The World Hates America!

[RightinNYC]

So, I'm an American, and a newsflash for you, the Government never changes, it changes central-right-winged capitalist for central-left-winged capitalist

try introducing left-wing

I'm an american, and a newsflash for you, you've shown in many, many threads to have one of the poorest grasps of history I've ever seen.

You're saying that for 200 years, all we've done is be center-left capitalist or center-right capitalist? Well, we can all see how poorly that worked out, didn't it? The highest standard of living in history, the most advanced society the world has ever seen, and a country where even our most impoverished are doing better than the "middle class" in many countries. But yea, obviously, our forms of government aren't working.

And its around 280 million people.

 

[RightinNYC]

So you're 100% convinced, that every single person outside of the United States brushes their teeth?

This is the most incredibly off topic thing ever, but I just have to note: In this weeks' Time, there is a large section on China, and it had a "fun fact" that 500,000,000 people in rural china have never brushed their teeth.

hehehee

 

[GottaHurt]

Would that be why unemployment has fallen where I live?

Your rates have dropped?

And now that we have formed a union, we're no longer on the verge of collapse, and you're scared of that.

No, just the opposite.When the EU does collapse somehow it'll be blamed on the U.S. and we'll be the ones sending the aid, to clean the mess up

What a superficial nation.
And those who can't keep up due to accident, disability, illness, unemployment, sheer bad luck; they just fall by the wayside as you've no real welfare system to speak of. Nice.

Accident: Health Dept, Social Security and/or insurance covers this.
Disability:Health Dept, Medicare, Social Security and/or insurance covers this.
Illness:Health Dept, Medicare, Social Security and/or insurance covers this.
Unemployment:Health Dept, Unemployment benefits.
Sheer Bad Luck:Health Dept and charities, too numorous to list.

You forgot the ones who choose not to keep up, thay have the same services available to them based on their financial status.

Come and spend your money - it's all you're good for.

You weren't saying that when the Nazis were sipping coffee in Paris.Oh, you're probably not old enough to remember the atrocities, because Europe has known peace for the last 60 years, thanks to those Americans.

You're slaves to the capitalist system. You have to try to make money, and if you can't through no fault of your own you sink.

And yet millions of "slaves" immigrant here each year to be oppressed.

5 hours is alot extra to spend with your partner or your kids.

Yes indeed, you have plenty of time to explain to your offspring how wonderful unemployment is, and how sponging off the rest
of the working population is a wonderful thing.What happens when everyone decides to go on welfare?

You need to. There's no welfare. You actually help the government shirk it's reponsibilities.

No, we have Dept's of Social Services.The majority of us don't need it or want it.

You might get patched up in dire emergencies, but that's it.

Not true, every year thousands of crackheads pop out premature babies who get the best of care.
The same holds true for the uninsured who are victims of crimes/accidents and need medical care and rehab.
Those of us with insurance pay through higher insurance premiums, pennies on the dollar really.

You have neither quality health care nor preventive medecine from the state

Another lie.Both genders recieve free health care that includes preventative.A woman can go in and recieve pre natal care that includes milk, cheese and vitamin supplents, then can have her baby,
at a local hospital, for free, then recieve free medical attention for her and
her child(ren).

And your private system spends more per head

Because we pay for those that are irresponsible.

French hospitals repeatedly top international league tables

You mean morgue tables.As was the case in August '03 When France reached out to it's elderly
Oh yes, we saw how France took care of them when their children were on vacation.That must be a combined plan of health care, pensions and welfare benefits.

Kill off 15,000 of your elderly to free up some pension money, create more openings in the wealthfare system and relieve the healthcare ministry of some of the lesser "important citizens".

What's the "target date" for the next crop of recipients of your stellar system?

A state system available to all.

Stalin and Hitler said the same things.:wink:

You know that Medicare and Medicaid provide the bare minimum only.

As they are intended, we're not a welfare state.

And therein lies the difference between stupid US government, and the many European governments who have provided for their elderly.

Yes, we've seen the care that you've provided to your elderly.And yet you accuse us of being the stupid ones.

