This Guy got to go!!!!

[RetiredUSN]

Ok folks simple question!!! do you believe the United States intelligence agency reports on the state of our enemies, or do you believe Trump version.

How do you feel about Trump questioning and saying the U.S. intelligence need to go back to school because Trump knows better. just want to know how can trump know better than people that have been doing this for decades with agents in the field.. Trump is very disrespectful to the United States government . period. and we all know most of the people he is talking down and belittling about are republican veterans.....Wow!!!

Three idiot presidents in a row.

Bush.... WMD and the start of 2 never ending wars.

Obama.... Islamic Fundamentalists are the JV Team. ****ing idiot! ....over 6,000 dead Americans killed by the JV team. Bombed 7 countries.

Trump..... Totally ignorant on intelligence and military affairs.

 

[cpwill]

CPWILL - I am somewhat surprised by your reply. Of course he reads them.

That is.... a nice sentiment. Let us say I hope you are correct, and think that you are not .

What he may not do is react the way the talking heads on cable TV sometimes hint he ought.

Unless those talking heads are on Fox & Friends.

What's wrong with, to mention a few: sitting down with the NK Communist party chief

Praising Kim Jung Un while giving him that stage was probably the most odious thing Trump has done in foreign policy to date. Republicans - who justly criticized Obama for merely suggesting he might do something similar with Irans' thuggish leadership - would have gone insane had a Democrat done it. It was a massive unforced error, giving Kim what he wanted (a propaganda victory abroad and at home) in return for nothing.

expecting pay for protection by the NATO members

Nothing is wrong with that whatsoever - which is why the Bush and Obama administrations also did so. What was wrong was attacking the institution itself in the face of a resurgent Russia, whose number one policy goal is to weaken the West by fracturing NATO.

fighting a long overdue trade fight with China against their aggressive marketing tactics

Trade Wars are wars politicians wage against their own people. The American consumer doesn't benefit when their price of living goes up. The economic fight against China isn't in the realm of "they have lower cost of living and labor than we do, and so therefore we must raise our own", it's massive corporate theft.

and still having a friend in Peiping

And, see, again; brutal dictatorships who are hostile to our interests and seeking to replace us regionally are not our "friends".

And then you have the decision to abandon our partners in Syria, enabling our enemies while demonstrating that we can't be trusted to defend our friends. Or the atrocious position we find ourselves in Afghanistan, where the negotiating position of the Administration whose head claims to be a master negotiator is "either you give us some of what we want, or we will give you what you want". :roll:

Foreign policy right now is in utter shambles, to the extent we even have one. With the possible exception of one country (Iran), Trump has taken the mistakes of the Obama era and doubled down on them.

cutting taxes, having the lowest unemployment figures for the least earning of our society?

Yup - both of those I'm fine with (though the latter is not a policy, but rather something impacted by it, among other things). Trump has turned over Judges to o the Federalist Society and Mitch McConnell, and that has gone fantastically well.

Go ahead, I'll wait.
Regards,
CP

Glad to lay it out hope you have a good Saturday.


Sent from my Moto G (5S) Plus using Tapatalk

 

[Waddy]

The North Koreans kicked us almost off the Korean peninsula. We pushed them back to the Chinese border. The Chinese pushed us back from there to the current division line. A win against N. Korea and we stopped the Chinese. Call it what ever you want.

And Iraq... Third World backwater using old Russian equipment? Roughly 1,000,000 men all told is a fairly large army these days. And the 12 Divisions of the Republican Guard was fairly well armed and had high morale. And we spanked them not once, but twice.

Grenada, Panama etc were what they were. The Iran rescue mission was overly optimistic and plagued with bad luck. And?

As far as Vietnam we spanked the Viet Cong and held the NVA until peace talks could ensue. We were there to protect S. Vietnam and the last time I checked it was still there after we left. Am I wrong?

On just about every statement. South Vietnam no longer exists. It is now part of communist Vietnam. We lost. Doesn't matter how many we kill; you can win ALL the battles and still lose the war. Just ask general Lee.

Numbers of soldiers doesn't the best army make. Didn't we learn that facing the excellent German Wehrmacht? It's training and technology that count in modern warfare. Your thinking that it's simply a numbers game is 18th century thinking.

I'll continue to call the Korean War a draw. We were pushed back twice by rather primitive and poorly armed forces, we controlled the air, we had bombers, and still we couoldn't actually beat them in the end. We settled for a draw at the 38th parallel.

 

[eohrnberger]

I think it unreasonable to come to some sort of conclusion fully well knowing that both Trump and the Intel heads have far more information than the public.

 

[Fledermaus]

On just about every statement. South Vietnam no longer exists. It is now part of communist Vietnam. We lost. Doesn't matter how many we kill; you can win ALL the battles and still lose the war. Just ask general Lee.

