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Transgender Victoria Secret Model - Breaking Down Barriers

Fledermaus said:
Biologically this person is _________________?

The DNA is of a _____________?
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Human sexuality is more complicated than your simplistic binary arguments. You could use the same argument to deny homosexuality.

What gender is a person who has XXY chromones?
 
Lisa said:
Human sexuality is more complicated than your simplistic binary arguments. You could use the same argument to deny homosexuality.

What gender is a person who has XXY chromones?
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Biologically THIS PERSON is _________________?

The DNA OF THIS PERSON is of a _____________?
 
Lisa said:
Many CIS females have had collagen injections
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Many cis women also have nose jobs and other cosmetic surgery. Men tend to have thin lips too. I imagine she paid a lot of money
 
SheWolf said:
Many cis women also have nose jobs and other cosmetic surgery. Men tend to have thin lips too. I imagine she paid a lot of money
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The combined treatment for gender identity isn't cheap but facial surgery is often not needed if the transition occurs early in life before the bone structure matures.
 
Fledermaus said:
Your inability to answer simple questions is noted.
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You want a simple answer to a complex problem. Human sexuality and psychology are complex. Did you take any psych' courses for your liberal arts requirements?
 
Lisa said:
You want a simple answer to a complex problem. Human sexuality and psychology are complex. Did you take any psych' courses for your liberal arts requirements?
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Why can't you accept that this person is biologically male and that if he wants to be called a she and wants to dress as a women and act like a women that no one here cares if he chooses to do so and that we can all be polite and respectful and call him a her or he a she and we can all get along.
You'll find the only push back on the subject to be when someone enters into a field were women and men are held to different standards such as competitive sports that are segregated by gender.
 
There is a boy transitioning to a girl in one of my classes... well, there are about 6 transitioning students over all... but this one I had no idea she was a guy, biologically... looks and acts absolutely like a teenage girl and the girls accept jher
 
jdog21 said:
Why can't you accept that this person is biologically male and that if he wants to be called a she and wants to dress as a women and act like a women that no one here cares if he chooses to do so and that we can all be polite and respectful and call him her or he she and we can all get along.
You'll find the only push back on the subject to be when someone enters into a field were women and men are held to different standards such as competitive sports that are segregated by gender.
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Trans people are not delusional about their gender identity, nor it is a choice, despite what you are trying to argue. Their DNA does not determine their sexuality or their gender identity. I've seen this BS argument before by people who refuse to understand details.

The ignorance and refusal to understand a complicated subject does mean that this does not exist and that she is creating a medical situation that does not exist.
 
Lisa said:
Do you ask to see a person's DNA when you meet them? Do you ask to see their genitals before you say hello or shake their hand?

We do not experience the world as our DNA. Trans people would love to be able to change their DNA but that is not possible, so they accept what is possible to allow them to live in some people with their physical body. If you have a better idea that is better than the current med-psych treatment then why don't you put it forth for others to examine?
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My only concern is female athletics. Trans men are taking a banned drug in sports, testosterone and trans women already have or had the testosterone levels of men.
 
hanger4 said:
The DNA doesn't change, regardless of hormone therapy or surgery.
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No one claimed it did. You did claim biology, and I pointed out that transgenderism is caused biologically, to which you then denied saying biology. I corrected you. And so your response is to say something unrelated and hope no one notices.
 
hanger4 said:
It's about whether she's a she or she's a he and she's a he and always will be regardless of hormone therapy or surgery.

What they wish to be call is fine, but it doesn't make it so.
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Well, that is entirely contextual. The best pronoun to use when dealing with some one is whichever they prefer, unless you are trying to be a douche. Genetics only matters if you do a gene test. If you meet some one out in the world, they act and dress and look in what is generally seen as a feminine manner, that person is, in every way that matters to anyone, a she.
 
Bodhisattva said:
There is a boy transitioning to a girl in one of my classes... well, there are about 6 transitioning students over all... but this one I had no idea she was a guy, biologically... looks and acts absolutely like a teenage girl and the girls accept jher
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Kids can be amazing sometimes. When I was a kid, the fact my sister and I had a gay mom was a big deal. By the time my little half brother went to school 10 years later, kids knew about gays, knew gay people, and really thought of gay people as just people.

