Top ten reasons the Navy is the best service.

[Glen Contrarian]

It was Obama who sent a LCS to sea with the gun not working.

In todays PC Navy the only thing that matters is that the gender friendly commodes are working.

C'mon, AR - are you seriously going to claim that the president told the Secretary of the Navy and the JCS, "Yes, you will deploy that ship"? You know better than that! The president will say "yes" or "no" to the JCS and SecNav's recommendations to send an entire freaking carrier group here or there, or maybe even a sub on a particularly sensitive mission, but he's NOT going to say, "Deploy that LCS!" That's the province not even of SecNav, but of the admiral in charge of that particular fleet.

YES, the president is responsible overall for what the military does - but it's disingenuous to claim that he gave this or that particular order when it's obvious to any career sailor that to do so would have been a serious breach of military command protocol.

 

[APACHERAT]

Remember, I'd been in 16 years before I reported on board, and until then I really had believed that having women on board was a Bad Idea. So should I have stubbornly refused to believe my eyes and ears just so I could continue to think like yourself and "Navy Pride"?

The way I use to look at it, if a female sailor aboard ship was able to pull her own weight and accomplish the job, no problem. But if they were going to lower the standards like during battle damage control procedures where a female sailor couldn't carry a water pump up or down a ladder or two female sailors couldn't carry a body stretcher with an injured sailor up or down the ladder, I have a problem. I'm sure you know which fire water pumps I'm referring too. They are a bitch to carry and even a bigger bitch to get started.

You did read the USNI opinion article I have posted more than a few times on another threads just recently ? You served back when women were first being integrated aboard ships. It was new, it was social engineering, and as usual no one took the time to ask what would be the consequences ? In the beginning every thing seemed fine, because everyone kept their distance. No talking like a sailor around a female sailor. There was little if none fraternization with the opposite sex aboard ship.

But soon everyone got comfortable with women aboard ships and soon ships like the USS Lincoln became the USS Love Boat.
Now when that happened, it really pissed off the LGBT community. So they soon demanded the whole nine yards plus and extra foot or two.

 

[Glen Contrarian]

It was Obama who sent a LCS to sea with the gun not working.

In todays PC Navy the only thing that matters is that the gender friendly commodes are working.

BTW, when it comes to the "gender-friendly commodes", the guys on board were pretty ticked - me included - when they started removing urinals. We all thought it was a PC move. So I talked to the Hull Technicians about it. They politely informed me that it had nothing to do with 'PC', and everything to do with lessening their maintenance load since they were spending more time working on the effects of uric acid (undiluted by the water in a toilet) than they were working on the rest of the CHT system.

But feel free to ignore the HT's who actually did the work so you can blame things on Obama....

 

[Glen Contrarian]

The way I use to look at it, if a female sailor aboard ship was able to pull her own weight and accomplish the job, no problem. But if they were going to lower the standards like during battle damage control procedures where a female sailor couldn't carry a water pump up or down a ladder or two female sailors couldn't carry a body stretcher with an injured sailor up or down the ladder, I have a problem. I'm sure you know which fire water pumps I'm referring too. They are a bitch to carry and even a bigger bitch to get started.

You did read the USNI opinion article I have posted more than a few times on another threads just recently ? You served back when women were first being integrated aboard ships. It was new, it was social engineering, and as usual no one took the time to ask what would be the consequences ? In the beginning every thing seemed fine, because everyone kept their distance. No talking like a sailor around a female sailor. There was little if none fraternization with the opposite sex aboard ship.

But soon everyone got comfortable with women aboard ships and soon ships like the USS Lincoln became the USS Love Boat.
Now when that happened, it really pissed off the LGBT community. So they soon demanded the whole nine yards plus and extra foot or two.

Gotta go now - wife just came home - but be assured I'll get back to you on this one....

 

[APACHERAT]

C'mon, AR - are you seriously going to claim that the president told the Secretary of the Navy and the JCS, "Yes, you will deploy that ship"? You know better than that! The president will say "yes" or "no" to the JCS and SecNav's recommendations to send an entire freaking carrier group here or there, or maybe even a sub on a particularly sensitive mission, but he's NOT going to say, "Deploy that LCS!" That's the province not even of SecNav, but of the admiral in charge of that particular fleet.

