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To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from soccer

Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Van Basten said:
Sports, at least most, is about winning when it's organized.
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No, no it's not. At least not to anyone with a clue.

That's just how it is and how it should be, that desire to win is the greatest push a person can have to "maximize [their] potential".
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But it doesn't. If I'm better than someone else right now, what incentive do I have to get better? It doesn't push the desire to maximize potential, it pushes the desire to just be better than someone else.

But, I suppose there will always be people full of excuses for their shortcomings instead of just getting over it and being a good sportsman. *shrug*
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And I know there will always be people who will never understand the true value of sports.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Fisher said:
No, it would require more specialized teachers which will be mo money; it will require more teaching materials, which will cost mo money; it will require more administrative staff to monitor/route the students, which will cost mo money. Teacher Unions will not allow change to what they have--only to what they don't have. Tax payers will not support more taxes to pay for it. Washington won't yield their stranglehold on standardized education.

Like I said, won't happen.
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No extra materials required. No extra teachers required. You're simply allowing a student to progress at his/her natural rate...
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Except Mr. Slyfox you also spewed drivel like this too:

Winning is external and many times determined by forces outside of your control. Instead of being focused on winning, you should be focused on maximizing your skills and abilities. You should focus on maximizing your potential. That is success. Like John Wooden said, "Success is peace of mind which is a direct result of self-satisfaction in knowing you did your best to become the best you are capable of becoming". If you can do that, if you can maximize your own abilities, then you will win the contests you should win and sometimes the ones you shouldn't.
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That seemed to indicate that you do not much care what others may think; as long as you are satisfied with your efforts then that is your "truth". It is precisely that attitude which had confused some McWorkers recently into deeming (dreaming?) themselves worthy of $15/hour entry level pay. Hey, after all, they see themsleves as being very capable burger flippers so they think that they deserve very capabale pay for having that "skill". 5 years of burger flipping experience is a myth; it is really just one month of experience having been repeated 59 more times.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Rainman05 said:
To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from soccer | This is That with Pat Kelly and Peter Oldring | CBC Radio


Really? Really? There is nothing wrong with healthy competition. It makes people better. What's wrong with people?
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Stop. This is a comedy show on CBC radio that specializes in reporting on (made up) absurd stories. Don't post something like this for debate. Why are we not debating the latest policies the last Obama impersonator on SNL proposed.

geesh.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Slyfox696 said:
No, no it's not. At least not to anyone with a clue.
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*whistles*

I'm just gonna accept you can't grasp the reality of things on that. Can't bother to care.

Gotta love you being all high and mighty.

But it doesn't. If I'm better than someone else right now, what incentive do I have to get better? It doesn't push the desire to maximize potential, it pushes the desire to just be better than someone else.
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What? To rise to the top and be better than your companions/opponents is the goal of any worthwhile athlete with some ambition. People desire to maximize their potential in order to win, which is the point of organized sports games/matches. How can you not understand this?

And I know there will always be people who will never understand the true value of sports.
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Apparently, you should work on understanding that.

Of course there's more to sports than winning, I was never saying it was that there was to it. But, at the crux of it, it's a competition to win, to best your opponent. Maximizing your potential is something all "winners" push hard for. It raises the bar, it sets a goal before them. People who care about winning maximize their potential to the highest level since they're set on victory. This isn't hard to understand. With your thinking, that winning isn't crucial, just makes room for excuses and laziness. You're slinging out the sly comments left and right and yet you can't even get this. It's ironic.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

ttwtt78640 said:
Except Mr. Slyfox you also spewed drivel like this too:
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It's not drivel, it's the truth. If I become the best I can become that's the most I can control. I cannot control God giving LeBron James freak like athleticism and not me. All I can control is what I can do.

That seemed to indicate that you do not much care what others may think; as long as you are satisfied with your efforts then that is your "truth".
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It is your truth. Tell me, what good does it do to mope about that which is physically outside your capabilities? Should I give up on basketball because I'm not LeBron James?

The key to this is you simply have to be honest with yourself. I know I didn't maximize my potential when I played basketball in high school. I could say I did because I went to camps, and shot outside on my goal for hours, but I know I could have done more. I could have lifted weights or ran when I was playing NBA Live 2000. I could have begged my coach to open the gym instead of hanging out with friends. I know I didn't maximize my potential and I received the reinforcement appropriate to my efforts.

It is precisely that attitude which had confused some McWorkers recently into deeming (dreaming?) themselves worthy of $15/hour entry level pay. Hey, after all, they see themsleves as being very capable burger flippers so they think that they deserve very capabale pay for having that "skill". 5 years of burger flipping experience is a myth; it is really just one month of experience having been repeated 59 more times.
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Completely separate issue. But I ask you, would you say most of those people have maximized their potential?