Numbers of soldiers doesn't the best army make. Didn't we learn that facing the excellent German Wehrmacht? It's training and technology that count in modern warfare. Your thinking that it's simply a numbers game is 18th century thinking.

I'll continue to call the Korean War a draw. We were pushed back twice by rather primitive and poorly armed forces, we controlled the air, we had bombers, and still we couoldn't actually beat them in the end. We settled for a draw at the 38th parallel.

1. US departed Vietnam with the South Vietnam intact and the Viet Cong destroyed. Correct? South Vietnam lost to North Vietnam.

2. And the Wehrmacht? Really? WE OUTNUMBERED THEM. They were the ones superior in both tactics and technology to the Russians and ourselves. Russia, the US and UK beat them by having more of everything. "Quantity has a quality of its own"

3. And Korea was a victory against the Norks and a draw against the Chinese.

 

[chuckiechan]

Ok folks simple question!!! do you believe the United States intelligence agency reports on the state of our enemies, or do you believe Trump version.

How do you feel about Trump questioning and saying the U.S. intelligence need to go back to school because Trump knows better. just want to know how can trump know better than people that have been doing this for decades with agents in the field.. Trump is very disrespectful to the United States government . period. and we all know most of the people he is talking down and belittling about are republican veterans.....Wow!!!

The intel crew has a different view of how the world should operate. That causes conflict when elected officials want to change course. It's human nature to not let go of those things that have nurtured your career and some new guy comes along and says "America is getting tired of it's soldiers dying in ****holes for no real explanation given to the people of the US". We have troops everywhere saving everyone, yet we have precious few south of us where drugs are coming in, and governments are being seduced by our economic and strategic enemies.

Tunnel vision is alive and well in the intel shops. Don't forget, we never saw 911 coming. "A failure of imagination, it was, or so they said." IOW, "Stuck using the old way of thinking"

 

[earthworm]

Our military has been mostly failing ever since WW2.....I dont assume either competence or honesty..... and really who after The Pentagon Papers would ever assume honesty?

OPINION, and far from any truth ..Much closer is ..the American people.. and their Congress. But NOT our military, as stupid as they can be at times .

 

[Waddy]

1. US departed Vietnam with the South Vietnam intact and the Viet Cong destroyed. Correct? South Vietnam lost to North Vietnam.

2. And the Wehrmacht? Really? WE OUTNUMBERED THEM. They were the ones superior in both tactics and technology to the Russians and ourselves. Russia, the US and UK beat them by having more of everything. "Quantity has a quality of its own"

3. And Korea was a victory against the Norks and a draw against the Chinese.

The US departed without defeating anybody. They left because it got too hot for them. As Mao said later; The US left after losing only 57k men; they will never win a war if that's too many. Mao was right.

Any sensible person recognizes the Korean War as a stalemate. A stalemate is a draw.

Yes, the Wehrmacht was eventually defeated by numbers, but they showed that training and technology were the future. That's why all modern armies are modeled on Wehrmacht principles. Human waves are just too costly now, and ineffective. Just ask the Iranians who were the last to deploy such tactics against Iraq.

 

[Rogue Valley]

When Trump states things that are diametrically oppositional to the intelligence directors HE chose and the GOP Senate confirmed, even Trump supporters should admit there is a huge factual problem.

And you can't say that Trump has better intelligence than his intelligence chiefs, because Trump obtains the facts and forecasts on foreign intelligence from these very people.

 

[Born Free]

You can't act like it was a US thing. It wasn't. All intelligence gets stuff wrong and, in that case, everyone got it wrong for good reason.

All I'm saying they get it wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And because of that they should not be believed on blind faith.

 

[Fledermaus]

The US departed without defeating anybody. They left because it got too hot for them. As Mao said later; The US left after losing only 57k men; they will never win a war if that's too many. Mao was right.

Any sensible person recognizes the Korean War as a stalemate. A stalemate is a draw.

Yes, the Wehrmacht was eventually defeated by numbers, but they showed that training and technology were the future. That's why all modern armies are modeled on Wehrmacht principles. Human waves are just too costly now, and ineffective. Just ask the Iranians who were the last to deploy such tactics against Iraq.

1. The Viet Cong were completely routed. And we fought the NVA to a standstill. South Vietnam lost to North Vietnam.

2. We thumped the **** out of the N. Koreans. And we fought the Chinese to a stand still along roughly the original N/S border.

3. Numbers count. How much they count is dependent on a number of factors. And who said anything about "Human wave" tactics?

 

[Common Sense 1]

Trump has got to go and we cannot wait 2 years without risking serious long term effects to our security as a nation. Trump is a Russian asset and the GOP is complicit.

