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Trump Objects To Verifying List Of Property Seized From Florida Estate - Court Filing

ElChupacabra

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trump's hand picked special master instructed him to give an inventory of the material removed from mar a lago to establish what he says was planted by the DOJ, so what does trump do?

He refuses.

When given an opportunity to identify what the DOJ planted, he refuses.

His excuse is that he doesn't know what the DOJ took.

If he doesn't know what the DOJ removed from mar a lago how does he know the DOJ planted anything?

I sure hope that Dearie doesn't allow trump to get away with his lies.

It's just another display of how being full of hot air backfires. This is the perfect opportunity to make good on the claims he's made about what was taken from the WH and what he claims the FBI planted, but I suspect the records management process was a fantabulous crap show, so now they likely have to back down because they probably have no idea of the full inventory and don't want to commit to outlining an inventory.
 

ElChupacabra

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The simple answer, of course, would be to list what you knowingly took. Anything that isn't on that list would raise questions.

The only problem with that for Trump would be that might screw up and actually admit to having something he really isn't supposed to have. So instead, we go with this bullshit smokescreen.
This. It was a weird stance for his lawyers to take knowing there was always the possibility this exact thing would happen. If you make claims that what's in those boxes is yours, then it's expected you are aware of what's in them and can account for and justify your possession of them. This floundering makes them look like pillocks and reinforces the idea they're just trying to delay and obfuscate.
 

mike2810

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How would they know what they took? They would not let his lawyers observe the search.

Maybe Trump should have had an inventory of the items taken from the WH when he left office. The lawyers could compare their list with the DOJ list.

Show the law that requires the person being searched to have someone observing the search operations.

oh wait. Trump is not a fan on paperwork. :giggle:
 

Rawley

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Maybe Trump should have had an inventory of the items taken from the WH when he left office. The lawyers could compare their list with the DOJ list.
You should bring your complaint to the GSA. THey are the ones that packed up the WH.

By the way, where did NARA bring the ten truckloads of other papers from Trump's White House when he left?

Show the law that requires the person being searched to have someone observing the search operations.

oh wait. Trump is not a fan on paperwork. :giggle:
Again, they've convinced you that this has something to do with "the law" LOL
 

mike2810

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You should bring your complaint to the GSA. THey are the ones that packed up the WH.

By the way, where did NARA bring the ten truckloads of other papers from Trump's White House when he left?


Again, they've convinced you that this has something to do with "the law" LOL

- Prove that GSA packed up items at the WH that Trump or his staff did not approve of being packed and moved.

- What ten truck loads? Source?

- and you are convinced what Trump did was perfectly legal. :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 

jnug

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Yes, I know that but that doesn't change the fact that Trump said he saw the search on video and specifically mentioned his office and Melania's lingerie. Now he says there is no video. Trump knows he had classified documents because he said he" declassified" them. One of two things is true. He is a liar about this matter or he actually "declassified" documents with no understanding of what was in them or how many there were, or how and where they were stored. I think the former is true but if it is the latter he absolutely does not deserve the job of CIC ! Sooner or later even Trumpers are going to say even if just to themselves, this guy is a charlton who is using his base for personal power and money and cannot be trusted with national security ever again.
This is simply another of Trump's shiny objects designed to confuse and obfuscate.
Who cares about the video? I don't
Who cares who took the materials to Mar-a-lago? I don't
Who cares when they left the WH for Mar-a-lago? I don't
Who cares if Donnie thinks he declassified material or not? I don't

The specifics of charges Donnie will ultimately face will be:
- Willful retention of the Property of the United States of America (multiple counts)
- Willful retention of Sensitive National Security Information of the United States of America (multiple counts)
- Obstruction of Justice (multiple counts)

In either charge either Donnie's lawyers are culpable or Donnie is and probably both. Does anybody think those Lawyers are going to jail for Donnie? I DON'T

For those that don't seem to understand, Donnie has already publicly admitted to Willful Retention when he claimed that "he declassified everything" and he even foreclosed any argument that somebody else moved the stuff because he has publicly claimed that he declassified it by moving it.
 
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Rawley

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- Prove that GSA packed up items at the WH that Trump or his staff did not approve of being packed and moved.


- What ten truck loads? Source?

