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These actions violate international law and fuel a dangerous escalation of violence = We urge all parties to immediately cease hostilities ....

Razoo

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NATO expansion provided the context for this crisis—a fact often ignored by our media. There is rank irrationality and irresponsibility in offering future NATO membership to Ukraine—when successive US presidents and our NATO allies have demonstrated that they do not have the slightest intention of fighting to defend Ukraine.

Instead, Putin’s demand that Ukraine remain outside of NATO—essentially that the status quo be codified—was scorned as violating NATO’s “principle” of admitting anyone it wanted.

One immediate result was to encourage parallel irresponsibility in Ukraine. President Volodymyr Zelensky promised voters when he ran for Ukraine’s presidency in 2019 that he would pursue a path to peace and end the war in the Donbas.

Upon taking office, however, his government refused to implement the provisions of the 2015 Minsk Protocols—signed by Russia, Ukraine, France, Germany, and the EU—that essentially would have guaranteed Ukrainian sovereignty and territorial integrity in exchange for Ukrainian neutrality.

Now, sadly, Russia’s illegal actions will embolden the hawks and armament-mongers on all sides. Already, armchair strategists are calling for doubling the US military budget, to grasp the “strategic opportunity” to bleed Putin in Ukraine, while pushing the Europeans to build up their military forces.

Amid the drums of war, we should not lose sight of the human horror that will follow, the massive displacement, the impact of sanctions not only on Russians but also on citizens in Europe, the United States, and elsewhere.

De-escalation and negotiation are the only way out of this crisis.....These actions violate international law and fuel a dangerous escalation of violence

 
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Razoo

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War is a tragedy, a crime, and a defeat. The Nation condemns the decision of Russian President Vladimir Putin to abandon the path of diplomacy by attacking and undertaking “special military operations” in Ukraine. These actions violate international law and fuel a dangerous escalation of violence.

We urge all parties to immediately cease hostilities, de-escalate, and seek a diplomatic solution to mitigate the risk of full-scale war and an unthinkable direct conflict between the world’s two largest nuclear powers.

The Nation has consistently called on all parties to the crisis in Ukraine to seek resolution through diplomatic means, respecting international law and international borders. Putin’s actions are indefensible, but responsibility for this crisis is widely shared.

This magazine has warned repeatedly that the extension of NATO to Russia’s borders would inevitably produce a fierce reaction.

We have criticized NATO’s wholesale rejection of Russia’s security proposals.

We decry the arrogance that leads US officials to assert that we have the right to do what we wish across the world, even in areas, like Ukraine, that are far more important to others than they are to us.

 

Ug make hammer

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What's with quoting slabs of some article but not giving your own opinion?

Nothing here that couldn't have been posted in the Russia/Ukraine war thread.
We don't need a new thread for every opinion you found interesting!
 

Razoo

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War is a tragedy, a crime, and a defeat. The Nation condemns the decision of Russian President Vladimir Putin to abandon the path of diplomacy by attacking and undertaking “special military operations” in Ukraine. These actions violate international law and fuel a dangerous escalation of violence.

We urge all parties to immediately cease hostilities, de-escalate, and seek a diplomatic solution to mitigate the risk of full-scale war and an unthinkable direct conflict between the world’s two largest nuclear powers.

The Nation has consistently called on all parties to the crisis in Ukraine to seek resolution through diplomatic means, respecting international law and international borders. Putin’s actions are indefensible, but responsibility for this crisis is widely shared.

This magazine has warned repeatedly that the extension of NATO to Russia’s borders would inevitably produce a fierce reaction.

We have criticized NATO’s wholesale rejection of Russia’s security proposals.

We decry the arrogance that leads US officials to assert that we have the right to do what we wish across the world, even in areas, like Ukraine, that are far more important to others than they are to us.

This is and has been more in line with my thinking ....... for some time. Imperialism is not healthy. De-escalation and negotiation are the only way out of this crisis..
 

Razoo

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Mycroft

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This is and has been more in line with my thinking ....... for some time. Imperialism is not healthy. De-escalation and negotiation are the only way out of this crisis..
The problem here is that the globalists see an opportunity. "Never let a crisis go to waste."
 