You guys have been saying that since he won the election so what is new? Get a clue he is not going anywhere............ :doh

 

[Phys251]

Do you remember when our great intelligence got it dead wrong when they came out and said Iraq had WMD. Their great hard working people but even the best can make mistakes.

Which political party's vice president manipulated the intel community into concocting false evidence of WMD's, Born?

 

[Moderate Right]

Ok folks simple question!!! do you believe the United States intelligence agency reports on the state of our enemies, or do you believe Trump version.

How do you feel about Trump questioning and saying the U.S. intelligence need to go back to school because Trump knows better. just want to know how can trump know better than people that have been doing this for decades with agents in the field.. Trump is very disrespectful to the United States government . period. and we all know most of the people he is talking down and belittling about are republican veterans.....Wow!!!

LOL. The left have spent decades criticizing the intelligence agencies (mostly due to the Iraq war), up to including the Comey statement days before the 2016 election that they were reopening the Hillary email investigation. Comey was criticized for it and Democrats were wanting his head.

 

[Vadinho]

Our military has been mostly failing ever since WW2.....I dont assume either competence or honesty..... and really who after The Pentagon Papers would ever assume honesty?

You have got to be kidding us all. My lord, we are in deep **** as a nation if enough people think like you do. Incredible.

 

[iguanaman]

You guys have been saying that since he won the election so what is new? Get a clue he is not going anywhere............ :doh

And we were correct for saying it. He is a Russian asset and is damaging America at Putin's bidding.

Putin’s return on investment from Trump’s presidency has been significant.

Here are ten ways that Putin has received his payout:

Putin’s Goal: Weaken and divide the transatlantic alliance.
Putin’s Payout: Trump undermines US relationships with European allies and calls the US’s commitment to NATO into question.
Putin’s Goal: Degrade the European Union and foster pro-Russian political movements.
Putin’s Payout: Trump attacks the EU and actively supports anti-EU, Kremlin-backed parties.
Putin’s Goal: Disrupt American leadership of the global economic order.
Putin’s Payout: Trump is eagerly pushing for an all-out trade war with Europe.
Putin’s Goal: Build global resentment and distrust towards the US and stoke anti-American sentiment.
Putin’s Payout: America’s closest allies are explicitly suspicious and distrusting of the US because of Trump’s rhetoric and actions.
Putin’s Goal: Relieve economic and domestic political pressure from US sanctions on Russia.
Putin’s Payout: Trump tries to roll back, impede, and blunt the impact of sanctions at every step.
Putin’s Goal: Legitimize his regime in the eyes of the world.
Putin’s Payout: Trump repeatedly praises and defends Putin, lending the weight of the US presidency providing validation towards Putin’s cause.
Putin’s Goal: Revive Russia’s status as a great power and gain international recognition for its illegal seizure of Crimea.
Putin’s Payout: Trump publicly says that Crimea is part of Russia and calls for Russia to be welcomed back into the international community with no concessions.
Putin’s Goal: Continue to sow discord in Western democracies and avoid repercussions for interfering in US and European elections.
Putin’s Payout: Trump dismisses Russian interference and has done nothing to prevent future interference, putting him at odds with his own intelligence community.
Putin’s Goal: Soften America’s adversarial stance toward Russia.
Putin’s Payout: Trump is shifting the Republican Party’s generations-long hawkish views on Russia.
Putin’s Goal: Destabilize the US from within.
Putin’s Payout: Trump attacks US institutions while driving divisive politics and eroding democratic norms.
The pattern is clear: Putin has received—and continues to receive—a good payout on his investment.

https://themoscowproject.org/reports/putins-payout-10-ways-trump-has-supported-putins-foreign-policy-agenda/

No wonder our intelligence agencies are investigating this...

 

[iguanaman]

LOL. The left have spent decades criticizing the intelligence agencies (mostly due to the Iraq war), up to including the Comey statement days before the 2016 election that they were reopening the Hillary email investigation. Comey was criticized for it and Democrats were wanting his head.

The criticism was because GW Bush was subverting the CIA to get an excuse to topple Saddam. Bush actively covered up any intel that did not justify an invasion. The independence of our intelligence professionals is essential to our security. Yet another reason Trump must go.

As the country marks the tenth anniversary of the U.S. invasion of Iraq, a nagging question lingers: Why didn’t those in the U.S government—who knew the truth—speak out about the phony intelligence being used by the Bush White House to justify the invasion of Iraq? Yellowcake uranium from Africa? Aluminum tubes for a nuclear weapons program? Connections between al Qaeda and Saddam? Throughout the U.S. intelligence community, some officials knew that these–and other assertions used to make the case for war–were based on the sketchiest of intelligence, wrong-headed assumptions and fraudulent claims. Yet those officials didn’t go public, their doubts recorded only in dissents buried deep inside a classified National Intelligence Estimate that never saw the light of day. In these excerpts from interviews conducted for “Hubris,” some of the principals explain why so many remained silent about issues that were so important.