Obama had 20 for two terms. DOing the math, Trump would have ten. What did NARA do with the ten truckloads?

- and you are convinced what Trump did was perfectly legal. :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:

Legal and conventional.
 

mike2810

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Obama had 20 for two terms. DOing the math, Trump would have ten. What did NARA do with the ten truckloads?



Legal and conventional.

From your first link, "The GSA provides, upon request, services and facilities in support of the transition of each outgoing President and Vice-President. Those services and facilities include space, communication systems, IT support, financial management, human resources management, telephones, parking, furniture, vehicles, office equipment, mail management, and administrative support services (such as payroll, financial services, and contracting). The GSA also works with the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA), as necessary, to provide support to the former Presidents in the establishment and maintenance of their libraries. These services are only provided in the event of a change of Administration."


Trump or his staff requested GSA to help with the move. That is known.

You really need to read more carefully. No one is questioning on GSA packing and moving the items. I stated the following,
" Prove that GSA packed up items at the WH that Trump or his staff did not approve of being packed and moved."

That is the part you failed to address. I asked for you to prove that GSA packed items that was not approved by Trump or his staff.

Try again.
 

Rawley

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From your first link, "The GSA provides, upon request, services and facilities in support of the transition of each outgoing President and Vice-President. Those services and facilities include space, communication systems, IT support, financial management, human resources management, telephones, parking, furniture, vehicles, office equipment, mail management, and administrative support services (such as payroll, financial services, and contracting). The GSA also works with the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA), as necessary, to provide support to the former Presidents in the establishment and maintenance of their libraries. These services are only provided in the event of a change of Administration."


Trump or his staff requested GSA to help with the move. That is known.

You really need to read more carefully. No one is questioning on GSA packing and moving the items. I stated the following,
" Prove that GSA packed up items at the WH that Trump or his staff did not approve of being packed and moved."

That is the part you failed to address. I asked for you to prove that GSA packed items that was not approved by Trump or his staff.

Try again.
Actually, you are the one claiming he stole these documents. Burden is on you to prove he or his staff packed these boxes.
 

mike2810

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Actually, you are the one claiming he stole these documents. Burden is on you to prove he or his staff packed these boxes.
actually, you started this my suggesting GSA packed items without permission or packed items Trump wanted left behind at the WH.
Your burden to prove that GSA packed items they were not instructed to pack. Not buying this refuse burden tactic of yours.

It is know GSA packed and moved items from the WH to MAL.
 

Rawley

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actually, you started this my suggesting GSA packed items without permission or packed items Trump wanted left behind at the WH.
Your burden to prove that GSA packed items they were not instructed to pack. Not buying this refuse burden tactic of yours.

It is know GSA packed and moved items from the WH to MAL.
Nope. You were whining about the lack of an inventory. That would have been the job of the GSA, the ones doing the packing.
 

Hamish Howl

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This entire mess makes me happy. Sort of weird happy, like a leper excited about his brand new hat.
 

mike2810

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Nope. You were whining about the lack of an inventory. That would have been the job of the GSA, the ones doing the packing.
Nope.
Not even close.

Stike 3, you are out.
 

Rawley

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Nope.
Not even close.

Stike 3, you are out.
"Maybe Trump should have had an inventory of the items taken from the WH when he left office"
 

Buckeyes85

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"Maybe Trump should have had an inventory of the items taken from the WH when he left office"
This whole argument/defense is soooo weak.
I would love to see Trumps crack legal team argue to a judge or jury that he bears no responsibility because the GSA packed the boxes. I doubt that will be very successful as to the original movement of the documents to Immoral Lago, and it definitely won't fly given the government's efforts to get the documents back, and Trump's stonewalling and failure to comply with a grand jury subpoena.

And of course, Trump's claim that he doesn't know what the FBI took proves he's lying in his oft repeated claim that the FBI planted evidence/documents.

I can't imagine the hell of representing Trump as as client. He is pathological liar that thinks he's smarter than every one. And of course, he simply won't shut up. Those tactics work well with his under educated base of supporters. It will not work in federal court if/when he is facing criminal charges. And he will be.
 

