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Trump gives us a good a reason why president' should divest themselves!

independentusa

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First, I am not saying that trump is guilty of anything. If he is, we will probably find that out if the Mueller report is ever made public. Trump and his business interests though, do point out why other president's have divested themselves or blind trusted themselves of their business interests. We do not know if Trump has put his business interests ahead of our nation's, but by not removing himself from them, he has at least created an image of such being the truth. We do not really know either if his seemingly worship of Putin is because Putin can put stop to the plans Trump has to build in Russia or if it is just Trump's admiration of the control Putin has over his government. that is something that trump seems to desire here in our country. Over all, the problem with a president continuing to control his business interests while in office will always lead to problems which may be substantive or not. It is why we need to have a law or a Amendment to our constitution requiring the president to both divest himself of business interests or place them in a truly blind trust and provide the American people with full tax returns so we can be assured that all presidents are doing America's business and not their own while in office.
 

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First, I am not saying that trump is guilty of anything. If he is, we will probably find that out if the Mueller report is ever made public. Trump and his business interests though, do point out why other president's have divested themselves or blind trusted themselves of their business interests. We do not know if Trump has put his business interests ahead of our nation's, but by not removing himself from them, he has at least created an image of such being the truth. We do not really know either if his seemingly worship of Putin is because Putin can put stop to the plans Trump has to build in Russia or if it is just Trump's admiration of the control Putin has over his government. that is something that trump seems to desire here in our country. Over all, the problem with a president continuing to control his business interests while in office will always lead to problems which may be substantive or not. It is why we need to have a law or a Amendment to our constitution requiring the president to both divest himself of business interests or place them in a truly blind trust and provide the American people with full tax returns so we can be assured that all presidents are doing America's business and not their own while in office.

I've highlighted some of your thoughts.

How do you know these things?

Why would his tax returns do anything for you?
 

BrainNebula

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First, I am not saying that trump is guilty of anything. If he is, we will probably find that out if the Mueller report is ever made public. Trump and his business interests though, do point out why other president's have divested themselves or blind trusted themselves of their business interests. We do not know if Trump has put his business interests ahead of our nation's, but by not removing himself from them, he has at least created an image of such being the truth. We do not really know either if his seemingly worship of Putin is because Putin can put stop to the plans Trump has to build in Russia or if it is just Trump's admiration of the control Putin has over his government. that is something that trump seems to desire here in our country. Over all, the problem with a president continuing to control his business interests while in office will always lead to problems which may be substantive or not. It is why we need to have a law or a Amendment to our constitution requiring the president to both divest himself of business interests or place them in a truly blind trust and provide the American people with full tax returns so we can be assured that all presidents are doing America's business and not their own while in office.

Yeah, lets make it so expensive for anybody competent to become President that all we end up with are incompetent career politicians. Great idea.
 

Mycroft

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First, I am not saying that trump is guilty of anything. If he is, we will probably find that out if the Mueller report is ever made public. Trump and his business interests though, do point out why other president's have divested themselves or blind trusted themselves of their business interests. We do not know if Trump has put his business interests ahead of our nation's, but by not removing himself from them, he has at least created an image of such being the truth. We do not really know either if his seemingly worship of Putin is because Putin can put stop to the plans Trump has to build in Russia or if it is just Trump's admiration of the control Putin has over his government. that is something that trump seems to desire here in our country. Over all, the problem with a president continuing to control his business interests while in office will always lead to problems which may be substantive or not. It is why we need to have a law or a Amendment to our constitution requiring the president to both divest himself of business interests or place them in a truly blind trust and provide the American people with full tax returns so we can be assured that all presidents are doing America's business and not their own while in office.

It seems that discussing reasonable issues is impossible for some people without injecting spin, speculation, innuendo and hyperbole. Not even for you.

I won't highlight the nonsense in your post. code1211 already did that. I'll just say that I tend to agree with your basic premise, but I won't discuss it with you until you abandon your bias injection.
 

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I've highlighted some of your thoughts.

How do you know these things?

Why would his tax returns do anything for you?

We know Trump was working on his Trump Tower Moscow deal well into his campaign when he was regularly using endearing language toward Putin (which also doubled Republican support for Putin, which means that they were being influenced by a candidate whose true motive was personal profit).

And of course there's always this:

"Saudi Arabia, I get along with all of them. They buy apartments from me. They spend $40 million, $50 million," Trump said during a presidential campaign rally in Alabama in August 2015.

"Am I supposed to dislike them? I like them very much."

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/16/tru...nterests-in-saudi-arabia-but-makes-money.html

These two leaders, Vladimir Putin and Mohammad Bin Salman Al Saud, have literally never received an unkind word from Trump, which is entirely unique to his treatment of everybody else.