Selling the Iraq war: Experts knew the intel was faulty. Why didn't they blow the whistle? | MSNBC

 

[iguanaman]

Sorry. You will wait at least 2 years. If you think that's gonna be tough, I don't know how in the world you will make it till 2024. Deep breathing exercise, maybe?
Regards,
CP

You can't know that. Our Country has removed Presidents before when they turned out to be criminals. It's in the Constitution.

 

[Hawkeye10]

You have got to be kidding us all. My lord, we are in deep **** as a nation if enough people think like you do. Incredible.

The debacle in Iraq was the last straw....Nations die as a result of bungling of that magnitude.

 

[Hawkeye10]

OPINION, and far from any truth ..Much closer is ..the American people.. and their Congress. But NOT our military, as stupid as they can be at times .

Everybody wants to line up to give our military a pass for their poor performance over a very long period of time.

 

[uptower]

Interesting microcosm on the wider electorate here. Just under a third stand by Trump.

A few years ago the pro-Trump crowd would have mostly got behind the pentagon on anything: especially under a democrat. The thing with Trumpism though is it is a personality cult, so they must stand behind the man no matter what. If the vaunted military-intel establishment and all its Triple Amputee Veteran TM poster boys goes against him, then it must be wrong. Much like Blue Lives matter suddenly having no meaning the moment the FBI turned on Trump. Once again, the whole world is wrong and only he can be right.

Now this doesn't make intel agencies or the military infallible: they've made mistakes in the past - often at the direction of political masters. But they do have a good handle on the threats and challenges facing the US and the world. The president on the other hand has Fox and Friends, so it's not even close.

But the fact is they do know better and Trump knows jack $hit. He is wilfully ignorant and will not even listen. The chump is unfit to lead.

 

[Born Free]

Which political party's vice president manipulated the intel community into concocting false evidence of WMD's, Born?

First you have to prove that a vice president manipulated the the intel community.

Otherwise I have no idea. I take what your trying to prove is that a vise president forced our intelligence into submitting a false report. So while you're proving your claim, be sure to produce the false Intelligence report. Is forcing a false intelligence report breaking the law, and if so who was indicted and was he convicted of a crime and if so what was the penalty?

 

[Waddy]

1. The Viet Cong were completely routed. And we fought the NVA to a standstill. South Vietnam lost to North Vietnam.

2. We thumped the **** out of the N. Koreans. And we fought the Chinese to a stand still along roughly the original N/S border.

3. Numbers count. How much they count is dependent on a number of factors. And who said anything about "Human wave" tactics?

We might have won the body count, but we were the ones who left the field of battle to the enemy. That is generally considered a defeat.

The goal was to liberate ALL of Korea. Failure there. Fighting someone to a standstill is generally considered a stalemate, not a victory.

Considering the odds, the Germans put up a fight much longer than could reasonably be expected, because they were well trained and well equipped. THAT has been the model for ALL modern armies since then. The Iranians used human wave attacks, to no avail. And no one has adopted the Russian model of building lots of inferior equipment. Well, maybe the Chinese for a while, but they are learning.

 

[Fledermaus]

We might have won the body count, but we were the ones who left the field of battle to the enemy. That is generally considered a defeat.

The goal was to liberate ALL of Korea. Failure there. Fighting someone to a standstill is generally considered a stalemate, not a victory.

Considering the odds, the Germans put up a fight much longer than could reasonably be expected, because they were well trained and well equipped. THAT has been the model for ALL modern armies since then. The Iranians used human wave attacks, to no avail. And no one has adopted the Russian model of building lots of inferior equipment. Well, maybe the Chinese for a while, but they are learning.

Left the battlefield to the enemy?

The Republic of Vietnam still stood in peace when we left.

The Viet Cong were defeated and the NVA removed from the RVN.

The goal was to defend South Korea.

 

[rickc]

Left the battlefield to the enemy?

The Republic of Vietnam still stood in peace when we left.

The Viet Cong were defeated and the NVA removed from the RVN.

The goal was to defend South Korea.

delusional

had an uncle in Korea. When the Red Chinese joined the party in wave attacks Americans retreated. The war was a stalemate. unles America was willing to attack the chinese mainland little could be done to break it. so we[ATTA are still there after all those years.

to say we left vietnam a stable country is ludicrous. sure we could have won the vietnam war but we aren't willing to do what it takes to win. we left vietnam with our tail between our legs.



same with iraq and soon to be Afghanistan