And by the way, it's "squalor" in English.

Duly noted, but then I've never known squalor, you seem to be versed in it, in two languages.

 

[Comrade Brian]

You're saying that for 200 years, all we've done is be center-left capitalist or center-right capitalist? Well, we can all see how poorly that worked out, didn't it? The highest standard of living in history, the most advanced society the world has ever seen, and a country where even our most impoverished are doing better than the "middle class" in many countries. But yea, obviously, our forms of government aren't working.

And its around 280 million people.

Yeah and if we're so great why are there millions of people in poverty here, and the standards should be raised quite a bit if all of us are so rich.

Our government spends too much plotting and taking down socialist countries, than actually helping their(and our own) people, compared to percentage W. Europe gives to the US, US lacks a lot, and america is the richest, so we could spare the most, and almost all of W. Europe is more socialist by quite a bit.

 

[RightinNYC]

Yeah and if we're so great why are there millions of people in poverty here, and the standards should be raised quite a bit if all of us are so rich.

Do you have ANY idea of relative wealth? "Poverty" here is equivalent to extreme wealth in many countries. In no society will poverty be eliminated, but the US has done a damn good job of it.

Our government spends too much plotting and taking down socialist countries, than actually helping their(and our own) people, compared to percentage W. Europe gives to the US, US lacks a lot, and america is the richest, so we could spare the most, and almost all of W. Europe is more socialist by quite a bit.

Do you even hear what you're saying? I can't understand it fully, but I think you're making the point that the capitalist US is richer than the socialist W Europe. If that's your point, thanks for taking care of it for me.

 

[Urethra Franklin]

Your rates have dropped?
.

From the 1950's no. From the late 1990's yes - and that was largely due to the policies of Jospin's socialist government.

No, just the opposite.When the EU does collapse somehow it'll be blamed on the U.S. and we'll be the ones sending the aid, to clean the mess up

.

No, save your energy. We'll never need you, and you'll want your resources to grab all that Saudi oil for yourself after Islamic extremeists have wreaked havoc with your supplies

Accident: Health Dept, Social Security and/or insurance covers this.
Disability:Health Dept, Medicare, Social Security and/or insurance covers this.
Illness:Health Dept, Medicare, Social Security and/or insurance covers this.
Unemployment:Health Dept, Unemployment benefits.
Sheer Bad Luck:Health Dept and charities, too numorous to list..

If you couldn't afford private insurance you have bare minimum state coverage and you fall into poverty.

You forgot the ones who choose not to keep up, thay have the same services available to them based on their financial status.
..

Many don't "choose" not to keep up. They're denied the opportunity by a capitalist system which tramples on them.

You weren't saying that when the Nazis were sipping coffee in Paris.Oh, you're probably not old enough to remember the atrocities, because Europe has known peace for the last 60 years, thanks to those Americans.
..

You came in late when your own Pearl Harbour was bombed.
And if you want to play the history card, thank the French for freeing you from British imperialism. Some of us live in the here and now.

And yet millions of "slaves" immigrant here each year to be oppressed.

..

They're often escaping poverty. They know they'll remain poor in the US but they hope their children will have a better chance. Rather that we helped the current generation out of poverty with International Socialism.

Yes indeed, you have plenty of time to explain to your offspring how wonderful unemployment is, and how sponging off the rest
of the working population is a wonderful thing.What happens when everyone decides to go on welfare? ..

You're obviously unaware of the stringent measures the unemployed have to fulifil in Europe to prove they're looking for and not refusing work, in order to get their benefits. Perhaps you're not smart enough to implement that in the US. Your assumption that claiming unemployment is sponging is an insult to genuine claimants.

You mean morgue tables.As was the case in August '03 When France reached out to it's elderly
Oh yes, we saw how France took care of them when their children were on vacation.That must be a combined plan of health care, pensions and welfare benefits.

Kill off 15,000 of your elderly to free up some pension money, create more openings in the wealthfare system and relieve the healthcare ministry of some of the lesser "important citizens".

What's the "target date" for the next crop of recipients of your stellar system?..