RabidAlpaca

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NATO expansion provided the context for this crisis—a fact often ignored by our media. There is rank irrationality and irresponsibility in offering future NATO membership to Ukraine—when successive US presidents and our NATO allies have demonstrated that they do not have the slightest intention of fighting to defend Ukraine.

Instead, Putin’s demand that Ukraine remain outside of NATO—essentially that the status quo be codified—was scorned as violating NATO’s “principle” of admitting anyone it wanted.

One immediate result was to encourage parallel irresponsibility in Ukraine. President Volodymyr Zelensky promised voters when he ran for Ukraine’s presidency in 2019 that he would pursue a path to peace and end the war in the Donbas.

Upon taking office, however, his government refused to implement the provisions of the 2015 Minsk Protocols—signed by Russia, Ukraine, France, Germany, and the EU—that essentially would have guaranteed Ukrainian sovereignty and territorial integrity in exchange for Ukrainian neutrality.

Now, sadly, Russia’s illegal actions will embolden the hawks and armament-mongers on all sides. Already, armchair strategists are calling for doubling the US military budget, to grasp the “strategic opportunity” to bleed Putin in Ukraine, while pushing the Europeans to build up their military forces.

Amid the drums of war, we should not lose sight of the human horror that will follow, the massive displacement, the impact of sanctions not only on Russians but also on citizens in Europe, the United States, and elsewhere.

De-escalation and negotiation are the only way out of this crisis.....These actions violate international law and fuel a dangerous escalation of violence

This is blatant Russian propaganda. You're trying to shift the blame for the Russian invasion from Russia to the west for considering Ukraine’s self submitted bid to join NATO, which is a purely defensive alliance.

Ukraine joining a defensive alliance to secure its own territorial sovereignty is not a threat to Russian territorial sovereignty. You implying that it is, and that we forced them to invade is ridiculous. Russia should really find better trolls, you guys are doing a terrible job convincing anyone that Russia has a right to do this and that the west are the real villains.

This is and has been more in line with my thinking ....... for some time. Imperialism is not healthy. De-escalation and negotiation are the only way out of this crisis..
Funny considering you're literally defending Russian imperialism over Ukraine. Your attempt to call NATO imperialism is stupid and void of facts.
 

Binary_Digit

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NATO expansion provided the context for this crisis—a fact often ignored by our media.
Correction: Putin's false claims about NATO expansion and aggression provided the context.

What where Putin's examples of "NATO aggression" in his 2/24 speech?

- Kosovo, where NATO went in to stop ethnic cleansing.
- Libya, where NATO went in to stop crimes against humanity.
- Syria, where NATO and a half-dozen ME nations went in to prevent ISIS from taking over.
- Iraq, the only good example.

What are the examples of NATO expansionism? Estonia in 2010? Latvia and Lithuania in 2004? Or perhaps it was Ukraine's sudden and inexplicable interest in joining NATO after Crimea was stolen from them and Putin claimed repeatedly that the rest of Ukraine isn't a real country and historically belongs to Russia.

And are we expected to understand Putin's position under the assumption that NATO has been sweeping across eastern Europe, forcing nations to join, in a blood thirsty blitzkrieg? Because that's what it sounds like every time I hear someone try to blame NATO for what Putin is doing.
 

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War is a tragedy, a crime, and a defeat. The Nation condemns the decision of Russian President Vladimir Putin to abandon the path of diplomacy by attacking and undertaking “special military operations” in Ukraine. These actions violate international law and fuel a dangerous escalation of violence.

We urge all parties to immediately cease hostilities, de-escalate, and seek a diplomatic solution to mitigate the risk of full-scale war and an unthinkable direct conflict between the world’s two largest nuclear powers.

The Nation has consistently called on all parties to the crisis in Ukraine to seek resolution through diplomatic means, respecting international law and international borders. Putin’s actions are indefensible, but responsibility for this crisis is widely shared.

This magazine has warned repeatedly that the extension of NATO to Russia’s borders would inevitably produce a fierce reaction.

We have criticized NATO’s wholesale rejection of Russia’s security proposals.

We decry the arrogance that leads US officials to assert that we have the right to do what we wish across the world, even in areas, like Ukraine, that are far more important to others than they are to us.

Our government has 800 off shore military bases...... 500 of these need to be shut down if not 700.....

800 off shore military bases obviously is not working = Putin has proved such

One such base is underway in Poland .........