YES, the president is responsible overall for what the military does - but it's disingenuous to claim that he gave this or that particular order when it's obvious to any career sailor that to do so would have been a serious breach of military command protocol.

I don't think Obama is competent enough to make timely decisions.
When Obama entered the White House the commanders requested a troop surge and it took Obama over three months to sign off on the surge.

The Navy SEALS were trained and ready to go after Osama bin Laden three months after we discovered where he was. For another three months according to three of the SEAL's who were on the team, they were ordered three times to stand down after getting the order to go. In the end the entire mission was dropped in Admirals McRavens lap and the White House was completely out of the loop.

Even during the overthrow of Qaddafi, Obama changed his mind two or three times. One day the Navy was in the fight the next day they were out of the fight then they were back in the fight.

Obama is an elitist and a narcissist. He refuses to have anyone serve under him who he thinks may be smarter or more competent than himself. He only wants yes men serving under his command. That's why the entire Obama administration is incompetent and second rate.

 

[APACHERAT]

BTW, when it comes to the "gender-friendly commodes", the guys on board were pretty ticked - me included - when they started removing urinals. We all thought it was a PC move. So I talked to the Hull Technicians about it. They politely informed me that it had nothing to do with 'PC', and everything to do with lessening their maintenance load since they were spending more time working on the effects of uric acid (undiluted by the water in a toilet) than they were working on the rest of the CHT system.

But feel free to ignore the HT's who actually did the work so you can blame things on Obama....

It was PC, even Congress asked if it was PC. The Clinton administration denied it was but Congress came to the conclusion that it was. The endgame was that Congress appropriated I think it was around $480 million dollars to switch over to PC commodes.

And as usual they didn't think of the consequences. A naval directive was issued to stop installing the PC commodes. It ends up women aboard ships use three times more water than men do when nature calls. The black water holding tanks aboard existing ships couldn't handle all of the extra waste water.

But all new ship construction will have friendly gender heads. (No pun intended in regards to repealing DADT.)

 

[Glen Contrarian]

The way I use to look at it, if a female sailor aboard ship was able to pull her own weight and accomplish the job, no problem. But if they were going to lower the standards like during battle damage control procedures where a female sailor couldn't carry a water pump up or down a ladder or two female sailors couldn't carry a body stretcher with an injured sailor up or down the ladder, I have a problem. I'm sure you know which fire water pumps I'm referring too. They are a bitch to carry and even a bigger bitch to get started.

Actually, my experience was just the opposite. Sure, there was the occasional female who couldn't carry her load, but for the most part, the women put more real effort into their jobs than the men did...because they felt they had to prove themselves in a man's world. This is not a new thing, either - many times in the years since I retired, for the most part I've seen women working harder than men - again, because they felt they had to prove themselves in a man's world. Yes, you and I and most other guys have physically stronger bodies and we can stand more physical pain...but in the everyday jobs, for the most part they worked harder and caused fewer problems than the guys. I'm sorry, but that's my first-hand experience.

You did read the USNI opinion article I have posted more than a few times on another threads just recently ? You served back when women were first being integrated aboard ships. It was new, it was social engineering, and as usual no one took the time to ask what would be the consequences ? In the beginning every thing seemed fine, because everyone kept their distance. No talking like a sailor around a female sailor. There was little if none fraternization with the opposite sex aboard ship.

But soon everyone got comfortable with women aboard ships and soon ships like the USS Lincoln became the USS Love Boat.
Now when that happened, it really pissed off the LGBT community. So they soon demanded the whole nine yards plus and extra foot or two.

Again, no offense, but my experience was just the opposite of what you posted. In the beginning, when women were first coming aboard, there were a lot of guys - usually the one's who had been in for some time and had gotten indoctrinated to the idea that women on ships was a very bad idea - who would do the catcalls and do the harassment regardless of the warnings of the command...and men and women were more likely to fraternize in the beginning - which is why I well remember all the (unconfirmed) rumors in the early '90's when I was on the Camden that a ship that did have women on it - the sub tender USS McKee, which was anchored in the port nearest Dubai - had had to send 10% of their female sailors home because of pregnancy. Again, the rumor was unconfirmed, but since it sounded good we all believed it.