You make reference to a summer of freak weather conditions which took everybody by surprise. Night temperatures didn't fall and many eldery died overnight in their sleep, having been checked on by relatives/neighbours at bedtime. The extra resources made available since have been impressive, showing that people are prepared to accept that lessons need to be learned, since we've ****ed up our eco systems (thanks in large part to you United Statesians - biggest polluters of the planet) we can't eliminate the possiblility of another freak summer like that. That you would score a cheap plitical point out of those eldery people's tragic deaths says a lot about your personality.


.

Duly noted, but then I've never known squalor, you seem to be versed in it, in two languages.

I've never known it either, despite coming from a humble working class background and having once been unemployed. A well funded social welfare system saved me from that.

 

[GottaHurt]

From the 1950's no. From the late 1990's yes - and that was largely due to the policies of Jospin's socialist government.

Unemployment:France 1959 - 2004

Yes, Jospin has done a fine job indeed, as evident in the link above.The big drop from 10.5 to 9.8 is something to toast alright.

France's Population: 60,000,000
France's Unemployment: 6,000,000

United States Population: 280,000,000
United states Unemployment: 1,400,000

Let's see, we have 4.5 times the population of France, yet less than 0.33 the unemployment rate.

That socialism is really panning out for you.

No, save your energy. We'll never need you, and you'll want your resources to grab all that Saudi oil for yourself after Islamic extremeists have wreaked havoc with your supplies

You're so silly, like the rest of the world who believes our biggest oil supplier is the Middle East.Sorry, that International Press really spoonfeeds you the wrong info, time and time again.
Our largest suppliers are our neighbors to the north and south of us, Canada and Mexico.Nobody screams about
our greedy interests there though.The funny thing about the whole oil issue, is that France gets oil from Saudi Arabia too!
And for being the 22nd largest country in the world, Frances refineries
are the 4th largest oil producers in the world.

If you couldn't afford private insurance you have bare minimum state coverage and you fall into poverty.

Bare minimum coverage? It's free and it includes abortion and even cosmetic surgey.You keep trying to correlate poverty and health insurance.
We'll get to poverty in a minute though.

Many don't "choose" not to keep up. They're denied the opportunity by a capitalist system which tramples on them.

Wrong, they are afforded EVERY opportunity, they're just too lazy to pursue a better life.

They're often escaping poverty. They know they'll remain poor in the US but they hope their children will have a better chance. Rather that we helped the current generation out of poverty with International Socialism.

Yes, as the chart shows all those poor immigrants are toiling in poverty.Funny how Asian/Pacific Islanders top
the charts, followed by Non Hispanic (Middle Easteners) in median incomes.They're also at the top of the charts in obtaining college degrees.
Now, we'll examine the poverty level and it becomes apparent that your socialist propaganda is just that.
You substantiate nothing with your cheap talk.

You're obviously unaware of the stringent measures the unemployed have to fulifil in Europe to prove they're looking for and not refusing work, in order to get their benefits. Perhaps you're not smart enough to implement that in the US. Your assumption that claiming unemployment is sponging is an insult to genuine claimants.

Yes, I bet it's hard work filling out a form.

You make reference to a summer of freak weather conditions which took everybody by surprise. Night temperatures didn't fall and many eldery died overnight in their sleep, having been checked on by relatives/neighbours at bedtime. The extra resources made available since have been impressive, showing that people are prepared to accept that lessons need to be learned, since we've ****ed up our eco systems (thanks in large part to you United Statesians - biggest polluters of the planet) we can't eliminate the possiblility of another freak summer like that. That you would score a cheap plitical point out of those eldery people's tragic deaths says a lot about your personality.

Of course, whatever you say :roll:

I've never known it either, despite coming from a humble working class background and having once been unemployed. A well funded social welfare system saved me from that.

Then you might want to send a Thank You note to the other 54,000,000 of your countrymen who've supported you over the years.

 

[Urethra Franklin]

Unemployment:France 1959 - 2004

Yes, Jospin has done a fine job indeed, as evident in the link above.The big drop from 10.5 to 9.8 is something to toast alright.