Winning is external reinforcement. Winning often times says as much about your opponent as it does you. But I'll promise you this and I'll promise you I'm 100% right. If you play the game at the very highest level you are capable of performing, you will never lose to someone who is inferior to you. Would you disagree with that statement?
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Van Basten said:
What? To rise to the top and be better than your companions/opponents is the goal of any worthwhile athlete with some ambition. People desire to maximize their potential in order to win, which is the point of organized sports games/matches. How can you not understand this?
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You didn't answer my question.

If I'm better than someone else right now, what incentive do I have to get better?

LeBron James is the best basketball player in the world, has been for years. And yet, he's constantly working to improve his game, constantly adding new wrinkles to it. Why? It's not because he wants to be better than everyone else, he already is. He does it because he wants to be the best player HE can be.

Any worthwhile athlete does not set a goal to simply be better than someone else. A worthwhile athlete sets a goal to be the very best he or she can be. And, from that, if your best is better than everyone else's, that's great. If not, then all you can do is keep trying to improve yourself and hope some day it will be.

Apparently, you should work on understanding that.
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No, unlike you, I have it down.

Of course there's more to sports than winning, I was never saying it was that there was to it. But, at the crux of it, it's a competition to win, to best your opponent.
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No, it's really not. The competition is what makes it enjoyable, it's not what makes it important.

Maximizing your potential is something all "winners" push hard for.
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Why? If they are already winners, why bother getting better?

People who care about winning maximize their potential to the highest level since they're set on victory. This isn't hard to understand. With your thinking, that winning isn't crucial, just makes room for excuses and laziness. You're slinging out the sly comments left and right and yet you can't even get this. It's ironic.
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No, you don't get it.

It's really simple though and I'll ask you the same question I just asked ttwtt:

If you play the game at the very highest level you are capable of performing, you will never lose to someone who is inferior to you. Would you disagree with that statement?
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Slyfox696 said:
If you play the game at the very highest level you are capable of performing, you will never lose to someone who is inferior to you. Would you disagree with that statement?
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Of course I would disagree. Any sports fan knows this isn't true, upsets are one of the funnest parts of sports (well, when it isn't your team getting the surprise loss :lol:).
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Goshin said:
I mean what do they do, just run around purposelessly for half an hour???
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Isn't that . . . soccer?








:bolt
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Slyfox696 said:
It's not drivel, it's the truth. If I become the best I can become that's the most I can control. I cannot control God giving LeBron James freak like athleticism and not me. All I can control is what I can do.

It is your truth. Tell me, what good does it do to mope about that which is physically outside your capabilities? Should I give up on basketball because I'm not LeBron James?

The key to this is you simply have to be honest with yourself. I know I didn't maximize my potential when I played basketball in high school. I could say I did because I went to camps, and shot outside on my goal for hours, but I know I could have done more. I could have lifted weights or ran when I was playing NBA Live 2000. I could have begged my coach to open the gym instead of hanging out with friends. I know I didn't maximize my potential and I received the reinforcement appropriate to my efforts.

Completely separate issue. But I ask you, would you say most of those people have maximized their potential?

Winning is external reinforcement. Winning often times says as much about your opponent as it does you. But I'll promise you this and I'll promise you I'm 100% right. If you play the game at the very highest level you are capable of performing, you will never lose to someone who is inferior to you. Would you disagree with that statement?
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It is not. Saying that effort alone in life will be rewarded externally (earn one a decent living) is not evident. You are trying to somehow equate being the best burger flipper to having the skills of LeBron. I see your point but also that aiming for excellence may result in attaining mediocity, just as aiming for mediocrity may result in attaining failure. The point that I am making is that you may indeed feel that you have done your best at attaining X, yet never realize that you may have been the world's best at Y. Rather than devote an equal amount of time and effort to get all to be good at X it may be better to take those found to lack aptitutde for X and introduce them to Y instead.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

ChrisL said:
Agreed. This is so stupid. You cannot protect your children from disappointment. It's unhealthy IMO.
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True! Instead of instilling the old ideals of seeking personal excellence, we are now preaching the virtues of mediocrity. It's sickening.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

I really hope everyone realizes it was a joke.

I really do.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Aunt Spiker said:
I really hope everyone realizes it was a joke.

I really do.
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The OP is a joke? I didn't read it, but things like this are happening, where they try to take the competition out of sports because they don't want any of the kids to feel bad if they lose. I've heard of those games where "everybody wins!" ;)
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Yeah guys, it was just a joke. The town in question (Midlake, Ontario), doesn't exist. There is no Midlake Thundercats, or any no-ball soccer. It's a joke, meant for ha-has instead of debates.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

ChrisL said:
The OP is a joke? I didn't read it, but things like this are happening, where they try to take the competition out of sports because they don't want any of the kids to feel bad if they lose. I've heard of those games where "everybody wins!" ;)
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Yes - it was a satire. Someone pointed that out - it caused a problem when they aired it on the radio, people thought it was serious.