When I arrived on the Lincoln, however, women had been on board for several years already - from when she was commissioned, I think. And as a result, the men seemed to be more aware of their boundaries. Remember my earlier statements that the men seemed better behaved - and I think this is one reason why. The men had learned not only what was off-limits and verboten, but had also learned, for instance, to take care to not be alone with a female sailor behind locked doors - that was a big no-no. At first that seemed like a pain in the ass, but after a while it wasn't a hindrance at all - there was always a spare sailor around to be a third-party stand-in.

AR, I know all this runs counter to what you sincerely believe - and what you've heard from many others - but I've seen both sides of the story, and this is my first-hand experience. Life is better with women around. Vive la differance!

 

[Glen Contrarian]

It was PC, even Congress asked if it was PC. The Clinton administration denied it was but Congress came to the conclusion that it was. The endgame was that Congress appropriated I think it was around $480 million dollars to switch over to PC commodes.

And as usual they didn't think of the consequences. A naval directive was issued to stop installing the PC commodes. It ends up women aboard ships use three times more water than men do when nature calls. The black water holding tanks aboard existing ships couldn't handle all of the extra waste water.

But all new ship construction will have friendly gender heads. (No pun intended in regards to repealing DADT.)

The commodes don't make a difference in water usage - we flush with salt water. And we can discharge black water if we need, as long as we're a certain number of miles out to sea.

 

[APACHERAT]

Actually, my experience was just the opposite. Sure, there was the occasional female who couldn't carry her load, but for the most part, the women put more real effort into their jobs than the men did...because they felt they had to prove themselves in a man's world. This is not a new thing, either - many times in the years since I retired, for the most part I've seen women working harder than men - again, because they felt they had to prove themselves in a man's world. Yes, you and I and most other guys have physically stronger bodies and we can stand more physical pain...but in the everyday jobs, for the most part they worked harder and caused fewer problems than the guys. I'm sorry, but that's my first-hand experience.



Again, no offense, but my experience was just the opposite of what you posted. In the beginning, when women were first coming aboard, there were a lot of guys - usually the one's who had been in for some time and had gotten indoctrinated to the idea that women on ships was a very bad idea - who would do the catcalls and do the harassment regardless of the warnings of the command...and men and women were more likely to fraternize in the beginning - which is why I well remember all the (unconfirmed) rumors in the early '90's when I was on the Camden that a ship that did have women on it - the sub tender USS McKee, which was anchored in the port nearest Dubai - had had to send 10% of their female sailors home because of pregnancy. Again, the rumor was unconfirmed, but since it sounded good we all believed it.

When I arrived on the Lincoln, however, women had been on board for several years already - from when she was commissioned, I think. And as a result, the men seemed to be more aware of their boundaries. Remember my earlier statements that the men seemed better behaved - and I think this is one reason why. The men had learned not only what was off-limits and verboten, but had also learned, for instance, to take care to not be alone with a female sailor behind locked doors - that was a big no-no. At first that seemed like a pain in the ass, but after a while it wasn't a hindrance at all - there was always a spare sailor around to be a third-party stand-in.

AR, I know all this runs counter to what you sincerely believe - and what you've heard from many others - but I've seen both sides of the story, and this is my first-hand experience. Life is better with women around. Vive la differance!

You still avoided answering the question, can all female sailors be able to perform the duties in actual combat and the ship is hit and carry out all of the battle damage control procedures that every other male sailor is able to carry out ? That includes carrying fire water pumps up or down ladders or carrying 200 pound injured sailors up or down ladders ?

From what I have been told and read, NO.

The U.S. Navy isn't suppose to be about social engineering, veteran's benefits, political correctness, earning money for college, learning a trade to be used in the public sector, or advancing feminism or homo sexualality.

The only mission of the U.S. Navy is to keep the sea lanes open for maritime trade, to protect American citizens abroad, and to militarily intervene in Americas intrest, and fight wars on the sea.