France's Population: 60,000,000
France's Unemployment: 6,000,000

United States Population: 280,000,000
United states Unemployment: 1,400,000

Let's see, we have 4.5 times the population of France, yet less than 0.33 the unemployment rate..

I would answer as I answered Swinger in another thread:

But how are your statistics compiled, Do you, as in most European nations, include married women who don't work? Seasonal workers during their periods of inactivity? And how many of your employed are on insecure fixed term and temporary contracts? Or doing agency replacement work only with no security and no benefits?
In any case, the fact remains that unemployment only exists because it serves a useful purpose for capitalism - which doesn't want full employment. Capitalism relies on keeping a certain number of people in insecure employment and in unemployment: keep them on their toes and they won't cause trouble or ask too much if they fear for their jobs.
We have unemployment, like you, because we have capitalism, but at least our socialist governments, when they've been in power, have implemented measures which cushion the blow of unemployment more than if you live in the US.

That socialism is really panning out for you..

Glad you recognize it

are our neighbors to the north and south of us, Canada and Mexico.Nobody screams about
our greedy interests there though...

Because in neither case do you need to invade them or prop up a government which violates human rights, but you would if you had to.

The funny thing about the whole oil issue, is that France gets oil from Saudi Arabia too! ...

Find me the post where I said France didn't. You can't.

I believe we should all be criticizing the Saudi régime.

Wrong, they are afforded EVERY opportunity, they're just too lazy to pursue a better life....

Perhaps that's the way of doing things in the US.

Yes, as the chart shows all those poor immigrants are toiling in poverty.Funny how Asian/Pacific Islanders top
the charts, followed by Non Hispanic (Middle Easteners) in median incomes.They're also at the top of the charts in obtaining college degrees.
Now, we'll examine the poverty level and it becomes apparent that your socialist propaganda is just that.
You substantiate nothing with your cheap talk.....

Such anger. I suggest counselling.

Yes, I bet it's hard work filling out a form.
.....

What the **** are you rambling on about?

Then you might want to send a Thank You note to the other 54,000,000 of your countrymen who've supported you over the years.

I don't need to. I've willingly declared and paid my taxes in the many years I've been working. I contribute to a health service I'm lucky enough to not have to use due to good health - I think it's right that the sick and the needy benefit from my taxes and my good fortune. I contribute to schools I don't use as I have no kids. I think that's correct - the education of the next generation is our future. I contribute to local libraries and community projects I don't use - I think that's correct to promote literacy and culture amongst those who, unlike me, don't have alot of money to spare for their own books etc. The system was there for me when I needed it. Now I'm in well paid employment I willingly pay a high level of taxation for the public services France provides. I believe that's what makes us a civilized society. Your approach smacks of selfishness to me, and what's ironic is that so many United Statesians spout all that christian caring sharing garbage, but when they're asked to put it into practice it's "reduce my tax bill, let them suffer"
The word hypocrisy flies into my mind.

 

[GottaHurt]

I would answer as I answered Swinger in another thread:

But how are your statistics compiled, Do you, as in most European nations, include married women who don't work? Seasonal workers during their periods of inactivity? And how many of your employed are on insecure fixed term and temporary contracts? Or doing agency replacement work only with no security and no benefits?
In any case, the fact remains that unemployment only exists because it serves a useful purpose for capitalism - which doesn't want full employment. Capitalism relies on keeping a certain number of people in insecure employment and in unemployment: keep them on their toes and they won't cause trouble or ask too much if they fear for their jobs.
We have unemployment, like you, because we have capitalism, but at least our socialist governments, when they've been in power, have implemented measures which cushion the blow of unemployment more than if you live in the US.







Glad you recognize it




Because in neither case do you need to invade them or prop up a government which violates human rights, but you would if you had to.


Find me the post where I said France didn't. You can't.

I believe we should all be criticizing the Saudi régime.








Perhaps that's the way of doing things in the US.



Such anger. I suggest counselling.



What the **** are you rambling on about?