To suppose that his personal profit isn't guiding his international policy is a demonstration of naivete that I have no words for.
 

Cardinal

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As always, in order to remember that nothing about what Trump is doing is even remotely normal or acceptable, we need to assign the same actions to Obama:

"So if Obama, running for President in 2008, is secretly working on a business deal with the Iranian Government to build a resort in Tehran, from which he'd benefit financially, he never mentions the deal, but he oddly praises the Iranian regime throughout the campaign, that would've been ok?"

https://twitter.com/WalshFreedom/status/1068517048550977536

Sadly, we have to keep doing this because Trump is being graded on a curve rather than by the same standard that past Presidents have been judged.
 

FreedomFromAll

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I've highlighted some of your thoughts.

How do you know these things?

Why would his tax returns do anything for you?

Trump asserted that there is no reason that he needs to divest himself from his business and further asserted that he can do both; run the country and his business.

Observing and listening to Trump, he at very least has high respect and praise for Putin. Helsinki...Trump practically acted like a Putin groupy.

Trump told us that he wanted an authoritarian leader in the US that held the position for a lifetime. Everyone heard Trump say it when XI become the permanent ruler of China.


These things are facts, denying them as facts would be an insult to the basic intelligence of all Americans. In other words Americans are smart enough to see these things and remember them. You cannot lie to us and think that, that will work. That ship sailed long a go. You need to face the reality that Trump is everything that the OP asserted and worse. And also you need to realize that while Trump lies to his base and they eat it up because of 'policy politics', those same lies are easily seen by everyone else. For all the lying that Trumps does you would think that he would be good at it by now at his age. Instead his lies are grade school level crap that makes people scratch their heads wondering why Trump would believe that no one would notice his lies. I figure that no one in any of his circles are brave enough to confront Trump on his lies. So Trump foolishly thinks that his lies work. No one gives him critical criticism since he will fire those that do not treat him the way he wants to be treated.

The part that gets me is that we knew most of this about Trump before he even ran for the Oval office, yet people voted for him? ANd the irony is that fly over America voted for a lying sack of city slicker who does not give one **** about rural America. And they flock to him like Trump is a prophet all the while Trump is only using them and then never even worries about helping rural America. Fly over America is being burned by Trump and I suspect eventually they will act as if they always hated Trump, hell even the most diehard Trump supporters will soon pretend that they were never really Trump supporters just anti-liberal (they voted against Hillary and nothing more).
 

code1211

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We know Trump was working on his Trump Tower Moscow deal well into his campaign when he was regularly using endearing language toward Putin (which also doubled Republican support for Putin, which means that they were being influenced by a candidate whose true motive was personal profit).

And of course there's always this:

"Saudi Arabia, I get along with all of them. They buy apartments from me. They spend $40 million, $50 million," Trump said during a presidential campaign rally in Alabama in August 2015.

"Am I supposed to dislike them? I like them very much."

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/16/tru...nterests-in-saudi-arabia-but-makes-money.html

These two leaders, Vladimir Putin and Mohammad Bin Salman Al Saud, have literally never received an unkind word from Trump, which is entirely unique to his treatment of everybody else.

To suppose that his personal profit isn't guiding his international policy is a demonstration of naivete that I have no words for.

So another non-Democrat is Presumed Guilty before evidence is introduced.

Good for you!

The guy is a billionaire and over 70 years of age.

If personal profit was his goal, he would just keep on working outside of government. He seems to have done pretty well.

He's not a Clinton after all. His income has not depended on selling influence available only as a stolen by-product of his elected office.

In the case of Trump, his net worth has fallen like a stone in a pond since he started his run for President. Your belief seems to be based on nothing at all except your bias.

https://www.forbes.com/donald-trump/#c42af2928992

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danale...gto-get-rich-off-his-presidency/#c686e823b1aa
 

Cardinal

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So another non-Democrat is Presumed Guilty before evidence is introduced.

Good for you!

The guy is a billionaire and over 70 years of age.

If personal profit was his goal, he would just keep on working outside of government. He seems to have done pretty well.

He's not a Clinton after all. His income has not depended on selling influence available only as a stolen by-product of his elected office.

In the case of Trump, his net worth has fallen like a stone in a pond since he started his run for President. Your belief seems to be based on nothing at all except your bias.

https://www.forbes.com/donald-trump/#c42af2928992

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danale...gto-get-rich-off-his-presidency/#c686e823b1aa

Assuming personal profit was not his goal because he went into government presupposes an adherence to traditional norms, which is clearly not what's happening here.
 

code1211

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Trump asserted that there is no reason that he needs to divest himself from his business and further asserted that he can do both; run the country and his business.

Observing and listening to Trump, he at very least has high respect and praise for Putin. Helsinki...Trump practically acted like a Putin groupy.