Though I will say, I just found out one of the guys I served with in the navy is now a woman. There are pictures from the reunion the squadron alumni group help, bunches of old grizzled guys and one woman with lots of makeup and a nice dress. Apparently no one cared that she used to be male. Maybe there is hope for the world...
 
Lisa said:
Our chromones do not determine our psychological gender identity, so stop using our DNA to try to refuse trans people existing as natural and not as a choice. Trans people have always existed.

You want to hate them and you want to try to claim that they choose to be trans so as to legitimatize your disapproval and bigotry.
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I haven't refused trans people anything especially their right to exist.

Your second paragraph is just argumentum ad hominem, therefore dismissed.
 
Redress said:
Kids can be amazing sometimes. When I was a kid, the fact my sister and I had a gay mom was a big deal. By the time my little half brother went to school 10 years later, kids knew about gays, knew gay people, and really thought of gay people as just people.

Though I will say, I just found out one of the guys I served with in the navy is now a woman. There are pictures from the reunion the squadron alumni group help, bunches of old grizzled guys and one woman with lots of makeup and a nice dress. Apparently no one cared that she used to be male. Maybe there is hope for the world...
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There was a kid named Louis in our grade school back around 1980. He wore make-up, etc. Since all the transgender/transitioning stuff this last decade is so main stream I have thought of him and what he might have done. We have new kids every year, and like I said a bunch at the same time (high school) that are transitioning, etc and the other kids always seem cool with it. I never hear bullying and it is never reported. They just hang out together like kids.
 
Obviously Victoria Secret marketing team believes that using a biological male will help them sell products. If it increases L Brands stock value and profits then great move.

You don't believe this is anything more than that do you?
 
Bodhisattva said:
There was a kid named Louis in our grade school back around 1980. He wore make-up, etc. Since all the transgender/transitioning stuff this last decade is so main stream I have thought of him and what he might have done. We have new kids every year, and like I said a bunch at the same time (high school) that are transitioning, etc and the other kids always seem cool with it. I never hear bullying and it is never reported. They just hang out together like kids.
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When I met my first trans person, I was 19 and never even heard of such a thing. World changes so fast...
 
Lisa said:
Trans people are not delusional about their gender identity, nor it is a choice, despite what you are trying to argue. Their DNA does not determine their sexuality or their gender identity. I've seen this BS argument before by people who refuse to understand details.

The ignorance and refusal to understand a complicated subject does mean that this does not exist and that she is creating a medical situation that does not exist.
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I don't care if they are delusional about there identity or not, nor do I care if its something they chose or born into. Someone identity isn't defined by their gender either, identity is a state of mind and as such is fluid.
It doesn't change the fact that you seem to be hung up on if someone understands you and society and people are under no obligation to understand you or care about you. Why do you still spout nonsense with out addressing the topic I put forth to you, this person is either XX or XY and it can not change. Once you accept reality only then you can move forward with societies deeper understanding.
 
Lisa said:
Our chromones do not determine our psychological gender identity, so stop using our DNA to try to refuse trans people existing as natural and not as a choice. Trans people have always existed.

You want to hate them and you want to try to claim that they choose to be trans so as to legitimatize your disapproval and bigotry.
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I have no objections to trans gender people. They should live what ever life they want.

Advances in medicine has made physical change more of an option. There are social and legal questions that have yet to be worked out. Not so much for models but in sports (pro and non pro) diversity goals, public facilities, schools able to handle transgenders, etc.

I have heard of this example before. Should a male who identifies as a women be allowed to compete against women in a sport? I have read articles that say if a male takes the proper drugs that the potential male advantage would not be a factor. Yet, in general males are just built different that females with or without the hormones. So I would not be in favor of a male transgender competing against women in sports.
 
Redress said:
Biology does not designate anything. The causes of transgenderism are biological.
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And environmental. Neither of which should be held to lower acceptance as a primary cause, than the other.
 
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