Rawley

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This whole argument/defense is soooo weak.
I would love to see Trumps crack legal team argue to a judge or jury that he bears no responsibility because the GSA packed the boxes. I doubt that will be very successful as to the original movement of the documents to Immoral Lago, and it definitely won't fly given the government's efforts to get the documents back, and Trump's stonewalling and failure to comply with a grand jury subpoena.

And of course, Trump's claim that he doesn't know what the FBI took proves he's lying in his oft repeated claim that the FBI planted evidence/documents.

I can't imagine the hell of representing Trump as as client. He is pathological liar that thinks he's smarter than every one. And of course, he simply won't shut up. Those tactics work well with his under educated base of supporters. It will not work in federal court if/when he is facing criminal charges. And he will be.
LOL Speaking of under educated base of supporters, his handlers have you believing Biden is going to indict Trump. Too rich.
 

jnug

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LOL Speaking of under educated base of supporters, his handlers have you believing Biden is going to indict Trump. Too rich.
Just because you think the Sessions/Barr DOJ spent all their time fumbling for the zipper on the front of Donnie's fly does not mean Garland is of the same ilk. It will be Garland's decision , not Biden's. Nice try
 

Buckeyes85

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LOL Speaking of under educated base of supporters, his handlers have you believing Biden is going to indict Trump. Too rich.
Yea, that would be wrong because Biden won't be indicting anyone. Not his job. And of course, neither he nor his handlers have made one comment about whether or not Trump will be indicted. So that's 2 swings and misses.

My belief that he will be indicted is based upon the information/evidence uncovered so far. I think the obstruction charge is inevitable, and a virtual slam dunk. As to anything else, I am happy to just wait and see.
 

Rawley

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Yea, that would be wrong because Biden won't be indicting anyone. Not his job. And of course, neither he nor his handlers have made one comment about whether or not Trump will be indicted. So that's 2 swings and misses.

My belief that he will be indicted is based upon the information/evidence uncovered so far. I think the obstruction charge is inevitable, and a virtual slam dunk. As to anything else, I am happy to just wait and see.
Well, that's a deluded belief. Biden is leading you around by the nose. He will not indict Trump as it will ensure his reelection. Even my schnauzer understands that about politics.
 

jcgriff2

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.... He turned over 15 boxes back in June. They went through them and realized there were things unaccounted for and asked him for the missing items. How do you think they knew things were missing? You think they just got lucky that there was another 19 boxes on raid day?

Nope....they knew.
They never asked for items AFTER their visit to Florida in June. They raided instead.

According to Garland, he spent "months" agonizing over the decision on whether "to raid or not to raid". That is BS. Garland was not agonizing about anything other than what a cluster**** this would turn into. Garland was waiting for Biden's GO order as Biden likely wanted Trump out of town to prevent Trump from going to court on 'search day'; Biden wanted it done on a Friday so his state run media could churn this shit and play "what-if" all weekend until the courts opened on Monday.

Garland's "months" agonizing before the raid then takes us back before the DOJ/FBI visit in June meaning the search warrant could have been served that day in June but obviously was not.

Instead, as you mention, the FBI simply left the property knowing that other classified documents remained and per the FBI after the raid, were so sensitive that the security of the USA could be in jeopardy and they would need to do an assessment immediately. If these docs were that vital to national security why the hell would the FBI tell Trump to put a stronger lock on the door and leave?

Most likely because Biden, Garland, and the usual cast of democrat party characters involved in 'getting Trump at any cost - legal or illegal' for ~8 years now saw this as what they thought would be the perfect opportunity to set President Trump up. But as usual, for now anyway, it looks like the democrats have failed once again. A sitting president using the power of the DOJ and his office along with bugs, surveillance, maybe even drones, and who knows what else - all being used against a former and a likely future presidential opponent. Disgraceful. Biden's turn for intensive oversight is not all that far away now. That would be TV worth watching.

Go back and watch a movie on John DeLorean and how the FBI set him up, per a jury of his peers.

Why was the raid not done as soon as the grand jury granted the search warrant?

I mean all of those highly sensitive documents just sitting there at Trump's estate where anything could happen -- after intruders penetrated the various levels of US Secret Service protection, of course. It is very strange how your state-run media never mentions that fact - about the Secret Service always being there 24/7. Why is that?
 

Callen

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They never asked for items AFTER their visit to Florida in June. They raided instead.