Trump told us that he wanted an authoritarian leader in the US that held the position for a lifetime. Everyone heard Trump say it when XI become the permanent ruler of China.


These things are facts, denying them as facts would be an insult to the basic intelligence of all Americans. In other words Americans are smart enough to see these things and remember them. You cannot lie to us and think that, that will work. That ship sailed long a go. You need to face the reality that Trump is everything that the OP asserted and worse. And also you need to realize that while Trump lies to his base and they eat it up because of 'policy politics', those same lies are easily seen by everyone else. For all the lying that Trumps does you would think that he would be good at it by now at his age. Instead his lies are grade school level crap that makes people scratch their heads wondering why Trump would believe that no one would notice his lies. I figure that no one in any of his circles are brave enough to confront Trump on his lies. So Trump foolishly thinks that his lies work. No one gives him critical criticism since he will fire those that do not treat him the way he wants to be treated.

The part that gets me is that we knew most of this about Trump before he even ran for the Oval office, yet people voted for him? ANd the irony is that fly over America voted for a lying sack of city slicker who does not give one **** about rural America. And they flock to him like Trump is a prophet all the while Trump is only using them and then never even worries about helping rural America. Fly over America is being burned by Trump and I suspect eventually they will act as if they always hated Trump, hell even the most diehard Trump supporters will soon pretend that they were never really Trump supporters just anti-liberal (they voted against Hillary and nothing more).

You seem like the kind of person that voted for Obama twice. Did you enjoy it when your healthcare premiums decreased by $2500 per year? That lie, by your standards, should have made you vote for Romney.

He was joking about the term of the Chinese President. What is it with you guys?

Trump has asked on a few occasions what the proper response to Putin might be. What do you suggest?

Full on Defcon1 with a Nuclear strike or Obama's approach: Hide under the bed wetting his pants. Which one do you recommend?
 

code1211

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Assuming personal profit was not his goal because he went into government presupposes an adherence to traditional norms, which is clearly not what's happening here.

Clear to you and others consumed by hate and anger.

Do you have a link to the real world that supports your delusion?

His net worth is way down since he started his run.
 

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Clear to you and others consumed by hate and anger.

Do you have a link to the real world that supports your delusion?

His net worth is way down since he started his run.

Oh? What was his net worth when he started out in the White House and what is his net worth now?
 

Amelia

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So another non-Democrat is Presumed Guilty before evidence is introduced.

Good for you!

The guy is a billionaire and over 70 years of age.

If personal profit was his goal, he would just keep on working outside of government. He seems to have done pretty well.

He's not a Clinton after all. His income has not depended on selling influence available only as a stolen by-product of his elected office.

In the case of Trump, his net worth has fallen like a stone in a pond since he started his run for President. Your belief seems to be based on nothing at all except your bias.

https://www.forbes.com/donald-trump/#c42af2928992

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danale...gto-get-rich-off-his-presidency/#c686e823b1aa



His goal was attention, fame and glory with no scruples about how he achieved it, and no conscience about his dishonesty and corruption, and no expectation of accountability because he thinks as president he can obstruct and pardon himself and his loyal cronies out of anything.

And he has spent the last nearly two years chafing, ranting, stewing, pouting at how people keep on his tail in spite of his attempts to shut down or slow walk investigations into the improprieties of members of his circle.

His water carriers keep deflecting for him -- God love ya -- but he remains surprised and offended that our government agencies and the rest of the world aren't playing yes men to him the way he has come to expect his associates and local governments to do for the past several decades.
 

Amelia

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Oh? What was his net worth when he started out in the White House and what is his net worth now?

Hard to know what his net worth was since he lied about it to try to make himself look more successful than he was.

Nothing is too big or too small for that scumbag to lie about.
 

Cardinal

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Hard to know what his net worth was since he lied about it to try to make himself look more successful than he was.

Nothing is too big or too small for that scumbag to lie about.

My point exactly. What he is worth is at this point is all smoke and mirrors.
 

code1211

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Oh? What was his net worth when he started out in the White House and what is his net worth now?

Seems a little late to allow actual real world facts to infect your opinions, but here you go.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danale...gto-get-rich-off-his-presidency/#c686e823b1aa
<snip>
For now, though, Trump’s presidency remains a net loser for him, which seems ironic. In not divesting, he set himself up so that his actions, and those of people who engage with his businesses, present perpetual conflicts of interest—or the appearance of them. Meanwhile, if he’d liquidated, paid capital gains tax on his entire fortune and created a blind trust to invest it all in the booming stock market, Trump would be $500 million richer than he is today—without the headaches.
<snip>
 

Cardinal

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Seems a little late to allow actual real world facts to infect your opinions, but here you go.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danale...gto-get-rich-off-his-presidency/#c686e823b1aa
<snip>
For now, though, Trump’s presidency remains a net loser for him, which seems ironic. In not divesting, he set himself up so that his actions, and those of people who engage with his businesses, present perpetual conflicts of interest—or the appearance of them. Meanwhile, if he’d liquidated, paid capital gains tax on his entire fortune and created a blind trust to invest it all in the booming stock market, Trump would be $500 million richer than he is today—without the headaches.
<snip>

You didn't answer the question. What was his net worth before, and what is it now?
 

code1211

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His goal was attention, fame and glory with no scruples about how he achieved it, and no conscience about his dishonesty and corruption, and no expectation of accountability because he thinks as president he can obstruct and pardon himself and his loyal cronies out of anything.