 

[APACHERAT]

The commodes don't make a difference in water usage - we flush with salt water. And we can discharge black water if we need, as long as we're a certain number of miles out to sea.

Nope you can't. The PC environmentalist have taken control of how garbage and human waste is disposed.

The days of watching the sharks from the fantail of a U.S warship feeding on the trash of a ship is history.
####, that use to be the most exciting time of the day when I was aboard a Navy ship unless they sounded General Quarter.

Do you know what it's like being aboard an American warship that has actually been there and done that ? It takes some big sailors to fill those deck shoes.

When today's Navy warships are commissioned in the name after a warship that had a history and has been there and done that, actually engaged in warfare, are today's sailors more concerned with filling the shoes of those sailors who served before them or are more concerned with political correctness ?

The discharging of navy ships black and gray water tanks is highly monitored by liberals.

 

[Thrilla]

Y'know, I like to stick up for the Navy and for what conservatives disparage as the "PC attitude"...but that's funny! Good one!

nothing like good service jokes... I learned that one ( and many more) from my buddies pop, an old retired chief (WW2 vet.)


inter-service rivalries aside, I have nothing but respect for the Navy.... my family is all about naval services ( Navy and Marine corps)
my oldest daughter is shooting for her Naval commission (OAR score of 63 :shock .. my 2nd daughter is showing a lot interest in being a Naval officer ( though,she leans more towards the Corps)
and my oldest Son is a Gunny select

 

[Glen Contrarian]

nothing like good service jokes... I learned that one ( and many more) from my buddies pop, an old retired chief (WW2 vet.)


inter-service rivalries aside, I have nothing but respect for the Navy.... my family is all about naval services ( Navy and Marine corps)
my oldest daughter is shooting for her Naval commission (OAR score of 63 :shock .. my 2nd daughter is showing a lot interest in being a Naval officer ( though,she leans more towards the Corps)
and my oldest Son is a Gunny select

Congratulations! And I know you're doggone proud of all of them, and rightly so. You've got to be looking forward to the day when the younger Marines' eyes get wide when they see a certain gunny walking in their direction....

My oldest son can't join - his severe bout with rheumatic fever stopped that - but my youngest son is shooting to be a Navy medical officer. And if he makes it, yeah, I'll be the proudest dad on the planet....

 

[Glen Contrarian]

Nope you can't. The PC environmentalist have taken control of how garbage and human waste is disposed.

Yep, we can. We just can't do it within so many miles of what we consider national waters.

The days of watching the sharks from the fantail of a U.S warship feeding on the trash of a ship is history.
####, that use to be the most exciting time of the day when I was aboard a Navy ship unless they sounded General Quarter.

I remember those days, too - until we discovered something called the Great Pacific Garbage Patch. Thing is, a lot of that trash doesn't sink to the bottom...and it winds up in the great gyre of trash floating in the middle of the Pacific - though there are smaller ones in the other oceans. And these are not just a hazard to sea creatures - they also present an honest-to-goodness maritime hazard to vessels - it's hard to operate a nuclear-powered or steam-driven vessel if a bunch of trash gets into the main condenser (which I've cleaned out a few times, BTW). That, sir, is why we don't dump trash at sea anymore

Do you know what it's like being aboard an American warship that has actually been there and done that ? It takes some big sailors to fill those deck shoes.

But times change...and so do the seas. That great big garbage patch wasn't there before. Now it is, and we have to deal with it.

When today's Navy warships are commissioned in the name after a warship that had a history and has been there and done that, actually engaged in warfare, are today's sailors more concerned with filling the shoes of those sailors who served before them or are more concerned with political correctness ?

Yeah, I'm sure the soldiers in the front lines said the same thing about the females who serving alongside them, who were in the sniper battalions, who were in the night bombers flying above. But you know what? The Soviet Army turned out to be the greatest land force in human history, too. Remember, I was against it at first, too, and if having women work alongside us was really such a problem, I'd sure as heck have seen it...particularly since I worked much of my career in Engineering - it's easy for me to spot someone who can't handle the load.

The discharging of navy ships black and gray water tanks is highly monitored by liberals.

Just read the reference I gave you, okay?