Track Work Looms Over New York Penn Station This Summer

[JacksinPA]

https://www.wsj.com/articles/track-work-looms-over-new-york-penn-station-this-summer-11547996400

LIRR, NJ Transit and Amtrak look to minimize impact of repairs and avoid another ‘summer of hell’

The Long Island Rail Road, NJ Transit and Amtrak are in negotiations with one another over service reductions at New York Penn Station this summer that would allow for track repairs.

The railroads aren’t expecting to reduce service as significantly as they did for repair work in the summer of 2017, when tens of thousands of commuters were diverted to other stations, NJ Transit Executive Director Kevin Corbett said in an interview.
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Having lived in both NY City, Long Island & New Jersey, I'm very familiar with Penn Station. In order to condense the necessary trackage into the limited available space, the yard under the station makes extensive use of special track switches known as double slip switches. Trainmen also refer yo them as 'puzzle switches.' The one negative thing about these is the fact that they are very complex & need constant maintenance to avoid routing delays & derailments because of the constant beating they get from the trains of the 3 railroads.

These types of switches are common in European countries because a very large proportion of the population works for the railroads so they can afford to do constant maintenance.

 

[marke]

https://www.wsj.com/articles/track-work-looms-over-new-york-penn-station-this-summer-11547996400

LIRR, NJ Transit and Amtrak look to minimize impact of repairs and avoid another ‘summer of hell’

The Long Island Rail Road, NJ Transit and Amtrak are in negotiations with one another over service reductions at New York Penn Station this summer that would allow for track repairs.

The railroads aren’t expecting to reduce service as significantly as they did for repair work in the summer of 2017, when tens of thousands of commuters were diverted to other stations, NJ Transit Executive Director Kevin Corbett said in an interview.
==========================================================
Having lived in both NY City, Long Island & New Jersey, I'm very familiar with Penn Station. In order to condense the necessary trackage into the limited available space, the yard under the station makes extensive use of special track switches known as double slip switches. Trainmen also refer yo them as 'puzzle switches.' The one negative thing about these is the fact that they are very complex & need constant maintenance to avoid routing delays & derailments because of the constant beating they get from the trains of the 3 railroads.

These types of switches are common in European countries because a very large proportion of the population works for the railroads so they can afford to do constant maintenance.

It is a good thing the Lord is coming back soon. Global warming, human hatred for fellow humans, abortions, growing worldwide fiscal indebtedness, higher taxes, looming unfunded liabilities, collapsing aging infrastructures, overcrowding, declining natural resources and other things that alarm people may actually be serious threats to the continued existence of the human population on earth if no end is in sight.

 

[JacksinPA]

It is a good thing the Lord is coming back soon. Global warming, human hatred for fellow humans, abortions, growing worldwide fiscal indebtedness, higher taxes, looming unfunded liabilities, collapsing aging infrastructures, overcrowding, declining natural resources and other things that alarm people may actually be serious threats to the continued existence of the human population on earth if no end is in sight.

It's the same old story: too many people & the resulting competition for scarce resources.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

It is a good thing the Lord is coming back soon. Global warming, human hatred for fellow humans, abortions, growing worldwide fiscal indebtedness, higher taxes, looming unfunded liabilities, collapsing aging infrastructures, overcrowding, declining natural resources and other things that alarm people may actually be serious threats to the continued existence of the human population on earth if no end is in sight.

Oh, that? The lord already returned. Sorry you missed it.

 

[JacksinPA]

Oh, that? The lord already returned. Sorry you missed it.

If He could make everything in just 6 days, why not pray to have Him send some angels to fix Penn Station?

 

[JacksinPA]

Interesting track map of Penn Station's 'A Interlocking' & video clips of trains & track work in time lapse: https://media.amtrak.com/nyprenewal/

 

[Hawkeye10]

https://www.wsj.com/articles/track-work-looms-over-new-york-penn-station-this-summer-11547996400

LIRR, NJ Transit and Amtrak look to minimize impact of repairs and avoid another ‘summer of hell’

The Long Island Rail Road, NJ Transit and Amtrak are in negotiations with one another over service reductions at New York Penn Station this summer that would allow for track repairs.

The railroads aren’t expecting to reduce service as significantly as they did for repair work in the summer of 2017, when tens of thousands of commuters were diverted to other stations, NJ Transit Executive Director Kevin Corbett said in an interview.
==========================================================
Having lived in both NY City, Long Island & New Jersey, I'm very familiar with Penn Station. In order to condense the necessary trackage into the limited available space, the yard under the station makes extensive use of special track switches known as double slip switches. Trainmen also refer yo them as 'puzzle switches.' The one negative thing about these is the fact that they are very complex & need constant maintenance to avoid routing delays & derailments because of the constant beating they get from the trains of the 3 railroads.

These types of switches are common in European countries because a very large proportion of the population works for the railroads so they can afford to do constant maintenance.

Complete BS, what happened here was neglect/incompetence, which Amtrak is long known for:

An examination by The New York Times of what led up to the crisis — drawing on interviews with current and former Amtrak employees and state and federal officials, as well as a review of Amtrak records — found long-simmering tensions over how to keep up with maintenance at one of the world’s busiest train stations. By putting off repairs that it mistakenly believed were not critical, Amtrak set the stage for two of the derailments, which were caused by broken tracks on the west side of the station.

Amtrak says it responds with urgency to anything it views as a safety problem. But in interviews, some maintenance managers said essential repairs that were not flagged as “safety-critical” were often put off for months or even years. Some rail parts, including ones deemed at risk of imminent failure, were used long past their initial replacement dates, a 2016 document shows.

