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Trump announces commission to further 'patriotic education'

ClaraD said:
blacks were in the Americas before the first Englishman set foot here. I am sorry that you cannot fathom that, but it is quite true. The very first documented black person to set foot in the Americas was Juan Garrido. He was in the company of Ponce De Leon in the search of the Fountain of Youth in 1513..that occurred around St Augustine, Florida.

www.capecodtimes.com

Black Pilgrims key to Plymouth’s success

From 1623 to 1640, Colonists of black ancestry arrived in Plymouth Colony. How they came to Plymouth is still a mystery. Some clacks may have come from Virginia or from English colonies in the Caribb…
www.capecodtimes.com
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The USA didn't evolve out of the Spanish colonial system. So the importance of de Leon, and other Spanish conquisadors, is limited to as people who explored and mapped out aspects of what became the USA. Stuff like Mr. Garrido was also present isn't really relevant to anything in a basic, general core survey of US history, beyond local trivia in Florida.
 
ClaraD said:
blacks were in the Americas before the first Englishman set foot here. I am sorry that you cannot fathom that, but it is quite true. The very first documented black person to set foot in the Americas was Juan Garrido. He was in the company of Ponce De Leon in the search of the Fountain of Youth in 1513..that occurred around St Augustine, Florida.

www.capecodtimes.com

Black Pilgrims key to Plymouth’s success

From 1623 to 1640, Colonists of black ancestry arrived in Plymouth Colony. How they came to Plymouth is still a mystery. Some clacks may have come from Virginia or from English colonies in the Caribb…
www.capecodtimes.com
Click to expand...

Juan Garrido wasn't a slave, so I'm not sure what your point is.
 
ClaraD said:
ah Jack, why did you run so soon...do you still want to keep your head in the sand and believe that Plymouth Rock was all whites and no black and that only white people were here? Do you want to try to deny that black people were here before the first English fool sat foot on this land? Do you really want to deny the nonsense that was argued by the founders over slavery?
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No denial here. Just a dislike of inaccuracy and dishonesty, even in service of a defensible cause.
 
🍿 <-- Me watching this train wreck of a conversation on what Communism is.
 
Jack Hays said:
The great lie is the claim that slavery was the central motive of the founding of the U.S. In support of that lie the 1619 project relies on numerous falsehoods. As Wilentz writes:
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So the great lie was that it was the "central" motive, and not just one motive.

OK, and the 1619 project has already corrected that great lie. So your work is done!

FWIW, if the 1619 project errs by ascribing slavery a 'central' role to the founding and to hundreds of years of history in what is now the U.S. it only does the flip side of what 'traditional' American history has done, which is all but ignore slavery except for pesky civil war, which I learned in school wasn't about slavery at all but about states' rights. I was in my 30s before I read the Cornerstone Speech or the declarations of secession and other writings of that time that make it clear that it was slavery, the end, that motivated secession and what followed.

And much of the criticism you post isn't about the facts of that history but how to interpret it. I think you've read quite a bit of history, so you know that scholars have serious disputes about that all the time. It's like conservatives and liberals debating income taxes.
 
Jack Hays said:
You betray your ignorance by not noticing the long quotations from some of our most eminent historians.
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"“I was surprised, as many other people were, by the scope of this thing, especially since it’s going to become the basis for high school education and has the authority of the New York Times behind it, and yet it is so wrong in so many ways.”

The bolded doesn't identify a 'great lie.' And what he believed it got wrong in part was his subjective opinion about the importance of slavery, whether it's part of our "DNA" or not. Subjective differences of opinion also don't identify a 'great lie.'
 
JasperL said:
So the great lie was that it was the "central" motive, and not just one motive.

OK, and the 1619 project has already corrected that great lie. So your work is done!

FWIW, if the 1619 project errs by ascribing slavery a 'central' role to the founding and to hundreds of years of history in what is now the U.S. it only does the flip side of what 'traditional' American history has done, which is all but ignore slavery except for pesky civil war, which I learned in school wasn't about slavery at all but about states' rights. I was in my 30s before I read the Cornerstone Speech or the declarations of secession and other writings of that time that make it clear that it was slavery, the end, that motivated secession and what followed.

And much of the criticism you post isn't about the facts of that history but how to interpret it. I think you've read quite a bit of history, so you know that scholars have serious disputes about that all the time. It's like conservatives and liberals debating income taxes.
Click to expand...
JasperL said:
"“I was surprised, as many other people were, by the scope of this thing, especially since it’s going to become the basis for high school education and has the authority of the New York Times behind it, and yet it is so wrong in so many ways.”

The bolded doesn't identify a 'great lie.' And what he believed it got wrong in part was his subjective opinion about the importance of slavery, whether it's part of our "DNA" or not. Subjective differences of opinion also don't identify a 'great lie.'
Click to expand...
Sorry, but nothing has really been corrected, certainly not at the clarion-call level of the original presentation. And yes, this is about interpretation, as is all history. And yes, the 1619 Project encompasses falsehoods in support of its interpretation. Those are so glaring they call into question the good faith of the authors and justify characterizing their work as a "great lie."
 