I don't need to. I've willingly declared and paid my taxes in the many years I've been working. I contribute to a health service I'm lucky enough to not have to use due to good health - I think it's right that the sick and the needy benefit from my taxes and my good fortune. I contribute to schools I don't use as I have no kids. I think that's correct - the education of the next generation is our future. I contribute to local libraries and community projects I don't use - I think that's correct to promote literacy and culture amongst those who, unlike me, don't have alot of money to spare for their own books etc. The system was there for me when I needed it. Now I'm in well paid employment I willingly pay a high level of taxation for the public services France provides. I believe that's what makes us a civilized society. Your approach smacks of selfishness to me, and what's ironic is that so many United Statesians spout all that christian caring sharing garbage, but when they're asked to put it into practice it's "reduce my tax bill, let them suffer"
The word hypocrisy flies into my mind.

Again, you substantiate none of your claims.You produce no sources, yet try and dismiss my post, when I provide sources.

You've got no game.

 

[Soviet_Guy]

The Whole of the Middle East isn't a nation, and, the Poll is "What is the most hated Nation in the World?" and you only listed 3, plus an entire region.

So seeing how your poll is about as valid as your posts, it was just easier to hijack your thread (which you can't do jacksh!t about) and go in a different direction.

North Korea and Iran have had very little world impact, and I associated the Whole of the Middle East as a Nation because it's made up of a whole bunch of small seemingly insignificant countries but put together have qiet a big world impact, now do you see?

 

[Fu_chick]

I still can't believe that this has gone on for 23 pages...

 

[Soviet_Guy]

Neither can I, most of my polls have a nack of getting so far out of hand for even me to reply to them at a pace of one post per 2 pages.

 

[Urethra Franklin]

Again, you substantiate none of your claims.You produce no sources, yet try and dismiss my post, when I provide sources..

You already provided the unemployment figures.

The French cannicule of 2003 and the measures put in place are well documented, though admittedly you didn't get accurate accounts on Faux News and CNN lies. I'd suggest you consult the websites of Libération or L'Humanité, but youy probably can't read French, so you'd be a little disabled.
If you want proof of the public services available in France I suggest you choose any town at random and visit the official website of that town's Mairie, but again, one assumes you'd be hampered by poor language skills.


Are you incacpable of putting forward a point of view without quoting a source? No thought or analysis of your own?

You've got no game.

No that's you, who is seemingly incacpable of replying to the points put forward in my last post.

Game set and match to Urethra.

 

[RightinNYC]

And just for reference, it is a well proven fact that, other than Kid Rock, republicans have absolutely no game. That's why they're so damn bitter and repressed, and they want to take it out on everyone else.

fool, i got hella game. you know how we do.

 

[Soviet_Guy]

Back to America...

 

[Soviet_Guy]

24 pages is pretty damn good though.

 

[Billo_Really]

Sovietguy is right (except it is Corporatism, not commercialism...which is basically incorporated in the former). The truth hurts. Especially when you lose your head over it (literally speaking). This is not the same country John Wayne would know.

Exporting our arrogance is what cause 9/11!

Impeaching Bush will prevent the next one. Of which, you can do at the link below.

http://www.veteransforpeace.org/impeachment/petition2.htm

 

[Pacridge]

Sovietguy is right (except it is Corporatism, not commercialism...which is basically incorporated in the former). The truth hurts. Especially when you lose your head over it (literally speaking). This is not the same country John Wayne would know.

Exporting our arrogance is what cause 9/11!

Impeaching Bush will prevent the next one. Of which, you can do at the link below.

http://www.veteransforpeace.org/impeachment/petition2.htm

That's a pretty simplistic view of the cause for 9-11, isn't it?

You think impeaching a sitting President is going to help our situation? Currently we're in the middle of a major situation. Tying the current administration up with an attempt to impeach isn't likely going to solve much, IMO.

 

[debate_junkie]

That's a pretty simplistic view of the cause for 9-11, isn't it?

You think impeaching a sitting President is going to help our situation? Currently we're in the middle of a major situation. Tying the current administration up with an attempt to impeach isn't likely going to solve much, IMO.