According to Garland, he spent "months" agonizing over the decision on whether "to raid or not to raid". That is BS. Garland was not agonizing about anything other than what a cluster**** this would turn into. Garland was waiting for Biden's GO order as Biden likely wanted Trump out of town to prevent Trump from going to court on 'search day'; Biden wanted it done on a Friday so his state run media could churn this shit and play "what-if" all weekend until the courts opened on Monday.

Garland's "months" agonizing before the raid then takes us back before the DOJ/FBI visit in June meaning the search warrant could have been served that day in June but obviously was not.

Instead, as you mention, the FBI simply left the property knowing that other classified documents remained and per the FBI after the raid, were so sensitive that the security of the USA could be in jeopardy and they would need to do an assessment immediately. If these docs were that vital to national security why the hell would the FBI tell Trump to put a stronger lock on the door and leave?

Most likely because Biden, Garland, and the usual cast of democrat party characters involved in 'getting Trump at any cost - legal or illegal' for ~8 years now saw this as what they thought would be the perfect opportunity to set President Trump up. But as usual, for now anyway, it looks like the democrats have failed once again. A sitting president using the power of the DOJ and his office along with bugs, surveillance, maybe even drones, and who knows what else - all being used against a former and a likely future presidential opponent. Disgraceful. Biden's turn for intensive oversight is not all that far away now. That would be TV worth watching.

Go back and watch a movie on John DeLorean and how the FBI set him up, per a jury of his peers.

Why was the raid not done as soon as the grand jury granted the search warrant?

I mean all of those highly sensitive documents just sitting there at Trump's estate where anything could happen -- after intruders penetrated the various levels of US Secret Service protection, of course. It is very strange how your state-run media never mentions that fact - about the Secret Service always being there 24/7. Why is that?
Why didn't Trump just hand over all the documents upon receipt of the subpoena instead of having his lawyers provide a document which said they had made a thorough search and no more existed? If Trump believed any documents remaining belonged to him then he should have gone to court and fought the subpoena instead of lying about it to the DOJ. This mess is of his making and his making only.
 

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You should bring your complaint to the GSA. THey are the ones that packed up the WH.

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Anyone that has done either government personal moves or moves of government facilities (which I have done multiple times), knows that is an attempt at deflection.

Movers do not come in and perform inventory each individual item (each document, book, fork, plate, news clipping, magazine, etc.). Then generate a moving inventory.

The move itself is conducted on multiple phases (after contractors are hired):
  • Pre-Packing done by the customer using their own boxes or totes are with materials supplied in advance by the moving company.
  • Mover packing
  • Loading
  • Transportation
  • Unloading
Pre-Packing is done by the individual customer and may include packing up files, books, brac-a-brack and other miscellaneous items. They will pre-pack using materials supplied by the movers, banker boxes or plastic totes. It is the individuals responsibility to inventory individual items or documents that go into the pre-packed containers.

When movers pack they will inventory individual items such as filing cabinets, furniture items, large electronics (computers, monitors, T.V.'s, etc). However small items are boxed and it is the BOX that appears on their inventory. Let's take two examples:
  • You have 3 bookshelves with books. They will take the books out of the shelf, pack them in moving boxes, and label the box on the inventory with the box number and contents. For example "Item XXXX Box XXXX, Books from shelf 1". They DO NOT list each individual book by title they removed from the self. Then they wrap the shelves in packing materials and it goes on the inventory as something like "Item XXXX Bookshelf".
  • You have a filing cabinet with papers in it to be moved. You as the individual can pre-pack the cabinet draws to empty it. You place the contents in banker boxes or totes and label it however you want. The moving company will seal the box, affix their tracking label and inventory it, something along the lines of ""Item XXXX Box XXXX, pre-packed papers". The moving company DOES NOT take out the items and list each individually on an inventory they generate.
  • You have a filing cabinet with papers in it to be moved. There are a couple of options here depending on the movers. They may empty the contents into boxes, label them as a box of papers on their inventory and then move the empty cabinet. On the other hand they may just lock the cabinet drawers closed, wrap it in packing materials and move the whole cabinet contents and all as one item. The movers DO NOT, in neither case, detail on their inventory of each individual in the cabinet that was moves. Their inventory is about the general content and type of item being moved, not an detailed inventory of each individual document.
WW
 
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