speaking of "Turkish democracy".

 

[TheParser]

I wouldn't say that the word "return" is quite appropriate when speaking of "Turkish democracy".

I certainly do not know much about Turkey, but according to the media (yes, even the liberal media), President Erdogan has really gone much further than other presidents have ever done in being a dictator.

I understand that the army used to deal very "severely" with presidents that did not keep their place.

And, of course, the army a few years ago tried to "assist" President Erdogan in leaving the country for a well-deserved retirement.

Many people were disappointed that the attempt failed.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

That's the Russians own damn fault for initially siding with Hitler and Germany to start WWII. Apparently Stalin never bothered to read Mein Kamph.

Oh the Russians, including Comrade Stalin, had read "Mein Kampf" (which is more than can be said about Mr. Trump).

What the Russians were attempting to do was to buy time in order to prepare for the inevitable German invasion. If buying time for Russia meant that they had to sell Poland down the river, well, the Poles hadn't been a part of Russia for - well, since never actually. They almost succeeded.

Had OP BARBAROSSA been delayed until 1942 (which was what the Russians hoped for and towards which their plans were geared) I rather suspect that Herr Hitler would have had a MUCH more unpleasant surprise than he actually received.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

What the **** does any of that have to do with the fact of you are completely missing the point that Stalin had originally sided with Hitler?

That, of course, happened AFTER Britain, France, and the US had refused to side with Russia in case Germany attacked Russia.

But we don't talk about that in polite company - do we?

We just define "originally" to mean whatever we want it to mean in order to "prove" our case.

Do you honestly think that Hitler would have attacked Poland if its independence had been guaranteed by Britain, France, Russia, and the United States of America which were also involved in a mutual defence treaty?

Herr Hitler ended up being that crazy, but he wasn't that crazy in 1939.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

I certainly do not know much about Turkey, but according to the media (yes, even the liberal media), President Erdogan has really gone much further than other presidents have ever done in being a dictator.

I understand that the army used to deal very "severely" with presidents that did not keep their place.

And, of course, the army a few years ago tried to "assist" President Erdogan in leaving the country for a well-deserved retirement.

Many people were disappointed that the attempt failed.

Would you buy "get closer to a situation that looks (provided that you don't look too closely) sort of like democracy"?

 

[Tom Horn]

Col Lindberg was "isolationist" until a bunch of "Yellow" people had the temerity to attack "White" folks. He didn't give a damn about what Japan was doing as long as Japan was simply killing other "Yellow" people. His reaction to the Nazi murder machine was that he was "disappointed".

So was CL opposed to sending any aid or trade to any nation in Europe?

 

[Mycroft]

True.

On the other hand, just because Mr. Trump knows why He is doing things that doesn't mean that those reasons would make any sense to an intelligent, informed, and rational person either.

You should probably wait to see if it works.

 

[beerftw]

Most people aren't aware of this but the US military was seriously considering scrapping the Abrams due to its known record for unreliability.

What changed the US military's mind?

Gulf War I did.

Why?

Because the troops started actually doing the required/recommended daily/weekly/monthly maintenance rather than simply wiping parts of the tank with an oily rag and then signing off that the maintenance had been done.

What your post is telling me is that the Saudis are treating their Abrams as if they were disposable and new ones could always be obtained (and with the amount of money that the Sauds [not a spelling mistake] have, that's not out of the question).

If my memory serves, it appears that "Arab armies" have generally had a p*** poor record as far as maintenance of anything beside personal weapons that the soldier actually owns personally is concerned - but I'm more than happy to be corrected (with links).

The gulf war also put the abrahms into an environment it was favorable, tank vs tank battles in open terrain. However the maintenance issue was not just tanks, it was military wide with the worst being army reserves and national guard, with active duty faltering as well. This is why comet inspections became a thing after the gulf war, imagine fighting a war and units signing over let's say 20 apaches to units deploying, to find out 18 of the 20 did not fly and 2 of those 20 were bare frames. It created such a nightmare during the gulf war to meet readiness in such a short time they brought out inspections to verify units were doing proper maintenace, as well as deadline reports and supply documentation and accountability.

 

[Oborosen]

Anything you post is automatically indicted and invalidated based on your ridiculous avatar.

As is the same with yours.
Then again, if all you have is the attempt at discrediting me through my avatar alone. It just further reveals how much substance your words lacked in the first place.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

So was CL opposed to sending any aid or trade to any nation in Europe?

Col Lindbergh wasn't opposed to anything that made money for the United States of America. He did, however, "sort of lean" in the direction of Germany. Col Lindbergh "wasn't all that keen" on Jews either.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

The gulf war also put the abrahms into an environment it was favorable, tank vs tank battles in open terrain. However the maintenance issue was not just tanks, it was military wide with the worst being army reserves and national guard, with active duty faltering as well. This is why comet inspections became a thing after the gulf war, imagine fighting a war and units signing over let's say 20 apaches to units deploying, to find out 18 of the 20 did not fly and 2 of those 20 were bare frames. It created such a nightmare during the gulf war to meet readiness in such a short time they brought out inspections to verify units were doing proper maintenace, as well as deadline reports and supply documentation and accountability.

I know. Doing all that dull stuff just isn't as much fun as making things blow up.

My working ratio was "On any given day, around 35% of the stuff that is supposed to be working isn't going to be working the way that it is supposed to work so I should have at least 150% of what I'm supposed to have (according to the book) in order to function properly.". This "occasionally" required a bit of "creative acquisition and storage" of equipment and kit.