It won't solve anything, but give the enemy the upper hand because the administration's attentions would be turned away from them. Then who watches them? The UN? I think not.

Before we start throwing around the "impeach" word, let's remember one important thing. Disagreement with the President's policies is one thing. Requesting an impeachment implies he's a criminal, and thus far I've not seen anything that implicates that, other than opinion.

 

[Billo_Really]

Before we start throwing around the "impeach" word, let's remember one important thing. Disagreement with the President's policies is one thing. Requesting an impeachment implies he's a criminal, and thus far I've not seen anything that implicates that, other than opinion

You will never see anything until you LOOK!

What do you call someone who breaks the law? Starting a war without a declaration from Congress, is against the law!

Bush started the war in April 2002. Do the math!

 

[Billo_Really]

That's a pretty simplistic view of the cause for 9-11, isn't it?

Not when you consider that it manifests itself in many forms:

a) the thinking we can attack a country illegally and make up reasons why,
b) the thinking we are the greatest country on earth and can do no wrong,
c) the thinking we have the best form of society that should be duplicated
(as far as societies go, we are a baby on this planet. As opposed to
China, which has a 6000 year society. But we think we know whats
best because we have technology?)
d) the thinking that we can go around the world to soveriegn nations
and disrespect their religion.
e) the thinking that we can start a war against an ideology and justify
torture and incarceration without due process of law.

Look at the posts around you on this very message board and count how many defend actions by the US that are un-defendable to anyone else in the world! Then combine that with the hypocrisy that we made Bin Laden and Hussein. They were creations of our foriegn policy at one time. We were their ally's.

Not simple-minded at all.

 

[Thebestien]

I agree with billo: america biggest problem is that american are always sure to be right or to be the best. I think that what happenned with France during Iraq's war was quite a good example of this: Chirac (the french president: you knew it I hope) was only trying to help Bush:for Chirac Bush was wrong:he said it. But instead of listening to what Chirac had to say, Bush began to say: "Beware, Beware, the french are against us, they've forgotten us, we saved them during WW2 and now they're with the terrorits.. BOYCOTT FRANCE!". Why didn't he simply took time to argue with Chirac? Frenchies are too stupid to be listened to? The fact was Chirac was right after all since there were no WMD in Iraq, and all he was willing to do was to avoid a war and to maintain peace. France ain't no US enemy... I only have the feeling that Bush didn't even took time to ask himself "What if they were right? Maybe I'm going to invade a country with no reasons..."
But he didn't... He probably was too sure that America couldn't be wrong. Ever.

 

[guns_God_glory]

all he was willing to do was to avoid a war and to maintain peace.

Yeah rape killing of innocent civilians by a dictator who killed anyone who political opposed him. Sure sounds like peace.

Frenchies are too stupid to be listened to

Finally some since in all this.

 

[guns_God_glory]

It won't solve anything, but give the enemy the upper hand because the administration's attentions would be turned away from them. Then who watches them? The UN? I think not.

Before we start throwing around the "impeach" word, let's remember one important thing. Disagreement with the President's policies is one thing. Requesting an impeachment implies he's a criminal, and thus far I've not seen anything that implicates that, other than opinion.

Agreed. Impeachment would turn attention away from terrorists and the war. Besides don't waste your time republicans still dominate most of the courts, house, senate. Go ahead waste everyones time.

 

[Thebestien]

Yeah rape killing of innocent civilians by a dictator who killed anyone who political opposed him. Sure sounds like peace.

Of course it wasn't a better political regim before America invade Iraq, but what I was trying to show you is that Bush didn't even listened to what Chirac was saying.... He "knew" he was right, and the others, even if they were many of them, and if there were counties that knew war and occupation on their land.

By the way, how many regims like Sadam's one still exist? So why ain't Bush gonna attack them? Ho yeah, I forgott: no oil....
Moreover America put many dictators like Sadam in place in many countries by the past. And suddenly they started thinking "We should free thoses countries, and as soon as we can! No need to wait for the UN advice, we're americans, we can't be wrong!". Don't think so... It was more to be able to control more Iraq's oil.