E. Keith Holt, a former Amtrak deputy chief engineer, said that when his colleagues pushed for replacement efforts, they were regularly told they would have to wait. “You can only put so many Band-Aids on,” he said. “Sooner or later that stuff catches up to you.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/09/nyregion/amtrak-penn-station-derailments.html

 

[OldFatGuy]

Oh, that? The lord already returned. Sorry you missed it.

She's still here, complaining the downtown scene isn't as much fun as it used to be. Everyone's too stressed out over the ridiculous.

 

[OldFatGuy]

Complete BS, what happened here was neglect/incompetence, which Amtrak is long known for:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/09/nyregion/amtrak-penn-station-derailments.html

And all that we will get is more bandaids. Nothing much will happen until plans for replacing Penn Station at the old Post Office site are finalized. Planning started a decade ago, and will continue for another decade before construction commences. Then the Billions of $$$ must be raised for the most immense railroad terminal construction project in history. Already, existing planning predicts a 30 year construction job before full completion. Since the facade of the Post Office is landmarked, design restrictions also must be accommodated. And NYC politics, along with that of surrounding regions will make for a local political feeding frenzy as contracts are awarded.

We forget how old much of the current terminal system is, and how well used. Amazing that it functions as well as it does, having been built from many independent lines that did not cooperate with each other. Amtrak is a minor aspect of Penn Station. The LIRR, Jersey Transit, Metronorth, the NYC subway system and introduction of new light rail technologies all must be accommodated and coordinated with new planned mass transit construction. Personally, I believe it will take a century or more. The Post Office site on Tenth Avenue at its back also offers the possibility of new Ferry connections and helicopter pads tho the river winds are notoriously treacherous. Part of this project also includes the construction of four new rail tunnels under the Hudson River and reconstruction of the Hell's Gate railway bridge (also landmarked).

Consider the new Second Avenue line was planned initially during the 1930's and construction didn't start until this century, at a cost of billions, and is yet to start the second phase, use your imagination for what to expect in reality.

 

[Hawkeye10]

And all that we will get is more bandaids. Nothing much will happen until plans for replacing Penn Station at the old Post Office site are finalized. Planning started a decade ago, and will continue for another decade before construction commences. Then the Billions of $$$ must be raised for the most immense railroad terminal construction project in history. Already, existing planning predicts a 30 year construction job before full completion. Since the facade of the Post Office is landmarked, design restrictions also must be accommodated. And NYC politics, along with that of surrounding regions will make for a local political feeding frenzy as contracts are awarded.

We forget how old much of the current terminal system is, and how well used. Amazing that it functions as well as it does, having been built from many independent lines that did not cooperate with each other. Amtrak is a minor aspect of Penn Station. The LIRR, Jersey Transit, Metronorth, the NYC subway system and introduction of new light rail technologies all must be accommodated and coordinated with new planned mass transit construction. Personally, I believe it will take a century or more. The Post Office site on Tenth Avenue at its back also offers the possibility of new Ferry connections and helicopter pads tho the river winds are notoriously treacherous. Part of this project also includes the construction of four new rail tunnels under the Hudson River and reconstruction of the Hell's Gate railway bridge (also landmarked).

Consider the new Second Avenue line was planned initially during the 1930's and construction didn't start until this century, at a cost of billions, and is yet to start the second phase, use your imagination for what to expect in reality.

Dont even get me started on the failure to deal with the Hudson River Tunnel situation....that is straight up dereliction of duty.

Do you know if the Penn Station interlockings and rails that needed emergency replacement had been left in place past their scheduled replacement date? I saw a report that they were more than 20 years old and with as much pounding as they take that seems like a lot.


Here's The 'Tangle And Mangle' Of Tracks Amtrak Will Try To Fix Under Penn Station This Summer: Gothamist

 

[OldFatGuy]

Dont even get me started on the failure to deal with the Hudson River Tunnel situation....that is straight up dereliction of duty.

Do you know if the Penn Station interlockings and rails that needed emergency replacement had been left in place past their scheduled replacement date? I saw a report that they were more than 20 years old and with as much pounding as they take that seems like a lot.


Here's The 'Tangle And Mangle' Of Tracks Amtrak Will Try To Fix Under Penn Station This Summer: Gothamist

20 years old? Some date back to the 1930's. Not just rails, but railbeds and heads, tunnel supports even older, signals and switches, wiring, ventilation and so forth. Amtrak is really the old bankrupt Penn Central. It was so large, the exploration of what was owned is still being inventoried decades after the bankruptcy. Missing filed maps and grants are commonplace. Anthony Claude, the attorney overseeing the inventory died 4 years ago and his notes are still being cataloged with no successor in place for a thankless job. Title Guarantee of NY was absorbed by Chicago Title after bankruptcy, as was Chicago, both who oversaw title investigations and their successors who bought out the remains abandoned the project for lack of payment. Their work was trashed. You can't have proper maintenance when no one knows who owns what and is responsible thereof. The government can't declare eminent domain for absolute fee title properties, and those original War Department grants granted Absolute Fee Title to the railroads. This is part of the reason why the decision was made to plan a replacement terminal and tracks. Amtrak is as much of a victim of history as the public. The potential costs of litigation would be greater than the soft costs of planning and not productive.

It is amazing the system functions as well as it does, let alone at all. After a recent gas main leak a tunnel no one knew existed was found directly under the supports for part of Madison Square Garden. The beams was so poorly rotted, another year or two the tunnel would have collapse taking Madison Square Stadium with it, right onto half the track system. No question about replacing the supports, they just poured layers of granite based cement into the tunnel, filling it to support the Stadium. Samples of the track found inside the tunnel were made from wood, indicating it was an early construction tunnel for the subway system at its earliest development. And the current Penn Station is not in the original location, this was a "modern" replacement.

Wait until they find one of those albino blind giant alligators roaming around down there. They do keep the homeless population down which pleases our Mayor.