Rexedgar said:
President Trump on Thursday described America’s heritage and history as under assault from the left, decrying anti-racism teachings and "cancel culture" while announcing plans for a new commission to promote "patriotic education" in U.S. schools.
In a speech delivered in somber tones at the National Archives Museum, Trump painted a dramatic and dark portrait of an effort by liberals to “indoctrinate” America’s children and repress American values, culture and faith.


Trump announces commission to further '''patriotic education'''


This is disturbing on multiple levels.
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Rexedgar said:
President Trump on Thursday described America’s heritage and history as under assault from the left, decrying anti-racism teachings and "cancel culture" while announcing plans for a new commission to promote "patriotic education" in U.S. schools.
In a speech delivered in somber tones at the National Archives Museum, Trump painted a dramatic and dark portrait of an effort by liberals to “indoctrinate” America’s children and repress American values, culture and faith.


Trump announces commission to further '''patriotic education'''


This is disturbing on multiple levels.
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Does anyone have any actual Details on what trump wants taught in schools? Do they want to replace what he calls propaganda and indoctrination with a different form of the same?
 
I think the “1776 Commission” is another grand idea that Trump thinks sounds good. Ironic that one of the most history ignorant POTUS’, it touting teaching history.
We will hear about the detail just after his healthcare plan.....

www.npr.org

Trump Announces 'Patriotic Education' Commission, A Largely Political Move

Trump decries what he says are a "twisted web of lies" being taught in U.S. classrooms about systemic racism in America. But the federal government does not have jurisdiction over school curriculum.
www.npr.org www.npr.org
 
Integrityrespec said:
It's disturbing to left wing fascist who are working hard to eliminate any views or historical accounts that don't follow the leftist doctrine.
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Please quit using the word "fascist" if you are oblivious to its meaning. It makes you look like a silly zealot.
 
Jack Hays said:
Sorry, but nothing has really been corrected, certainly not at the clarion-call level of the original presentation. And yes, this is about interpretation, as is all history. And yes, the 1619 Project encompasses falsehoods in support of its interpretation. Those are so glaring they call into question the good faith of the authors and justify characterizing their work as a "great lie."
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I see, so they did correct the claim, but it wasn't public enough or something? Should there be a public shaming?

You don't agree with..... something, so it's a "great lie." That's the bottom line. And to prove it you have a bunch of bare links of people who agree with YOU, and ignore those who take a different view. GOOD FAITH on your part!!
 
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apdst said:
I said great, not perfect. No country is perfect, but The United States has gotten closer than anyone else.
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It's no reason not to always aim for better or constantly try to grow. That's how the United States has gotten closer than anyone else. You can only do that by constantly keeping your eyes and ears open to new information and new ways of seeing and doing things, by being open to learning, and honest self-evaluation and self-criticism, not by blind hero-worship or idealizing and romanticizing some mythical golden past- that way only lies stagnation and degradation.
 
ataraxia said:
It's no reason not to always aim for better or constantly try to grow. That's how the United States has gotten closer than anyone else. You can only do that by constantly keeping your eyes and ears open to new information and new ways of seeing and doing things, by being open to learning, and honest self-evaluation and self-criticism, not by blind hero-worship or idealizing and romanticizing some mythical golden past- that way only lies stagnation and degradation.
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Inserting the 1619 Project into school curricula isn't "doing better". It's doing worse.

Focusing strictly on the bad and ignoring the good isn't doing better.
 
JasperL said:
So the great lie was that it was the "central" motive, and not just one motive.

OK, and the 1619 project has already corrected that great lie. So your work is done!

FWIW, if the 1619 project errs by ascribing slavery a 'central' role to the founding and to hundreds of years of history in what is now the U.S. it only does the flip side of what 'traditional' American history has done, which is all but ignore slavery except for pesky civil war, which I learned in school wasn't about slavery at all but about states' rights. I was in my 30s before I read the Cornerstone Speech or the declarations of secession and other writings of that time that make it clear that it was slavery, the end, that motivated secession and what followed.

And much of the criticism you post isn't about the facts of that history but how to interpret it. I think you've read quite a bit of history, so you know that scholars have serious disputes about that all the time. It's like conservatives and liberals debating income taxes.
Click to expand...

Slavery wasn't ignored at the school I went to.
 
Casper said:
Does anyone have any actual Details on what trump wants taught in schools? Do they want to replace what he calls propaganda and indoctrination with a different form of the same?
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You won’t see a commission.

You won’t see any “details”

This is a throwaway to a Trumpster mob.

That’s all. It was intended to play to white resentment.

And, if you’ve been following this thread, it worked on the target audience.
 
TomFitz said:
You won’t see a commission.

You won’t see any “details”

This is a throwaway to a Trumpster mob.

That’s all. It was intended to play to white resentment.

And, if you’ve been following this thread, it worked on the target audience.
Click to expand...

What is "white resentment"?
 
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