And he has spent the last nearly two years chafing, ranting, stewing, pouting at how people keep on his tail in spite of his attempts to shut down or slow walk investigations into the improprieties of members of his circle.

His water carriers keep deflecting for him -- God love ya -- but he remains surprised and offended that our government agencies and the rest of the world aren't playing yes men to him the way he has come to expect his associates and local governments to do for the past several decades.

What on Earth has he done to slow down anything?

He has delivered more than a million documents to Mueller.
 

JustHanging

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First, I am not saying that trump is guilty of anything. If he is, we will probably find that out if the Mueller report is ever made public. Trump and his business interests though, do point out why other president's have divested themselves or blind trusted themselves of their business interests. We do not know if Trump has put his business interests ahead of our nation's, but by not removing himself from them, he has at least created an image of such being the truth. We do not really know either if his seemingly worship of Putin is because Putin can put stop to the plans Trump has to build in Russia or if it is just Trump's admiration of the control Putin has over his government. that is something that trump seems to desire here in our country. Over all, the problem with a president continuing to control his business interests while in office will always lead to problems which may be substantive or not. It is why we need to have a law or a Amendment to our constitution requiring the president to both divest himself of business interests or place them in a truly blind trust and provide the American people with full tax returns so we can be assured that all presidents are doing America's business and not their own while in office.

Avoiding conflict of interest is the ethical thing to do. Which is why Trump and family didn't do it.
 

code1211

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You didn't answer the question. What was his net worth before, and what is it now?

More than yours before and more than yours now.

Now, less than his before. About half a billion less.

Why is this so consuming for you?

If his net worth increased, it would prove corruption for you. Does the decrease of net worth also prove corruption?

What is it with you guys?
 

Cardinal

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More than yours before and more than yours now.

Now, less than his before. About half a billion less.

Why is this so consuming for you?

If his net worth increased, it would prove corruption for you. Does the decrease of net worth also prove corruption?

What is it with you guys?

So in other words, you have no idea what his net worth ever was.

Anyway, it's irrelevant in any case, because outcome is not equal to intent. If I attempted to rob a bank but wasn't able to get away with the money, would I be innocent due to being unable to successfully rob the bank?
 

Risky Thicket

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More than yours before and more than yours now.

Now, less than his before. About half a billion less.

Why is this so consuming for you?

If his net worth increased, it would prove corruption for you. Does the decrease of net worth also prove corruption?

What is it with you guys?

Give us valid financials and dates. You made the statement. If you are going to stand by it you can back it up. Document what you know.
 

code1211

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Give us valid financials and dates. You made the statement. If you are going to stand by it you can back it up. Document what you know.

I provided a link.

Read it.
 

JustHanging

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Seems a little late to allow actual real world facts to infect your opinions, but here you go.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danale...gto-get-rich-off-his-presidency/#c686e823b1aa
<snip>
For now, though, Trump’s presidency remains a net loser for him, which seems ironic. In not divesting, he set himself up so that his actions, and those of people who engage with his businesses, present perpetual conflicts of interest—or the appearance of them. Meanwhile, if he’d liquidated, paid capital gains tax on his entire fortune and created a blind trust to invest it all in the booming stock market, Trump would be $500 million richer than he is today—without the headaches.
<snip>

Trump lies so much, how would anyone know? Remember when he pretended to be someone else to lie about his wealth?

That time Trump claimed to be 'John Barron' to lie about his wealth


It's hard to say how much a flimflam man like Trump will make as POTUS, but I would bet a lot. Did the Saudis pay him to be their bottom boy over the journalist murder?

What was the payoff to Trump for being Putin's bottom boy, and standing united with him against America's interests, and the entire American Intelligence Community? Or was Trump just being useful idiot? Hard to say, as according to so many of his top staff he is either an idiot, or a moron, take your choice. (Not that I don't give him credit for being a first class con man. Daddy certainly raised him "right" for that occupation.)
 
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I provided a link.

Read it.

You provided the link which would supposedly support your position, so copy and paste the exact paragraph or paragraphs from the article detailing his exact net worth before he was President versus now.
 
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