USA government must be presenting itself to attack Russia. Everybody in the world does not love our government. They like the people NOT the government.
 

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These actions violate international law and fuel a dangerous escalation of violence = We urge all parties to immediately cease hostilities .... = as the only answer. And shut down 500 of 800 off shore military bases​


Putin’s Invasion

De-escalation and negotiation are the only way out of this crisis.
www.thenation.com
www.thenation.com
 

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Our government has 800 off shore military bases...... 500 of these need to be shut down if not 700.....

800 off shore military bases obviously is not working = Putin has proved such

One such base is underway in Poland .........

USA government must be presenting itself to attack Russia. Everybody in the world does not love our government. They like the people NOT the government.
The US has economic interests all over the world to protect.

As well as US citizens and alliances. Are the countries where there are US bases complaining? I don’t hear them saying “get out”?

Russia can sit and spin if they don’t like it.

Nothing justifies invading Ukraine. To say otherwise is nonsense.
 

Razoo

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It is not our job to protect profiteers abroad = profiteers made the choice knowing the risks of relocating and/or investing abroad. As a taxpayer it is not my job to protect investors in other countries. Nor is it the responsibility of the military. Military lives are lost or disabled and for what?

Reckless use of tax dollars and soldiers.

I have never justified Putin behavior ............. he is a sick man.
 

BirdinHand

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It is not our job to protect profiteers abroad = profiteers made the choice knowing the risks of relocating and/or investing abroad. As a taxpayer it is not my job to protect investors in other countries. Nor is it the responsibility of the military. Military lives are lost or disabled and for what?

Reckless use of tax dollars and soldiers.
Considering American economy is completely reliant upon international trade…this isn’t about “profiteers”, it is about protecting American economy and supply chain.
 

Razoo

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Nonsense. We need USA jobs brought back to USA shores immediately. I do not want to support dictators abroad and certainly not a Fascist Chinese government with American dollars. Int'l trade can take place without America losing hugh numbers of jobs.


US corporations continue sending jobs abroad during pandemic​

https://www.theguardian.com › business › sep › us-corp...

Sep 12, 2020 — Despite Trump's claim that the era of offshoring US jobs is 'over', 37000 workers had their positions sent overseas in three months.

Fortune 500 Companies Hold a Record $2.6 Trillion Offshore​

https://itep.org › fortune-500-companies-hold-a-record-...


Mar 28, 2017 — All told, Fortune 500 corporations are avoiding up to $767 billion in U.S.federal income taxes by holding more than $2.6 trillion of “ ...

Since 2017, Hundreds of Thousands of American Jobs Were ...​

https://www.citizen.org › news › since-2017-hundreds-...

Sep 28, 2020 — Since 2017, General Motors closed U.S. plants and moved popular ... to offshore jobs, with a 21% corporate tax rate for income earned ...
 

BirdinHand

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Nonsense. We need USA jobs brought back to USA shores immediately. I do not want to support dictators abroad and certainly not a Fascist Chinese government with American dollars. Int'l trade can take place without America losing hugh numbers of jobs.

US corporations continue sending jobs abroad during pandemic

https://www.theguardian.com › business › sep › us-corp...
Sep 12, 2020 — Despite Trump's claim that the era of offshoring US jobs is 'over', 37000 workers had their positions sent overseas in three months.

Fortune 500 Companies Hold a Record $2.6 Trillion Offshore

https://itep.org › fortune-500-companies-hold-a-record-...

Mar 28, 2017 — All told, Fortune 500 corporations are avoiding up to $767 billion in U.S.federal income taxes by holding more than $2.6 trillion of “ ...

Since 2017, Hundreds of Thousands of American Jobs Were ...

https://www.citizen.org › news › since-2017-hundreds-...
Sep 28, 2020 — Since 2017, General Motors closed U.S. plants and moved popular ... to offshore jobs, with a 21% corporate tax rate for income earned ...
Good. Make it so having jobs in the US makes fiscal sense.
 

Razoo

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Having USA jobs in America instead of China is good for economic growth in America.

Putin murdering thousands if not millions is genocide in nature...... will he ever see prison? Of course not.
Politicians who initiate wars thus murders never pay for their actions. And they are never in the war zones
because it's too dangerous for them........like it is not dangerous for the soldiers???????
 
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