But they did it to point out the ridiculousness of things - like what you're discussing, people have gone too far when it comes to this issue. The fact that people thought it was real shows how extreme things have become to where it SOUNDS like something people would actually DO.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Aunt Spiker said:
Yes - it was a satire. Someone pointed that out - it caused a problem when they aired it on the radio, people thought it was serious.

But they did it to point out the ridiculousness of things - like what you're discussing, people have gone too far when it comes to this issue. The fact that people thought it was real shows how extreme things have become to where it SOUNDS like something people would actually DO.
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I'm wondering when they're going to come out with bubble wrap for babies. :lol:
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

ChrisL said:
The OP is a joke? I didn't read it, but things like this are happening, where they try to take the competition out of sports because they don't want any of the kids to feel bad if they lose. I've heard of those games where "everybody wins!" ;)
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Yeah, I got fooled by the news-site. As I am not familiar with canadian newspapers or programs, I didn't know that the section I found the news in was a comedy one. I checked the website in general and it does report real news. It just has a comedy sketch which I didn't know about, and that's what I posted.

I wouldn't have posted it here if the news site would have been like the onion, all comedy and such. Besides, it didn't seem so farfetched.
People have been discouraging competition in schools for a long time now, and especially in sports.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Rainman05 said:
Yeah, I got fooled by the news-site. As I am not familiar with canadian newspapers or programs, I didn't know that the section I found the news in was a comedy one. I checked the website in general and it does report real news. It just has a comedy sketch which I didn't know about, and that's what I posted.

I wouldn't have posted it here if the news site would have been like the onion, all comedy and such. Besides, it didn't seem so farfetched.
People have been discouraging competition in schools for a long time now, and especially in sports.
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Doesn't sound far fetched at all. I've heard of such stories, where they don't have winners or losers, but everybody wins. Stupid. If your child can't handle losing sometimes, then perhaps they aren't cut out to play competitive sports IMO.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Aunt Spiker said:
Yes - it was a satire. Someone pointed that out - it caused a problem when they aired it on the radio, people thought it was serious.
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This or That has been doing this for years to my knowledge they achieved their goal and people fall for it all the time. One time they did "New Wind Found" and "Canada to Change Maple Leaf to Pot Leaf" and people fell for that to and they are much less believable.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Van Basten said:
Of course I would disagree. Any sports fan knows this isn't true, upsets are one of the funnest parts of sports (well, when it isn't your team getting the surprise loss :lol:).
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Upsets only happen when the superior team doesn't play to the best of it's abilities. So your statement here is worthless to this discussion.

The fact is if you play to the very best of your abilities, the superior team/person will always win. So your focus should be on maximizing what you can do.
ttwtt78640 said:
It is not.
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It is a completely separate issue, for many reasons. There are so many things which go into why a person is working fast food, and that's a debate for another thread.

Saying that effort alone in life will be rewarded externally (earn one a decent living) is not evident.
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I did not say that either. What I've said is you should focus your attention on being the best YOU can be, and if you do the best you can, you have no reason to regret where you are.

I've said many times that simply working hard will not be rewarded externally. My LeBron example is proof of that. No matter how hard I work, I will always pale in comparison to LeBron. Just because I work hard and maximize myself, it doesn't mean I'll beat LeBron. But what it DOES mean is that I will maximize my potential, that I will become the best I'm capable of becoming.

You keep arguing with me on this, but you don't really seem to understand what I'm saying. This is the second time now where you seem to think I'm saying something I'm not.

I see your point but also that aiming for excellence may result in attaining mediocity, just as aiming for mediocrity may result in attaining failure. The point that I am making is that you may indeed feel that you have done your best at attaining X, yet never realize that you may have been the world's best at Y.
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But that's going to be true no matter what you do. If I compete at X, then there's no telling how good I could have been at competing at Y. Teaching kids winning is the important thing will never change that. Teaching kids that winning at basketball will never tell them how good they could be at winning baseball.

Your statement in no way is a reflection on anything I've said.

Rather than devote an equal amount of time and effort to get all to be good at X it may be better to take those found to lack aptitutde for X and introduce them to Y instead.
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I agree completely. But whether they try X or Y, it doesn't change the fact their goal should be to be the best they can be at X or Y, and not set a goal of simply winning X or Y.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

Slyfox696 said:
Upsets only happen when the superior team doesn't play to the best of it's abilities.
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Upsets aren't that simple. I'm done, have a nice day, Sly.
 
Re: To ensure every child 'wins', Ontario athletic association removes ball from socc

I thought that when I referenced the Onion it would enlighten some. Apparently though some don't read, or, don't know the onion's reputation for farce.
 
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